Fish and chips.......too pricey

[Harpo]

Vegetarians wouldn't be happy with their chips cooked in lard!

Lard’s a pork product which comes with other issues. Isn’t beef dripping the traditional fat for fish & chips? (I remember beef dripping sandwiches at my grandparents’ home.)

 

[takno]

Lard’s a pork product which comes with other issues. Isn’t beef dripping the traditional fat for fish & chips? (I remember beef dripping sandwiches at my grandparents’ home.)

Yes, I meant beef dripping/tallow. Actual lard would have been an odd choice. I've got a feeling the chippy in the black country museum still uses it, but I think it might even have died out in Yorkshire for normal chippies.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 3 Sep 2024 ==

Fish and chip shops are usually independent businesses and they simply don't have the same economies of scale. The average local chippy won't have the benefit of central buying that the fast-food chains have. Fish is expensive anyway, but the price of tatties has also increased:

https://www.itv.com/news/2024-02-22/why-are-potatoes-more-expensive-at-the-moment

I was rather saddened to read that one of my local chippies is about to close soon:

Northern Fish Restaurant owner makes 'heartbreaking' decision to close much-loved 101-year-old Elgin takeaway

Michael Miele, 70, says his advancing years mean he can no longer continue running the popular fish and chip shop.

www.pressandjournal.co.uk

While the article doesn't mention anything about increasing prices, the fact that there is a lack of a buyer for the business says it all. I used to go there for a bag of chips on the way home from various evening activities. It was literally just around the corner from what was the bus station and on a cold night it was a nice place to gain some warmth before waiting out in the cold before the bus arrived!

I don't know if they ever tried to get on the delivery bandwagon, but perhaps that could have driven sales a bit more.


As far as I'm aware, McDonald's hasn't used animal fats for years. When I worked there some 30 years ago, the "shortening" that was used was vegetable-based

It's not a profitable business, the number of customers falls every year, and owners kids are less and less keen to take over the family business, with its long hours and constantly smelling of chippie. My local one closed down over lockdown because the landlord wouldn't cut them a break on rent, they were old enough to retire, and their son was barely even willing to go in the shop.

There was a good article in the Guardian a couple of years ago where they went out on the potato rounds in northeast Scotland and talked to the people still running them.

(On McDonald's btw, I'm getting it from a history of the whole chain. I think they moved away from it like 60 years ago, quite possibly before they came to the UK)

 

[simonw]

There are several now in each city quadrant but http://www.thebritishchippy.com/ is one run by some expats since 2003. There has been one much longer called halibut house north of downtown which is one of those places you never knew about unless going down Edmonton trail and get stuck at a traffic light!

Back visiting the UK, I seemed to find the portions got bigger for the rough same cost the further north of London for non chain places.

Thanks for the info. Halibut house would have been our local I guess, we lived in crescent hights.

 

[dangie]

Vegetarians wouldn't be happy with their chips cooked in lard!

I know that nostalgia isn’t what it used to be, and quite often things which we thought were better years ago aren’t, but do chip shop chips taste different, for better or worse, nowadays than back in the days before vegetarian diets became popular? When I was a lad back in the 1950’s I haven’t a clue what they were cooked in.

Note: This is NOT having a pop at vegetarians.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Yes, I meant beef dripping/tallow. Actual lard would have been an odd choice. I've got a feeling the chippy in the black country museum still uses it, but I think it might even have died out in Yorkshire for normal chippies.

There’s a Facebook group called the fish and chips appreciation society. If you look at their page (you don’t seem to have to apply to join) and put “beef dripping” in the search box it shows quite a few chips shops still frying in beef drip

 

[Spamcan81]

Fish and chip shops are usually independent businesses and they simply don't have the same economies of scale. The average local chippy won't have the benefit of central buying that the fast-food chains have. Fish is expensive anyway, but the price of tatties has also increased:

https://www.itv.com/news/2024-02-22/why-are-potatoes-more-expensive-at-the-moment

I was rather saddened to read that one of my local chippies is about to close soon:

Northern Fish Restaurant owner makes 'heartbreaking' decision to close much-loved 101-year-old Elgin takeaway

Michael Miele, 70, says his advancing years mean he can no longer continue running the popular fish and chip shop.

www.pressandjournal.co.uk

While the article doesn't mention anything about increasing prices, the fact that there is a lack of a buyer for the business says it all. I used to go there for a bag of chips on the way home from various evening activities. It was literally just around the corner from what was the bus station and on a cold night it was a nice place to gain some warmth before waiting out in the cold before the bus arrived!

