Excess Advance ticket at station

[Haywain]

If bought elsewhere, other TOC, online, corporate etc then advance to advance has to go back to the retailer.

Thanks for the information. I can't see why there should be such a restriction, and there is no doubt that it removes rights from passengers, particularly those who have purchased an Advance ticket at a TOC ticket office operated by someone other than Virgin as they don't have an online or 'by phone' option.

 

[premier01]

Do we think there is anything that I can quote relating to passenger rights to impartial and open service? Clearly my complaint will be about the corporate policy that is highly inconvenient and been slipped in under the radar, rather than the VT ticket staff.

The first advisor shouldn't be working in customer facing roles, the second is very helpful but in any event my complaint needs to focus on the ridiculous new policy-cannot understand the rationale and VT will certainly lose a lot lf revenue from me for one.

 

[premier01]

Just briefly:

Avocet will do Advance to Advance if bought at a VT ticket office

It will do Advance to Walk Up regardless of where it was purchased

If bought elsewhere, other TOC, online, corporate etc then advance to advance has to go back to the retailer.

I can't say too much more and I can not say I support this change but unfortunately it has to be followed.

Is it physically possible to change/excess a non VT ticket office Advance to another Advance with the new system or does tge system flag/prevent the transaction?

How does the system or the staff know where the ticket was purchased from?

 

[Wallsendmag]

If it works the same way as Tribute does for refunds all sales go into a database

 

[Haywain]

How does the system or the staff know where the ticket was purchased from?

By reading the NLC code printed on the original ticket if it's bought at a station, or by observing the presence of a ToD reference if bought online.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

By reading the NLC code printed on the original ticket if it's bought at a station, or by observing the presence of a ToD reference if bought online.

I have never had a ticket which I have bought at a station actually accurately print the NLC code.

 

[Wallsendmag]

I have never had a ticket which I have bought at a station actually accurately print the NLC code.

Seriously?

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

Seriously?

Yes, seriously. Maybe it's just the stations I've visited - and to be fair, I rarely actually buy at the station - but I don't believe I've ever seen the station NLC in the ticket number.

 

[Haywain]

Yes, seriously. Maybe it's just the stations I've visited - and to be fair, I rarely actually buy at the station - but I don't believe I've ever seen the station NLC in the ticket number.

I think that's because you don't know where to find it. I don't think I have ever seen a ticket which doesn't show which station it was issued at, and I have seen many, many thousands of tickets over the years. As has my erstwhile colleague Wallsendmag.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

I think that's because you don't know where to find it. I don't think I have ever seen a ticket which doesn't show which station it was issued at, and I have seen many, many thousands of tickets over the years. As has my erstwhile colleague Wallsendmag.

No-where on the ticket have I seen the relevant four digit combination of numbers.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Bottom left hand line of the the top ticket last 4 digits is the selling location (7728). The issuing location is the line above along with the machine number (7086 and 6577)

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

View attachment 52664

Bottom left hand line of the the top ticket last 4 digits is the selling location (7728). The issuing location is the line above along with the machine number (7086 and 6577)

So where exactly on this ticket, purchased at Stafford ticket office, is 1268 (Stafford's NLC) shown?

 

[Wallsendmag]

I would say that Stafford Ticket Office’s NLC is 8972 , not all retail locations have the same NLC as the station hence 7086 is the Newcastle TVM location

 

[Haywain]

I would say that Stafford Ticket Office’s NLC is 8972

Or Stafford's TVM NLC is 8972 - TVMs always have different NLCs to the ticket office at the same station, as do secondary ticket offices where the two are operated by separate companies. For example, Stevenage has a GTR ticket office and an LNER Travel Centre (LNER are posh like that) and both companies have there own TVMs on the station. As a result a ticket purchased at Stevenage can have one of four NLCs printed on it.

 

[Wallsendmag]

The line of numbers in the middle right of the ticket is the 4 digit machine number the 4 digit NLC and the 2 digit window number

 

[janb]

I would say that Stafford Ticket Office’s NLC is 8972 , not all retail locations have the same NLC as the station hence 7086 is the Newcastle TVM location

Yep, on the NLC finder on iKB, 8972 is listed as "Stafford Tribute".

 

[142blue]

Is it physically possible to change/excess a non VT ticket office Advance to another Advance with the new system or does tge system flag/prevent the transaction?

How does the system or the staff know where the ticket was purchased from?

