Go North East

[Snex]

What does this mean for GNE?

Washington depot has been hit and miss the last few years

If you're one of the engineers who was expected to go with the vehicles from Chester Le Street to maintain them at Washington.

If you're passing the Volvo depot every day on the way then it might become very attractive since you feel unvalued by GNE.

I'm sure you'll be very attractive to Volvo aswell if you have experience especially working on Volvo vehicles in the past which GNE have/had.

 

[Megafuss]

It appears engineering woes have moved from Consett to Washington, where it was already bubbling in the background.

An hour gap on the X1 yesterday, only plugged with a Euro 5 Citaro.

Multiple 29, X1 and 4 services binned today. Not good enough to get to this state.

 

[DanNCL]

It appears engineering woes have moved from Consett to Washington, where it was already bubbling in the background.

An hour gap on the X1 yesterday, only plugged with a Euro 5 Citaro.

Multiple 29, X1 and 4 services binned today. Not good enough to get to this state.

In addition there’s been a Euro 5 Citaro on the 28/29 today as well as more cancellations on the 34, almost a daily occurrence now.

At least they’re now paying the fee for the Euro 5 Citaros to cross the Tyne.

 

[HC1998]

An hour gap on the X1 yesterday, only plugged with a Euro 5 Citaro.

This is more common than you think

 

[jkkne]

Strike action looming

What a mess

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2pr46d23jo

 

[Tetchytyke]

Strike action looming

What a mess

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2pr46d23jo

Interesting how they've wheeled out Nigel Featham this time.

Shame he's pretty much confirmed what Unite said: that these "briefings" are there to make sure the driver gets the blame if anything goes wrong.

You may as well stick a fork in them. They're done.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Interesting how they've wheeled out Nigel Featham this time.

Shame he's pretty much confirmed what Unite said: that these "briefings" are there to make sure the driver gets the blame if anything goes wrong.

You may as well stick a fork in them. They're done.

For balance - here's another take.

Why do any businesses undertake training and then ask staff to confirm that they have received it?

Quite simply, if someone is negligent then, guess what, they might be inclined to suggest that they hadn't been informed even if they had been. Also, if there is an incident, then how does the company prove that they haven't been negligent and that they have adequately trained their staff?

 

[Tetchytyke]

Why do any businesses undertake training and then ask staff to confirm that they have received it?

Quite simply, if someone is negligent then, guess what, they might be inclined to suggest that they hadn't been informed even if they had been.

I completely agree. Nothing unusual about signing for attendance at a training course.

But the union don’t start threatening strike action over something that is supposedly routine and above board unless that thing is not, in fact, routine and above board.

The timing is interesting too, coming not long after someone at GNE started whistleblowing to the BBC about deficient maintenance.

Yet again with GNE, the reaction is more telling than anything else.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I completely agree. Nothing unusual about signing for attendance at a training course.

But the union don’t start threatening strike action over something that is supposedly routine and above board unless that thing is not, in fact, routine and above board.

The timing is interesting too, coming not long after someone at GNE started whistleblowing to the BBC about deficient maintenance.

Yet again with GNE, the reaction is more telling than anything else.

There's clearly a very poor relationship between Unite (and its members) and Go North East. That much is true. The truth of this is probably not as black and white as the union are suggesting BUT that it's happening is symptomatic of very poor IR issues that are continuing even after the bitterness of the dispute.

It probably needs a grounded old lag of a manager to come in locally and draw the poison from the relationship, as well as getting the day to day operations sorted.

 

[jkkne]

Yes when you look at how EY have handled the public and internal comms so much better than their sister company you wonder why?

Then you look at the childish comms during the last strike, the childish marketing and it’s clearly a place where no highly rated comms or marketing person would dream of going to.

I mean this line alone…

Recently, we introduced safety briefings for drivers to reinforce best practices, for example to ensure that double deck buses are not driven on routes with low bridges in case it leads to bridge strikes"

 

[Snex]

There's clearly a very poor relationship between Unite (and its members) and Go North East. That much is true. The truth of this is probably not as black and white as the union are suggesting BUT that it's happening is symptomatic of very poor IR issues that are continuing even after the bitterness of the dispute.

It probably needs a grounded old lag of a manager to come in locally and draw the poison from the relationship, as well as getting the day to day operations sorted.

The issues are above local management imo and are coming from the top. The fleet is getting on badly and there isn't enough engineers to fix them with the added boot that the wage is below the going rate so no-one wants the jobs.