I don't know if they ever tried to get on the delivery bandwagon, but perhaps that could have driven sales a bit more.


As far as I'm aware, McDonald's hasn't used animal fats for years. When I worked there some 30 years ago, the "shortening" that was used was vegetable-based

The delivery bandwagon is a double edged sword. It may attract new custom but equally people can turn from collecting their meal to having it delivered so no gain there. There’s also the expense. To do it in house probably means hiring another member of staff and then there’s the cost of a delivery vehicle. To use a delivery service incurs their delivery charges and they can be quite high b

 

[theblackwatch]

The best Fish and Chips are generally at those traditional village/suburb shops, you can always spot them

They will only serve fish and chips, you can’t order a pizza, or a Chinese, the only curry on offer will be curry sauce. All their focus is on making the best fish and chips (and battered sausage etc)

They will have limited opening hours, based on the traditional meal items people would want fish and chips. You wouldn’t be able to buy a fish on a Monday, or at 3pm on any day as that’s neither lunch time nor tea time

On a Friday night people will be queuing up, often out into the street in all weathers. Associated with this, they are probably not on Just Eat etc.

The cashier will be a formidable woman who has unwritten rules where you have to make yourself known from back in the queue if you want something unusual, or stand in a certain place, or push in if you only want chips. They will only have started accepting cards during COVID

I like that. You forgot to add, she will know what "one of each" is too, unlike places (and down south) which look at you cluelessly!

 

[takno]

I like that. You forgot to add, she will know what "one of each" is too, unlike places (and down south) which look at you cluelessly!

To be fair I've never heard of "one of each", and I've used a lot of chippies in the south, the north and Scotland.

 

[SuspectUsual]

The delivery bandwagon is a double edged sword. It may attract new custom but equally people can turn from collecting their meal to having it delivered so no gain there. There’s also the expense. To do it in house probably means hiring another member of staff and then there’s the cost of a delivery vehicle. To use a delivery service incurs their delivery charges and they can be quite high b

I think delivery is especially bad for fish and chips, which really benefit from being eaten asap, whereas stuff like curry doesn't

 

[takno]

I think delivery is especially bad for fish and chips, which really benefit from being eaten asap, whereas stuff like curry doesn't

Definitely agree with this. You can even just about crisp up fries from a kebab shop if they've gone too long, but short of re-frying them there's no way back for soggy chip shop chips.

Mind you, I've given up on pretty much all delivery. It doesn't seem worth it between the cost, the annoying illegal bikes, the newspaper reports of Deliveroo drivers living in shanty towns on the edge of Bristol, and the fact that it always seems to arrive late and cold.

 

[GusB]

There was a good article in the Guardian a couple of years ago where they went out on the potato rounds in northeast Scotland and talked to the people still running them.

I suspect this is the article that you referred to:

A funeral for fish and chips: why are Britain’s chippies disappearing?

The long read: Plenty of people will tell you the East Neuk of Fife in Scotland is the best place in the world to eat fish and chips. So what happens when its chippies – and chippies across the UK – start to close?

www.theguardian.com

One summer ago, before the region’s fish and chip industry was shaken by closures, before a death that was hard for people to bear, a lorry heaped with the first fresh potatoes of the season drove along the east coast of Scotland. This lorry wound its way along the East Neuk of Fife, dodging washing lines, mooring bollards and seagulls, parking with impunity to make deliveries. There was an understanding in the East Neuk that nobody would ever get angry and honk at the inbound “tattie” lorry, fish and chips being a staple meal, vital to the region’s economy. Tourists come shocking distances to sit on old harbour walls and stab around in takeaway trays with wooden forks. The fish and chips sold in the East Neuk might be the best in the British Isles and because of that (it follows) the best on the planet. Even so, by July 2022, local friers were finding it harder and harder to balance their books.

