Fake Railcard

[Jamie54]

One of my friends has edited a picture of my digital railcard and put a picture of himself over the picture of me. When the staff member scans it, does it show the photo on the screen? Will i get in trouble? As my name is on the railcard ‍♂️

 

[Bucksman]

When the member of staff scans it will come up with holders name and account/ card number.

 

[Merseysider]

And assuming all railcards have the same security features as mine, if it’s looked at for more than a nanosecond it’ll be clear from the not-moving colours that it’s a fake, which could lead to your friend’s details being taken, prosecutions department getting involved, etc.

 

[skyhigh]

Digital railcards must be shown in the app, screenshots are not acceptable - so the fact it's a fake will be easily spotted. Your friend will likely get into trouble (they could easily be prosecuted under the more serious Regulation of Railways Act as faking a railcard shows a clear intent to avoid payment of the fare due), but as the original railcard is linked to you I wouldn't be surprised if you get asked how someone else was using a screenshot of yours...

Letting someone else have a screenshot of your railcard for this purpose is a very silly idea for both of you.

 

[Deafdoggie]

One of my friends has edited a picture of my digital railcard and put a picture of himself over the picture of me. When the staff member scans it, does it show the photo on the screen? Will i get in trouble? As my name is on the railcard ‍♂️

The railcard must be shown in the app, so showing an image will set alarm bells ringing straight away.
They may get away with, maybe even a few times. However, the penalties when caught really don't make it worth the risk at all.
When they are caught, almost certainly you'll be asked how they came to have the image abs your involvement in it.

 

[ANDREW_D_WEBB]

Maybe an idea to report this “friend” to the Police? Whilst they may not do much about it, you would get a crime reference number to show to any investigation team which would help show you were not happy with the situation.

 

[skyhigh]

Maybe an idea to report this “friend” to the Police? Whilst they may not do much about it, you would get a crime reference number to show to any investigation team which would help show you were not happy with the situation.

What crime would you report to the police, if the OP has willingly shared a screenshot of their railcard and is now having second thoughts about it ? I'm pretty sure they wouldn't take any interest at all.

 

[matt_world2004]

I'm pretty impressed at the hoops people will jump through for a 33% discount on a single or return ticket.

 

[najaB]

What crime would you report to the police, if the OP has willingly shared a screenshot of their railcard and is now having second thoughts about it ?

That presumes that (a) the OP knew that the friend was taking the screenshot; and (b) what they intended to do with it. Hand me your unlocked phone and I can get a screenshot of any non-protected app onto my phone in under 20 seconds.

 

[madjack]

The Railcard app doesn't allow screenshots.

 

[najaB]

The Railcard app doesn't allow screenshots.

That complicates matters somewhat. So either it's a photo of the screen (which will be picked up as a fake in an instant), the OP has a rooted phone or they were complicit in obtaining the image since it would require significantly more time and effort to obtain.

 

[robbeech]

E

I'm pretty impressed at the hoops people will jump through for a 33% discount on a single or return ticket.

Especially if it’s a railcard they’re eligible to have themselves by paying a small fee.

 

[RPI]

If caught you could both potentially be prosecuted under the fraud act, Google it if you want to see the possible outcome.

 

[najaB]

If caught you could both potentially be prosecuted under the fraud act, Google it if you want to see the possible outcome.

And if the TOC/RDG went down that route they'd have a pretty much open and shut case. To quote The Fraud Act (2006):

Fraud by false representation​

(1)A person is in breach of this section if he—

(a)dishonestly makes a false representation, and

(b)intends, by making the representation—

(i)to make a gain for himself or another, or

(ii)to cause loss to another or to expose another to a risk of loss.

(2)A representation is false if—

(a)it is untrue or misleading, and

(b)the person making it knows that it is, or might be, untrue or misleading.

All the necessary conditions are met for your friend to be charged. And as for yourself, the Act says:

Making or supplying articles for use in frauds​

(1)A person is guilty of an offence if he makes, adapts, supplies or offers to supply any article—

(a)knowing that it is designed or adapted for use in the course of or in connection with fraud, or

(b)intending it to be used to commit, or assist in the commission of, fraud.

 

[cjohnson]

The Railcard app doesn't allow screenshots.

In my experience (iOS version), it does allow you to take/save a screenshot but shows a warning message telling you in no uncertain terms a screenshot is not valid, and the Railcard is only valid when displayed from within the app.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If the OP willingly shared this screenshot or in any way allowed it to happen, it might be worth the £30 to buy the friend a real one so they won't attempt use of the copy!

 

[Western Sunset]

Get rid of your "friend"! Otherwise it'll all end up in tears; maybe expensive ones for the both of you.

 

[WesternLancer]

One of my friends has edited a picture of my digital railcard and put a picture of himself over the picture of me. When the staff member scans it, does it show the photo on the screen? Will i get in trouble? As my name is on the railcard ‍♂️

I'd get yourself out of this ASAP - you are not many steps away from a potential criminal charge - unless you can proove to a prosecutor that the card was taken without your knowledge and this fraud carried out by a person who knows you (as opposed to stole the card from you) and had access to the card (eg a housemate for example in a shared house).