Whoever is in charge is going to struggle to deal with those issues as it's all stemming from lack of investment. When Arriva has bought more buses locally, in recent times, then you're doing something very poorly as that bar can't be any lower.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

It made Monday evening's regional TV news. Strike action looming over maintenance issues. Having had to sign for having attended the briefing drivers are saying that the laid down procedure is being ignored by GNE ie drivers report faults to control only to be told to carry on. Allegedly warning indicators are being taped over to prevent drivers reporting faults at all. A couple of drivers suspended for standing their ground too often. Surely a senior head or two will have to roll before there's any chance of improving IR.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The truth of this is probably not as black and white as the union are suggesting BUT that it's happening is symptomatic of very poor IR issues that are continuing even after the bitterness of the dispute.

It probably needs a grounded old lag of a manager to come in locally and draw the poison from the relationship, as well as getting the day to day operations sorted.

I can certainly see that the poison in the relationship will cloud judgements, with the poison leading the union to be a lot quicker in assuming that something is underhand or nefarious.

But actually, I have a sneaky feeling the union are right to perceive this as underhand or nefarious. It's clear from the union reaction that they didn't know these briefings were coming and it's clear from the union reaction that they weren't involved in the wording.

For Featham to then come out and say it's nothing to worry about, it's just to remind drivers not to drive their bus into a bridge, well. I honestly can't decide if that's bone-headed or him being deliberately incendiary.

Nigel Featham has presided over mass walk-outs at every single operator he's ever been involved in:
Warrington Buses in 2003,
Arriva Yorkshire in 2016,
Arriva North East in 2019,
Go North West in 2020, and
Go North East in 2023.

That's quite the track record.

Given all those mass walk-outs were characterised by Featham characterising his staff as being "greedy", I think it's fair to assume both the policy and the media comments were him being deliberately incendiary. It certainly fits in with the evidence from throughout his career.

 

[HC1998]

Any more strike news?

 

[Steddenm]

Go North East have announced that they are withdrawing their The Key smartcard online portal but you'll still be able to purchase tickets on the phone:

Key customer portal is closing

From 26 May 2025, our Key customer portal will be closed.

www.gonortheast.co.uk

From 26 May 2025, our Key customer portal will be closed. After that date, it will still be possible to buy tickets on the Key smartcard over the phone from our Customer Services team and on the bus from the driver, but unfortunately we will no longer be able to offer subscription tickets on Key smartcard.

From the same date, we will no longer issue new Key smartcards except for customers who wish to use one for SmartZone tickets.

Why are we closing it?
Launched in 2011, the Key smartcard was groundbreaking at the time by allowing Go North East customers to buy and manage their ticket sales online for the first time. However, rapid development in ticketing technology means that smartphone app ticketing is now the most popular way for people to buy their bus tickets, having already overtaken Key smartcard before the pandemic. This means it’s now no longer economical for us to keep the Key customer portal running for the very small number of tickets that continue to be bought in this way.

Can I continue to buy a monthly ticket on Key smartcard?
Yes – you will still be able to buy a 28-day ticket to add to your Key smartcard, but after the 26 May you will need to call our Customer Services team to do this. They can be contacted on 0191 420 5050, Monday to Friday between 9am and 5pm, and can take a card payment over the phone for Key smartcard tickets.

Can I still top-up my Key smartcard on the bus?
Yes, you can still top-up your Key smartcard with 7-day tickets on the bus; this will not change.

I have a subscription ticket – what will happen to this?
Unfortunately, the closure of the Key smartcard customer portal will mean that we will no longer be able to continue with subscription tickets. Subscriptions on Key smartcard will continue to be renewed until 26 May, but after that date no more subscriptions will be processed. Once your 1-month subscription runs out, no more subscription payments will be taken and your ticket will expire. For example, if your subscription renews on the 26 May, your ticket will continue until the 25th June but after that point will stop working.

If you want to cancel your subscription sooner, you can do this on Key smartcard portal until the 26 May or, alternatively, you can cancel by calling our Customer Services team on 0191 420 50 50 (Monday to Friday, 9am-5pm).

What’s the best alternative to a subscription ticket?
If you want to continue buying tickets on Key smartcard, you can buy 7-day or 28-day tickets over the phone from our Customer Services team. You can also buy a 7-day ticket on the bus from the Bus Driver.