The driver of the tattie lorry, a red-cheeked Scotsman named Richard Murray, carried keys for most of the businesses on his route, to save from waking any tired friers who’d been up late the night before, poring anxiously over their sums. War in Ukraine coupled with ongoing complications from Brexit had driven up prices of almost all the goods that fish and chip shops depended on, from live ingredients to oil and salt to packaging. More distressing was the problem of rising energy costs. This meal is prepared using a great guzzler of a range cooker that must be kept on and roiling at all hours of a trading day. As the price of gas and electricity threatened to double, then triple, through 2022, friers were opening their energy bills with gritted teeth. A trade association called the National Federation of Fish Friers said that as many as a third of the UK’s 10,500 shops might go dark, warning of a potential “extinction event”.

It was about 8am when Murray drove his tattie lorry into a village called Pittenweem. He was met on the road by Alec Wyse, a skilled frier, 59 years old and known as Eck, who ran a takeaway called the Pittenweem Fish Bar. The tiny shop had been bought by Wyse’s father using money from the sale of a family fishing boat. There were nautical portraits on the walls. A peg-letter menu listed eight unchanging menu items, one of which was described in its entirety as “FISH”. Working together, Wyse and Murray unloaded sacks of potatoes from the lorry, carrying them inside on their shoulders.

I haven't quoted the full article, but it's well worth spending a few minutes to read it in its entirety.

 

[takno]

I suspect this is the article that you referred to:

A funeral for fish and chips: why are Britain’s chippies disappearing?

The long read: Plenty of people will tell you the East Neuk of Fife in Scotland is the best place in the world to eat fish and chips. So what happens when its chippies – and chippies across the UK – start to close?

www.theguardian.com

I haven't quoted the full article, but it's well worth spending a few minutes to read it in its entirety.

That's the one, although apparently I've transplanted deepest Fife into the northeast in my mind. It's a lovely read even if a bit depressing.

 

[theblackwatch]

To be fair I've never heard of "one of each", and I've used a lot of chippies in the south, the north and Scotland.

Or one of each twice and a fish? There's even a chippy near Malton called 'One Of Each'... https://www.facebook.com/p/One-of-Each-Fish-and-Chips-61552036622433/

Definitely agree with this. You can even just about crisp up fries from a kebab shop if they've gone too long, but short of re-frying them there's no way back for soggy chip shop chips.

Mind you, I've given up on pretty much all delivery. It doesn't seem worth it between the cost, the annoying illegal bikes, the newspaper reports of Deliveroo drivers living in shanty towns on the edge of Bristol, and the fact that it always seems to arrive late and cold.

On that I would agree... the idea of having fish and chips delivered which have been wrapped up for 20+ minutes and are just going cold. Mind, I must be the only person in the country who has never had a takeaway delivered to my house. I did however, during Covid, have one of my local pubs deliver some beer to my door!

 

[westv]

Or one of each twice and a fish? There's even a chippy near Malton called 'One Of Each'... https://www.facebook.com/p/One-of-Each-Fish-and-Chips-61552036622433/


On that I would agree... the idea of having fish and chips delivered which have been wrapped up for 20+ minutes and are just going cold. Mind, I must be the only person in the country who has never had a takeaway delivered to my house. I did however, during Covid, have one of my local pubs deliver some beer to my door!

We've had f&c delivered on a number of occasions but have never had one that's cold.

 

[1D54]

The best Fish and Chips are generally at those traditional village/suburb shops, you can always spot them

They will only serve fish and chips, you can’t order a pizza, or a Chinese, the only curry on offer will be curry sauce. All their focus is on making the best fish and chips (and battered sausage etc)

They will have limited opening hours, based on the traditional meal items people would want fish and chips. You wouldn’t be able to buy a fish on a Monday, or at 3pm on any day as that’s neither lunch time nor tea time

On a Friday night people will be queuing up, often out into the street in all weathers. Associated with this, they are probably not on Just Eat etc.

