First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)

[83G/84D]

37153 is actually in Bridgwater Volvo. Seen there today.

That might explain why one of the E400 open top conversions stopped off at the First depot in the town.

 

[richw]

Won't make much of a difference, just a different bus and operator, will even be the same colour

Has been the same under TfC as it was with Kernow, same time and number of people generally and that won't change again

The only difference will be the actual customers who’ve been left out of pocket by refusing Valid First Kernow tickets in the evening, or TfC selling return tickets on the early morning one knowing they don’t offer a return journey until the evening.
As per page 3 of the TfC timetable they should accept Kernow tickets where Kernow are the main operator but Kernow Don’t accept TfC tickets

 

[Bill Badger]

The only difference will be the actual customers who’ve been left out of pocket by refusing Valid First Kernow tickets in the evening, or TfC selling return tickets on the early morning one knowing they don’t offer a return journey until the evening.
As per page 3 of the TfC timetable they should accept Kernow tickets where Kernow are the main operator but Kernow Don’t accept TfC tickets

Absolutely.

Means I will probably start catching the bus again to Redruth rather than driving if I can now get back.

 

[richw]

Absolutely.

Means I will probably start catching the bus again to Redruth rather than driving if I can now get back.

I’m pretty sure you aren’t the only one. With TfC failing to stick to the contract on ticket acceptance and even worded in their own timetable book I imagine it will be stopping people travelling outwards during the day if they are unsure on being accepted to get home In the evening.

 

[MB162435]

The only difference will be the actual customers who’ve been left out of pocket by refusing Valid First Kernow tickets in the evening, or TfC selling return tickets on the early morning one knowing they don’t offer a return journey until the evening.
As per page 3 of the TfC timetable they should accept Kernow tickets where Kernow are the main operator but Kernow Don’t accept TfC tickets

Not a problem I've encountered, all the drivers have accepted mine and I've been catching late night T1s five or six times a week no problem, every company is going to have a few staff who don't understand the rules

The real problem isn't some TfC drivers not accepting Kernow tickets, which even if it does happen you have evidence that it is allowed, but Kernow not accepting TfC tickets at all, that's the issue people should be focussing on and needs to be addressed

 

[carlberry]

The real problem isn't some TfC drivers not accepting Kernow tickets, which even if it does happen you have evidence that it is allowed, but Kernow not accepting TfC tickets at all, that's the issue people should be focussing on and needs to be addressed

Why would they? Without TfC wants to agree a rate for their acceptance it's not in Kernow's intrest, especially as (going by TfC publicity) Kernow buses don't even exist.

 

[Goldfish62]

Why would they? Without TfC wants to agree a rate for their acceptance it's not in Kernow's intrest, especially as (going by TfC publicity) Kernow buses don't even exist.

While these tot-for-tat spats between the operators continue it's the public that suffers.

I'd lock representatives from the council, GSW and FK in a room together and not let them out until they've agreed on integrated timetable publicity, mutual return ticket acceptance and all-bus day and period ticketing. This is all basic stuff!

 

[carlberry]

While these tot-for-tat spats between the operators continue it's the public that suffers.

I'd lock representatives from the council, GSW and FK in a room together and not let them out until they've agreed on integrated timetable publicity, mutual return ticket acceptance and all-bus day and period ticketing. This is all basic stuff!

In reality there's only one group that's in the room; the council themselves.

They specify the publicity, they control the bus stops, they specify and control the contracted network. All they have to do (if they want to) is agree a rate of reimbursement for FK to accept other TfC tickets. It's all within their power (as they had the extended powers under the buses legislation and they have the extra money.

GSW just have to make sure their drivers understand ticket acceptance, I suspect they can move on to that now as they appear to have the issues from the early days more under control (vehicle damage, fuel etc).

 

[Goldfish62]

In reality there's only one group that's in the room; the council themselves.

They specify the publicity, they control the bus stops, they specify and control the contracted network. All they have to do (if they want to) is agree a rate of reimbursement for FK to accept other TfC tickets. It's all within their power (as they had the extended powers under the buses legislation and they have the extra money.

GSW just have to make sure their drivers understand ticket acceptance, I suspect they can move on to that now as they appear to have the issues from the early days more under control (vehicle damage, fuel etc).

That's not enough.