We also offer subscriptions to 28-day tickets on the Go North East mobile app, which have the benefit of the ticket automatically renewing like on Key smartcard. Please note, however, that these renew every 28-days rather than every calendar month.

Can I still get a new or replacement Key smartcard?
Yes, we will still issue brand new Key smartcards for customers who want to buy SmartZone tickets. However, we will no longer issue Key smartcards to new customers only wanting to buy Go North East tickets – the Go North East app should be used instead for anyone wanting to buy 28-day tickets.

We will still issue replacement Key smartcards to existing Key smartcard customers who have lost or damaged their smartcard.

I buy SmartZone tickets on the Key customer portal – what should I do now?
You can continue to buy SmartZone tickets to top-up onto your Key smartcard by calling our Customer Services team on 0191 420 5050, Monday to Friday between 9am and 5pm. Alternatively, the Bus Driver can top-up your Key smartcard with a SmartZone ticket on the bus.

Is the Key Connect business portal affected
No, the Key Connect portal for corporate customers is unaffected and will remain open as usual. The Key Connect portal will be getting upgraded to make it simpler and easier to use.

 

[nick291]

I know 3 months/12 weeks is a relatively short span of time, but has there been any improvement over at GNE? Looking to sample some routes next month.

 

[Travelmonkey]

I used a few GNE buses last month, the vehicles were poor but I couldn't fault the drivers. Prompt professional and more than happy (accept on a 21 that was being ran by a old gemini that I bunny hopped the step) to put the ramp down for me. Go ahead's issues are not just a north east phenomenon I know Kent has shiny new tram buses but ramps that won't deploy, if they even stop at all. I do think there is a make do mentality with the staff and them streetlites are evil 80 mins from Sunderland to Beamish museum yeah wish we could have had a xlines for that , I did notice alot more strays this time around. Lots of Durham streetlites on the bay at South Sheilds. Stagecoach definitely have Go ahead with their pants down in Sunderland the New Youtongs are lovely and given the choice between one of them and a streetlite I'm sorry I'm not backing British ,

 

[jkkne]

I know 3 months/12 weeks is a relatively short span of time, but has there been any improvement over at GNE? Looking to sample some routes next month.

Reliability remains hit and miss and short running is still common. They seem to have fixed some vehicle issues mechanically but the interior is shocking on a lot of the fleet. There’s still lots of tinkering with routes and timetables but it’s all a little around the edges

Seems to be a long wait for the levelling up and zebra funded electrics that are due on a number of routes.

 

[nick291]

Reliability remains hit and miss and short running is still common. They seem to have fixed some vehicle issues mechanically but the interior is shocking on a lot of the fleet. There’s still lots of tinkering with routes and timetables but it’s all a little around the edges

Seems to be a long wait for the levelling up and zebra funded electrics that are due on a number of routes.

No worse than round my way in Bristol in terms of reliability then. Though our ZEBRA/BSIP funding has come through recently and more electric deckers are entering service as we speak. Thanks. Mainly looking at riding the X66 Metrocentre shuttle.

 

[Omnidekkalover]

Better than Arriva though

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Better than Arriva though

Depends on which Arriva. North of the Tyne, the staff do a good job generally in terms of internal and external presentation despite the constraints placed upon them.

South of the Tyne - noticeably worse and definitely worse that GNE.

 

[nick291]

Depends on which Arriva. North of the Tyne, the staff do a good job generally in terms of internal and external presentation despite the constraints placed upon them.

South of the Tyne - noticeably worse and definitely worse that GNE.

Last time I used Arriva NE was on the 685 all the way from Newcastle to Carlisle. They were okay then.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Last time I used Arriva NE was on the 685 all the way from Newcastle to Carlisle. They were okay then.

Yeah - North of the Tyne.

Not so clever in Durham and Teesside

 

[nick291]

Yeah - North of the Tyne.

Not so clever in Durham and Teesside

I'll bare that in mind as well. Thanks.

 

[NE91]

Depends on which Arriva. North of the Tyne, the staff do a good job generally in terms of internal and external presentation despite the constraints placed upon them.

South of the Tyne - noticeably worse and definitely worse that GNE.

Agree with that. Arriva North of the Tyne have been much improved recently. Clearly in need of investment in the fleet which is supposed to be coming, but they are generally fairly reliable now and have done a great job on recruitment. Lots of new drivers and good customer service for them. They're miles better than my experience on GNE these days who keep getting worse.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Better than Arriva though

I’m not sure they are anymore.