The cashier will be a formidable woman who has unwritten rules where you have to make yourself known from back in the queue if you want something unusual, or stand in a certain place, or push in if you only want chips. They will only have started accepting cards during COVID

Absolutely 100% agree with this. Would it be a fair to say that a majority of these wonderful establishments are in the North of England apart from the ones on the coast? There are certainly non to be found in my part of the Midlands anymore.

 

[Spamcan81]

I like that. You forgot to add, she will know what "one of each" is too, unlike places (and down south) which look at you cluelessly!

The language of fish and chips is subject to regional variations. In Scotland it’s a supper whatever time of day it is. In some parts of the country we have fish cakes while elsewhere they are just cakes. Got caught out by that many years ago in Bradford when I ordered a fish cake and chips and received a fish, a cake and some chips. There will be many other examples.

 

[takno]

Absolutely 100% agree with this. Would it be a fair to say that a majority of these wonderful establishments are in the North of England apart from the ones on the coast? There are certainly non to be found in my part of the Midlands anymore.

I always found those kinds of shops in Leeds infuriating. They might have been open around traditional family tea times for the working classes, but honestly if you're selling hot food and you're shut by 6 then you might as well not exist for me. Anybody who didn't leave work by 5 or had any kind of commute wasn't served at all. I honestly didn't think my local chippy was still in business for the first year in one place.

Chippy in particular was something we used to get because we got back late and didn't have time to cook when I was a kid. The chippies where I come from in the midlands may have sold kebabs as well, but they made decent food, didn't treat the customers like a personal inconvenience and stayed open until at least 8 or 9.

 

[Spamcan81]

I suspect this is the article that you referred to:

A funeral for fish and chips: why are Britain’s chippies disappearing?

The long read: Plenty of people will tell you the East Neuk of Fife in Scotland is the best place in the world to eat fish and chips. So what happens when its chippies – and chippies across the UK – start to close?

www.theguardian.com

I haven't quoted the full article, but it's well worth spending a few minutes to read it in its entirety.

A fair helping of romanticism and urban myth in there but a lot of that rings true. I was the fourth generation to work in and eventually run the business. It was a way of life.

 

[dangie]

Absolutely 100% agree with this. Would it be a fair to say that a majority of these wonderful establishments are in the North of England apart from the ones on the coast? There are certainly non to be found in my part of the Midlands anymore.

Couple of weeks ago wife & I were in Northumberland. Had fish & chips from Neptunes Fish & Chip Restaurant in Seahouses. We’d heard they were good, but good was an understatement. Absolutely fabulous. Wonderful chips and paper thin batter on the fish. We had one helping between us and it was plenty. Thoroughly recommend it.

Agree with the Midlands comment. Fish & chips from our local F&C shop are tasteless.

 

[BanburyBlue]

Slightly off topic - but are there any traditional fish and chip shops in the centre of Birmingham? I've been working here 2 years and haven't found one yet.

 

[takno]

Slightly off topic - but are there any traditional fish and chip shops in the centre of Birmingham? I've been working here 2 years and haven't found one yet.

I was about to recommend one and then realised I haven't been to it for 25 years, so it might not be there anymore

 

[D6130]

have been an odd choice. I've got a feeling the chippy in the black country museum still uses it, but I think it might even have died out in Yorkshire for normal chippies.

There are plenty of fish & chip shops in Yorkshire still frying in beef dripping....including the three main ones in Skipton and the one in the centre of Hebden Bridge. As a vegetarian, on the rare occasions that I want takeaway chips I'll go to the Chinese takeaway across the road.

 

[SuspectUsual]

There are plenty of fish & chip shops in Yorkshire still frying in beef dripping....including the three main ones in Skipton and the one in the centre of Hebden Bridge. As a vegetarian, on the rare occasions that I want takeaway chips I'll go to the Chinese takeaway across the road.

Ah, the Hiu Man, allegedly named after one of the main ingredients of their food

 

[philthetube]

Just found something on line which said fish and chips cost 17p in 1974. Taking into account average wages etc fish and chips has doubled in price since 1974. But apparently it cost 4d (2p) in 1952, even cheaper then.

In 197I was paying 1/9d approx. 8p so serious inflation 1970-74.

Definitely agree with this. You can even just about crisp up fries from a kebab shop if they've gone too long, but short of re-frying them there's no way back for soggy chip shop chips.