As mentioned if we weren't sure then we would check the NLC

The new process of doing advance to advance is different. In the past if your ticket for tomorrow wasn't needed but you wanted similar next week then I'd look for the nearest fare and change it accordingly

Now we refund the original ticket. Sold by VT ticket office we search for ticket number then take a few details. Then we rebook you a new advance so in effect we refund the original and take off £10. That's what we have then towards the cost of a new advance ticket so then we sell you another advance deducting that figure.

Hope that explains it

 

[bb21]

I must say I would be very alarmed if a ticket did not have the correct NLC on it. That would send all alarm bells ringing.

Unfortunately a large number of NLCs are not in any publicly available datafeed, as they are either used by various third-party retailers or "pseudo-locations" as described by Haywain (so not tied into the one for the physical station), but they should in theory all be listed in the Knowledgebase.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Just to say as a Station Agent I get commission on Excess Fare Sales. So some poor sod whose company have bought them an AP off trainline on a train in 3 hours time who rolls up and asks can I change this as there meetings already finished are usually a bonus sale for us so to speak. So there's no financial reason I know of why Virgin wouldn't accept Excess for bought elsewhere in fact the opposite.

 

[142blue]

Change to walk up no issue.

 

[district]

On Star to change an Advance to Advance we book the new advance (adding the £10 fee through “View Availability” where appropriate) then non issue the old advance through Fares Finder > Show/Hide Invalid fares. This is the only time we can “non issue” after an hour.

To change an Advance to a walkup we find the advance in Fares Finder > Show/Hide Invalid Fares then excess it, adding the £10 fee as a manual supplement where appropriate.

 

[janb]

On Star to change an Advance to Advance we book the new advance (adding the £10 fee through “View Availability” where appropriate) then non issue the old advance through Fares Finder > Show/Hide Invalid fares. This is the only time we can “non issue” after an hour.

To change an Advance to a walkup we find the advance in Fares Finder > Show/Hide Invalid Fares then excess it, adding the £10 fee as a manual supplement where appropriate.

Instructions clearly vary by TOC. As a STAR user for a different TOC, for Advance to Advance we use the cleaner method of "ticket reservations and supplements only" in Journey Planner, combined with an excess using the method you describe.

 

[Wallsendmag]

On Tribute you set up the new fare and put in the amount paid for the original simples

 

[premier01]

As mentioned if we weren't sure then we would check the NLC

The new process of doing advance to advance is different. In the past if your ticket for tomorrow wasn't needed but you wanted similar next week then I'd look for the nearest fare and change it accordingly

Now we refund the original ticket. Sold by VT ticket office we search for ticket number then take a few details. Then we rebook you a new advance so in effect we refund the original and take off £10. That's what we have then towards the cost of a new advance ticket so then we sell you another advance deducting that figure.

Hope that explains it

Thanks for the insight...makes sense now that effectively the original ticket is refunded and a new ticket issued.

I would have thought there was a system in place for simple refunds to check where the ticket was purchased from so guess this is the process used now for changes to Advance tickets.

Unfortunately the process causes a massive inconvenience for some travellers now so I intend to complain and take this as far as I can, effectively travellers are now denied access to what effetcively was a national sales system where you could do more or less any transaction at any NR station.

 

[premier01]

Change to walk up no issue.

That's something as often have cause to do this with travel plans changing.

Though there will still be lost revenue for those wanting Advance to Advance changes.

 

[premier01]

On Tribute you set up the new fare and put in the amount paid for the original simples

Sounds ideal... any stations in Lancashire which operate this system, guessing not VT- Avocet? and Northern- Star? Not sure any other TOCs run stations here.

 

[Wallsendmag]

As Far as I know Tribute users are WMT, GN and LNER also C2C if they haven’t swapped to their new system yet.

 

[causton]

On Tribute you set up the new fare and put in the amount paid for the original simples

WMT is the same (we are still using Tribute until March IIRC). Regarding your earlier comment about refunds we don't even do them through Tribute on a database, all on a paper form still, non-issue or the good old red/green duplicate forms!

 

[Wallsendmag]

We don’t use AS Refunds yet either. Just exploring the possibilities at the moment.

 

[district]

Instructions clearly vary by TOC. As a STAR user for a different TOC, for Advance to Advance we use the cleaner method of "ticket reservations and supplements only" in Journey Planner, combined with an excess using the method you describe.

Thats interesting - avoids a non issue!