FK operate the commercial network, which CC has no control over so need to be party to any agreement. You can't have an all-bus period ticket without FK's agreement, nor inclusion of TfC journeys on FK's timetables. The agreements also need to be applicable to any future GSW commercial services.

So, all parties need to be in agreement.

 

[Whiteway215]

I see 37165 has been reported as having left FHD's workshop so may be on its way to Kernow.

 

[Bill Badger]

Not a problem I've encountered, all the drivers have accepted mine and I've been catching late night T1s five or six times a week no problem, every company is going to have a few staff who don't understand the rules

The problem I had is they won't accept the FK bundles which is the main ticket I use.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

That's not enough.

FK operate the commercial network, which CC has no control over so need to be party to any agreement. You can't have an all-bus period ticket without FK's agreement, nor inclusion of TfC journeys on FK's timetables. The agreements also need to be applicable to any future GSW commercial services.

So, all parties need to be in agreement.

This sort of thing should have been sorted as part of the tender process.

I may have missed something but FK are now to be operating what were the TfC journeys on the Tinners? Is this commercially or on tender? If the latter, have these been removed from TfC - have they surrendered them or had them taken from them?

 

[MB162435]

Was surprised Kernow was retaking the early morning and late night Tinners, I regularly catch the last T1 to Truro, 5 has been the largest number of passengers so far so isn't a lucrative service and would be surprised if it was going to be done by Kernow commercially

So far haven't had any problems personally or have heard of any, buses always turn up on time so was surprised it was one of the first to go back to Kernow

 

[richw]

The real problem isn't some TfC drivers not accepting Kernow tickets, which even if it does happen you have evidence that it is allowed, but Kernow not accepting TfC tickets at all, that's the issue people should be focussing on and needs to be addressed

Kernow is a commercial operator and unless the council or Go Ahead agree a compensation package with FK it will never happen. I’ve had it on good authority neither of those organisations have made any form of contact with FK to discuss the matter.

 

[MB162435]

Why would they? Without TfC wants to agree a rate for their acceptance it's not in Kernow's intrest, especially as (going by TfC publicity) Kernow buses don't even exist.

Kernow is mentioned in the TfC book but just a sentence saying 'Additional services are operated by First Kernow, please see their timetable for more information' on Kernow's daytime commercial services

But yes Kernow have no reason to accept TfC tickets and unlikely to occur anytime soon, and will only happen if all parties are forced into a Brexit like negotiations

Kernow is a commercial operator and unless the council or Go Ahead agree a compensation package with FK it will never happen. I’ve had it on good authority neither of those organisations have made any form of contact with FK to discuss the matter.

But that's no reason for Kernow not to approach them, but as you say unless it makes financial sense to Kernow it won't happen as it makes no difference to them

Just the northern section of the 87 affected at the moment isn't it, from Holywell Bay onwards can't think of any other parts of routes operated by TfC in the daytime and Kernow in the evening

 

[richw]

But that's no reason for Kernow not to approach them, but as you say unless it makes financial sense to Kernow it won't happen as it makes no difference to them

Just the northern section of the 87 affected at the moment isn't it, from Holywell Bay onwards can't think of any other parts of routes operated by TfC in the daytime and Kernow in the evening

Why would first make contact on something that is of very little benefit to themselves? It is a matter for CC/PCB to initiate.

Where the first 27 is run by TfC they keep selling return tickets That have no use until late evening. Encountered a chap the other afternoon in Roche returning to Bodmin, he’d been sold a return on the sole morning run from Bodmin. I said sorry not valid, he asked when the next TfC to Bodmin and I looked up for him and it was about 2100 from Roche to Bodmin.

 

[charlie1284]

53801, 53826 and 53704 are all on the M6 at the moment. Anyone know why there is three buses on the M6 when FK only require 2 buses to operate the every 30 min service?

Also 32554 is on the A1.

 

[Goldfish62]

Why would first make contact on something that is of very little benefit to themselves? It is a matter for CC/PCB to initiate.

Where the first 27 is run by TfC they keep selling return tickets That have no use until late evening. Encountered a chap the other afternoon in Roche returning to Bodmin, he’d been sold a return on the sole morning run from Bodmin. I said sorry not valid, he asked when the next TfC to Bodmin and I looked up for him and it was about 2100 from Roche to Bodmin.