Mind you, I've given up on pretty much all delivery. It doesn't seem worth it between the cost, the annoying illegal bikes, the newspaper reports of Deliveroo drivers living in shanty towns on the edge of Bristol, and the fact that it always seems to arrive late and cold.

Chip shop chips crisp up really well in an air fryer, I read it somewhere and tried it, it surprised me how good they were.

 

[BanburyBlue]

I was about to recommend one and then realised I haven't been to it for 25 years, so it might not be there anymore

I thought I found one in Newtown the other day, but looks like that is now the ubiquitous burger/pizza/fried chicken places.

 

[theblackwatch]

Absolutely 100% agree with this. Would it be a fair to say that a majority of these wonderful establishments are in the North of England apart from the ones on the coast? There are certainly non to be found in my part of the Midlands anymore.

Some on the coast I've been to at various places - particularly on sea front - have been what I'd describe as pretty ropey. There are some which are well-known brands and quality, but others I think can provide sub0-standard stuff as they aren't after repeat business, most who go being families on a day trip to the beach. The best places tend to be the ones the locals use in my opinion. And others have said, a proper chippy rather than one that also sells pizzas, kebabs, burgers etc.

The language of fish and chips is subject to regional variations. In Scotland it’s a supper whatever time of day it is. In some parts of the country we have fish cakes while elsewhere they are just cakes. Got caught out by that many years ago in Bradford when I ordered a fish cake and chips and received a fish, a cake and some chips. There will be many other examples.

Yes, the Scots seem to refer to a fish supper. I'm not sure what it comprises though - is it just fish and chips, or does mushy peas or something else come with it too?

Incidentally, I'm from Yorkshire, and a cake is a sweet thing which may have icing on it.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Yes, the Scots seem to refer to a fish supper. I'm not sure what it comprises though - is it just fish and chips, or does mushy peas or something else come with it too?

Believe "fish supper" is just fish (usually haddock) with a portion of chips, when ordered at most chip shops North of the Border. Mushy peas, if available, would normally be extra. A "special fish supper" has breadcrumbed fish.

 

[Spamcan81]

Some on the coast I've been to at various places - particularly on sea front - have been what I'd describe as pretty ropey. There are some which are well-known brands and quality, but others I think can provide sub0-standard stuff as they aren't after repeat business, most who go being families on a day trip to the beach. The best places tend to be the ones the locals use in my opinion. And others have said, a proper chippy rather than one that also sells pizzas, kebabs, burgers etc.

Yes, the Scots seem to refer to a fish supper. I'm not sure what it comprises though - is it just fish and chips, or does mushy peas or something else come with it too?

Incidentally, I'm from Yorkshire, and a cake is a sweet thing which may have icing on it.

Had a few Scots regulars in my Bedfordshire chippy. Some had mushy peas/pickled eggs or whatever as add ons and others would have just fish and chips. Almost all would want haddock.

 

[dangie]

Vegetarians wouldn't be happy with their chips cooked in lard!

Apart from chips, what else could a vegetarian eat from a traditional Fish & Chip shop? Just a thought.

 

[Spamcan81]

Some on the coast I've been to at various places - particularly on sea front - have been what I'd describe as pretty ropey. There are some which are well-known brands and quality, but others I think can provide sub0-standard stuff as they aren't after repeat business, most who go being families on a day trip to the beach. The best places tend to be the ones the locals use in my opinion. And others have said, a proper chippy rather than one that also sells pizzas, kebabs, burgers etc.

Yes, the Scots seem to refer to a fish supper. I'm not sure what it comprises though - is it just fish and chips, or does mushy peas or something else come with it too?

Incidentally, I'm from Yorkshire, and a cake is a sweet thing which may have icing on it.

The fish + cake + chips scenario was in a Wibsey chippy back in 1963. And after the misunderstanding hand been sorted, I looked at the menu and sure enough it was listed as cake rather than fish cake.

Apart from chips, what else could a vegetarian eat from a traditional Fish & Chip shop? Just a thought.

Mushy peas, baked beans, pickled onions, pickled gherkins, onion rings and veggie burgers in the chippy I ran.