Fare Dispute

[OpalStar]

Hi all,

I’m reaching out for some guidance regarding a fare dispute I’m currently facing. I’m honestly feeling mortified and ashamed about the situation. I want to be as open and detailed as possible so I can get the best advice — but please, I’d really appreciate it if you could avoid judgment, as I’ve already been hard on myself. Here are the main details:

• Journey details:
  • Start station: Kenley
  • End station: Charing Cross
  • Changed from a Southern service to a Southeastern service at London Bridge

• Ticket info:
  • I’ve been purchasing short tickets only for the final Southeastern leg
  • I have been buying these tickets 2-3 times a week over the last 12–18 months

• Encounter with railway staff:
  • I was stopped at the barriers by Southeastern Revenue Protection
  • A witness statement was taken — I was honest, polite, and provided my address and ID when asked

• Documentation:
  • I have not yet received any letter but am expecting one soon

I know this looks bad, and it’s a pattern of behaviour I am ashamed of. But I’m past the tears and I really just want to be prepared and focused on the next steps, I’ve read about others in similar situations avoiding court by arranging out-of-court settlements. I really need to avoid a criminal record. I’m the sole earner in my household and am prepared to do whatever it takes to pay any fines or charges necessary.

My main question is about what happens given that it was Southeastern who stopped me, but I actually held a valid ticket for their part of the journey. I’ve seen conflicting information about whether rail companies share information with each other. Ideally, Southeastern would just issue an admin charge since I paid for their leg. Worst case, they involve Southern and it escalates into a fraud case. I understand they are more interested in recouping losses than taking people to court.

I already have a draft settlement appeal letter and will share any documents as soon as I receive them.

Thank you so much in advance for any advice or support.

 

[fandroid]

Welcome to the forum.
As you say you were honest, I assume you admitted to travelling from Kenley. Yes, Southeastern will deal with the failure to buy a ticket for the whole journey. It's very likely that they will check your purchasing history (assuming that you bought online) and you can expect a demand for a large sum of money to cover your whole period of short-faring.

Others will be on to help you obtain the best outcome for yourself, but you need to accept that, at best, this is going to cost you a lot.

In some ways it's surprising that you weren't caught earlier, as the railway companies are always suspicious of "proper" tickets being used on short journeys in central London. They expect genuine short-distance passengers to use contactless or Oyster.

 

[OpalStar]

Welcome to the forum.
As you say you were honest, I assume you admitted to travelling from Kenley. Yes, Southeastern will deal with the failure to buy a ticket for the whole journey. It's very likely that they will check your purchasing history (assuming that you bought online) and you can expect a demand for a large sum of money to cover your whole period if short-faring.

Others will be on to help you obtain the best outcome for yourself, but you need to accept that, at best, this is going to cost you a lot.

Okay this is good to know that they are unlikely to get southern involved. Can they recoup lost revenue from other TOCs? Or will they be doing it on southerns behalf?

Regardless I’m expecting a 2-3k bill and am prepared for that.

Also I have purchased a season ticket the same day so hopefully this demonstrates that I am committed to change/ have learnt my lesson.

 

[AlterEgo]

Okay this is good to know that they are unlikely to get southern involved. Can they recoup lost revenue from other TOCs? Or will they be doing it on southerns behalf?

Do they know you start your journey from Kenley? (Either by admission or by implication - for example if your address is in Kenley)

Southeastern will collect the full value of the fares from Kenley. Train companies have an agreement where they prosecute and recoup losses on behalf of one another.

 

[OpalStar]

Do they know you start your journey from Kenley? (Either by admission or by implication - for example if your address is in Kenley)

Southeastern will collect the full value of the fares from Kenley. Train companies have an agreement where they prosecute and recoup losses on behalf of one another.

Yes southeastern know my journeys are too and from Kenley (omission and address). I guess in one way this is easier because I won’t have 2 TOCS on my back.

Do you suspect they will allow me to settle the unpaid fares outside of court even if we are looking at thousands of pounds? I have read that southeastern are fairly good at being open to settlement, especially if you work with them and respond to their letters etc…

 

[notmyrealname]

Yes, we've seen people settle for figures into the thousands.

 

[Haywain]

Do you suspect they will allow me to settle the unpaid fares outside of court even if we are looking at thousands of pounds?

Yes, it is highly likely.

 

[OpalStar]

Yes, we've seen people settle for figures into the thousands.

Okay everything I’m reading feels like positive news in terms of avoiding court- you guys on this forum do such great work.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Wednesday at 16:14 ==

Yes, we've seen people settle for figures into the thousands.

okay I’ve been back through my ticket purchase history and the total value of all the short fared trips is £1720 (at peak times) so I’m expecting this plus the administration fee. I can handle that. I feel better now I know what the number is and now that I’ve found a few posts on this forum of people being offered settlements of a similar size or bigger - thanks for your help!

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

As long as you co-oiperate with Southeastern and haven't come to their attention before then they will usually offer an out of court settlement. You'll see lots of threads in this section of the forum involve Southeastern.

When the letter from Southeastern arrives, post a redacted copy of it in this thread along with your draft reply and forum members will proof read it for you and help to get the wording right to help you in obtaining a favourable outcome.

 

[OpalStar]

Welcome to the forum!

As long as you co-oiperate with Southeastern and haven't come to their attention before then they will usually offer an out of court settlement. You'll see lots of threads in this section of the forum involve Southeastern.

When the letter from Southeastern arrives, post a redacted copy of it in this thread along with your draft reply and forum members will proof read it for you and help to get the wording right to help you in obtaining a favourable outcome.

Thanks @Hadders - I will do just that. I’m an idiot but I’m willing to pay for the mistakes that I have made. You guys do great work helping people like me out on this forum - thank you all.