 

[furlong]

Instruct your friend in writing to destroy all copies immediately and to give you a signed declaration that (s)he has done so? You could get help from a solicitor regarding good wording to use and how much more to state.

 

[mike57]

Just checked on an android phone and a stock phone (S21 running Android 11) will not allow a screenshot. You get a message 'Screenshot not allowed due security policy' This could be circumvented but is not straightforwards, it would involve rooting the phone and changing things that are not normally accessable. This in turn would render the 'It was done without my knowledge' defence somewhat suspect. If you do manage to get a good screenshot the the issue is the colour changing BR arrows in the bottom left, static colour here is an immediate clue that a screenshot is being shown rather than the real app.

You need to have a serious 'discussion' with your friend and tell him that if he continues to use it you will make sure he gets into trouble, and will 'hang him out to dry'

Reading the FAQ on the railcard app the card can be 'blocked' if suspicious activity is detected, maybe this is your way forward, get the card blocked and reissued with a new QR code, when your friend uses his fake one he will then be immediately busted as it will show as invalid.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It doesn't do a new QR if you unassign it from your device and reassign it, does it?

 

[mike57]

It doesn't do a new QR if you unassign it from your device and reassign it, does it?

I don't know, and Im not prepared to mess about again, when I changed my phone the reassignment to the new phone was a 'nail biting' process. I was thinking more of contacting the rail card people and explaining at least part of the situation, and asking them to block it and reassign it with a new QR code. At least if you did that you would have a defence that when you became aware of the situation you did something to try and stop it when Plod turns up on your doorstep asking difficult questions. (And keep a record of conversations, preferably use a chat window if they have one rather than a phone call, or use email.)

 

[Haywain]

Reading the FAQ on the railcard app the card can be 'blocked' if suspicious activity is detected, maybe this is your way forward, get the card blocked and reissued with a new QR code, when your friend uses his fake one he will then be immediately busted as it will show as invalid.

I wonder how often the QR codes in railcard apps are scanned? It may be something of an empty threat.

 

[SteveM70]

Maybe I’m being cynical, but this sounds to me like the OP has had an idea and is road testing it

 

[najaB]

Maybe I’m being cynical, but this sounds to me like the OP has had an idea and is road testing it

If so, hopefully the fact that they'll be liable to a fraud prosecution has made them think twice. Twelve months in prison is a high price to pay in order to save £30 on a railcard!

 

[Vespa]

Not much of a friend who is willing to use your railcard to commit fraud.

You have two options really.
Get rid and report to the police to cover yourself or risk being prosecuted under joint enterprise as if you both have conspired to commit fraud which is very serious.

 

[kristiang85]

If the OP willingly shared this screenshot or in any way allowed it to happen, it might be worth the £30 to buy the friend a real one so they won't attempt use of the copy!

Yes, I was going to suggest this. Extricate yourself from this scheme as soon as possible.

I wonder how often the QR codes in railcard apps are scanned? It may be something of an empty threat.

I find with railcard tickets, the checker only asks about 50% of the time generally to see the railcard, and of that I've never had the code scanned.


But £30 vs the penalty for both of you for committing fraud is a no brainer really - when you see what people get for innocent ticketing mistakes, just imagine the problems you could face for being bang to rights for faking a railcard.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not only the penalty, but fraud is considered to be one of the worse offences to have against your name (other than the likes of murder, rape etc), because it essentially proves you cannot be trusted. This would cause all manner of problems in later life, with employment, volunteering, personal relationships, travel (certainly to the US) and all sorts. It is a much more serious offence than a simple fare evasion one where it's mostly a case of coughing up the fine and not doing it again.

£30 to buy your friend a present, as it were, seems a cheap way to avoid the problem, if the OP doesn't trust them enough not to use it if told not to.

People worry about a Byelaw/RoRA charge ruining their life, and mostly it won't. A fraud charge, by contrast, almost certainly will at least to some extent.

 

[Watershed]

and of that I've never had the code scanned.

I imagine having a Railcard which is clearly genuine (as shown by the moving colours) means you're unlikely to have the code scanned. It's much more likely to be scanned if the colours are static, as that's a dead giveaway that it's a screenshot and hence not valid (potentially a fake).

Twelve months in prison is a high price to pay in order to save £30 on a railcard!

I daresay there's no chance whatsoever of getting twelve months in prison, and little chance of a prison sentence at all, for using or producing a fraudulent Railcard.

A 'back of the fag packet' calculation using the Sentencing Guidelines indicates that a fraud of this nature would likely constitute a category 5 offence with medium culpability, meaning the starting point for sentencing (which assumes a loss of £2500) would be a medium level community order.

Of course, having a conviction for fraud, even if the sentence is not unduly harsh, is still liable to cause difficulties in many areas of daily life.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I daresay there's no chance whatsoever of getting twelve months in prison, and little chance of a prison sentence at all, for using or producing a fraudulent Railcard.

Even so you'd be paying for a fraud charge for the rest of your life. Want a bank account? Your options are limited. Want a job? Why should we trust him, no chance. DBS check? That's not going to end well.

It's hardly murder, but it's definitely something that it is worth spending considerable sums of money to avoid any chance of. £30 seems rather cheap.