This bloke has been inconvenienced. He'll probably travel by bus less as a result. That's FK's loss as well as TfC's.

 

[richw]

53801, 53826 and 53704 are all on the M6 at the moment. Anyone know why there is three buses on the M6 when FK only require 2 buses to operate the every 30 min service?

Also 32554 is on the A1.

Both the pz bound buses are considerably late. Possibly the next service from pz took a spare bus instead of running late

 

[Goldfish62]

Kernow is a commercial operator and unless the council or Go Ahead agree a compensation package with FK it will never happen. I’ve had it on good authority neither of those organisations have made any form of contact with FK to discuss the matter.

I can quite believe that given the ineptitude of the council so far.

They specify the publicity, they control the bus stops, they specify and control the contracted network. All they have to do (if they want to) is agree a rate of reimbursement for FK to accept other TfC tickets. It's all within their power (as they had the extended powers under the buses legislation and they have the extra money.

They don't even need the extended powers. This has all been standard practice at some local authorities for years. It's basic stuff.

Both the pz bound buses are considerably late. Possibly the next service from pz took a spare bus instead of running late

It appears Mousehole is flooded. Buses turning at Roskilly.

 

[MB162435]

Why would first make contact on something that is of very little benefit to themselves? It is a matter for CC/PCB to initiate.

Where the first 27 is run by TfC they keep selling return tickets That have no use until late evening. Encountered a chap the other afternoon in Roche returning to Bodmin, he’d been sold a return on the sole morning run from Bodmin. I said sorry not valid, he asked when the next TfC to Bodmin and I looked up for him and it was about 2100 from Roche to Bodmin.

To help out their customers and to put people before profit maybe for once?

If someone asks for a return then a driver is likely to issue what has been asked for, although they query it of course knowing Kernow will be doing the rest until the evening to make sure the customer knows

 

[richw]

To help out their customers and to put people before profit maybe for once?

Are you aware the main purpose of a business is to generate profit for shareholders?

 

[83G/84D]

66847 ex South Yorkshire is currently in Camborne.

 

[MB162435]

Are you aware the main purpose of a business is to generate profit for shareholders?

And you do know who I work for, that will probably answer your question

But as you've said before Kernow has achieved that anyway especially with Hinckley, so anything they can do to make their customers life easier should be encouraged, but unfortunately isn't a big enough issue to be addressed at the moment

 

[Goldfish62]

66847 ex South Yorkshire is currently in Camborne.

Was that expected?

 

[Whiteway215]

Was that expected?

Earlier this week it was quoted on the South Yorkshire Transport Forum that 66847 was leaving Doncaster for Worcester as a swap for 66820.
Took a wrong turning???!!!

 

[83G/84D]

Was that expected?

Not that I was aware.

Earlier this week it was quoted on the South Yorkshire Transport Forum that 66847 was leaving Doncaster for Worcester as a swap for 66820.
Took a wrong turning???!!!

Photo added, definately not taken in Worcester.

 

[Busaholic]

53801, 53826 and 53704 are all on the M6 at the moment. Anyone know why there is three buses on the M6 when FK only require 2 buses to operate the every 30 min service?

Also 32554 is on the A1.

Think I may have an answer (of sorts) to that - driving up past Jack Daniels Estate at about 1 p.m. passed an oos M6 Solo that had been Pz bound with passengers on pavement and driver standing in front of bus on mobile: no obvious signs of an accident so either breakdown or passenger incident, I'd imagine. Next bus would probably have been a 5 - interesting to see if passengers picked up for free (at least one wasn't elderly).

Speaking of flooding, Fore Street in Goldsithney was back to its pre-flood works state this morning.

 

[swifty]

Earlier this week it was quoted on the South Yorkshire Transport Forum that 66847 was leaving Doncaster for Worcester as a swap for 66820.
Took a wrong turning???!!!

66820 was due to Cornwall after engine work in Worcester. It was swapped with 66847, presumably because 820 is fuschia fronted and wouldn’t need paint for ‘Doncaster’s Clever Buses’.

 

[Whiteway215]

66820 was due to Cornwall after engine work in Worcester. It was swapped with 66847, presumably because 820 is fuschia fronted and wouldn’t need paint for ‘Doncaster’s Clever Buses’.

The SY Forum said it was to do with the liveries.