As @TheGrandWazoo points out, Arriva are worse south of the Tyne than they are north of the Tyne. Presentation has improved north of the Tyne after Jesmond closed.

But then GNE are also much worse in County Durham. Last time I was there, last year, you couldn’t get a cigarette paper between GNE and Arriva. They were both equally abysmal.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I’m not sure they are anymore.

As @TheGrandWazoo points out, Arriva are worse south of the Tyne than they are north of the Tyne. Presentation has improved north of the Tyne after Jesmond closed.

But then GNE are also much worse in County Durham. Last time I was there, last year, you couldn’t get a cigarette paper between GNE and Arriva. They were both equally abysmal.

They get worse the further south you go. At least Darlo got the mini e200mmcs to smarten things up. Teesside is bad - definitely worse than GNE - they still have Pulsars in Arriva Cotswold (i.e. not been painted in the 16 years in the fleet) with the original moquette.

 

[Jimmi]

They get worse the further south you go. At least Darlo got the mini e200mmcs to smarten things up. Teesside is bad - definitely worse than GNE - they still have Pulsars in Arriva Cotswold (i.e. not been painted in the 16 years in the fleet) with the original moquette.

The presentation standards at Arriva North East isn't great, but on an operational stand point at least, it could be argued that GNE are worse in that regard in this last year or so.

The Cotswold Stone liveried Pulsars were supposedly meant to be getting a refresh back in 2020, but then covid happened, so everything of the sort was pit on hold, meaning only 1410 got done in the end, barely worth it at this point when they'll only have a few years at most left in service, although I question why the NE hasn't gotten its older fleet smartened up but Wales seems to be able to (or allowed to).

Back to GNE, reliability is still questionable on many routes, breakdowns seem pretty common on the X10 in particular which is not ideal on an hourly route and it's not particularly fun when the regular stand ins for the E400MMCs are either StreetDecks or ex London B9TLs which are limited to around 48mph - said StreetDecks also often encounter breakdowns when they're normally allocated to the X21.

Passenger confidence in GNE still seems pretty low following on from the strike a few year back and the frequent breakdowns and missing buses especially in recent months, on at least one day a few months back (before the loan buses appeared) there was a 2+ hour gap in service on the 16/16A service one morning because of serious vehicle shortages at Consett depot, especially with double deckers which resulted in weeks of them having to pull double deckers off service work to cover the school contracts. Think things have gotten better since although it's difficult to shake off those bad experiences from people's minds.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The presentation standards at Arriva North East isn't great, but on an operational stand point at least, it could be argued that GNE are worse in that regard in this last year or so.

The Cotswold Stone liveried Pulsars were supposedly meant to be getting a refresh back in 2020, but then covid happened, so everything of the sort was pit on hold, meaning only 1410 got done in the end, barely worth it at this point when they'll only have a few years at most left in service, although I question why the NE hasn't gotten its older fleet smartened up but Wales seems to be able to (or allowed to).

There's quite a few even slightly newer Pulsars that haven't been refurbished and look pretty tired.

Back to GNE, reliability is still questionable on many routes, breakdowns seem pretty common on the X10 in particular which is not ideal on an hourly route and it's not particularly fun when the regular stand ins for the E400MMCs are either StreetDecks or ex London B9TLs which are limited to around 48mph - said StreetDecks also often encounter breakdowns when they're normally allocated to the X21.

I usually a visitor a couple of times a year (visiting the famalam) and can't say I've experienced any issues but appreciate it's a limited sample size. However, the cockeyed decision to close Chester le Street and try to run from elsewhere can have done nothing for service reliability. Very reminiscent of when Arriva closed Bishop Auckland... reliability plummeted and services are a pale shadow of what they were (and are now reliant on Hodgsons and Weardale).

 

[Tetchytyke]

There's quite a few even slightly newer Pulsars that haven't been refurbished and look pretty tired.

Even the new E400MMCs that Arriva Northumbria have are not brilliant. They're reliable but they're very basic, with low backed seats and nothing else in the way of frills. A far cry from the ideas behind MAX.

It's a weird choice up there at the minute: basic but clean, or comfortable but tatty. And GNE is tatty- when I was last there, even the new buses on the flagship X66 were bashed and battered, with things like broken charger cradles and torn seat covers.