Got caught touching in on exit gates for over a year

[Fayxx]

Hi, what happened is that after getting off from the train, tow inspectors approached me with evidence shown that I haven’t paid for numerous journeys on the TFL and been told to provide my details to send me the letter and not to escalate the matter to court. But I gave them an address that Im no longer using it. First matter how to contact them to correct my address, second matter I believe the letter might lead to prosecution.

Showed me several pictures and files of me when im not paying for the journey which I was using faulty bank card all that time while I wasn’t aware of that.
Any suggestions what could be done next please!?

 

[JonathanH]

Showed me several pictures and files of me when im not paying for the journey which I was using faulty bank card all that time while I wasn’t aware of that.

I hope you will excuse my ignorance, but what is a 'faulty bank card' in this context?

Did the faulty bank card still allow access through ticket gates and revenue inspections?

 

[reb0118]

"But I gave them an address that Im no longer using...."

I assume from this that you gave an address that you had previously used? You are therefore still, potentially, traceable from this - but there could be serious consequences. Read on.

 

[AlterEgo]

Hi, what happened is that after getting off from the train, tow inspectors approached me with evidence shown that I haven’t paid for numerous journeys on the TFL and been told to provide my details to send me the letter and not to escalate the matter to court. But I gave them an address that Im no longer using it. First matter how to contact them to correct my address, second matter I believe the letter might lead to prosecution.

Showed me several pictures and files of me when im not paying for the journey which I was using faulty bank card all that time while I wasn’t aware of that.
Any suggestions what could be done next please!?

In what way is the card “faulty”? Please expand on this, as it is important to explore any potential defence you have.

 

[reb0118]

First matter how to contact them to correct my address.

Were you given any paperwork with contact details? If so, use that. If not, use the generic customer service options, explain the situation, and ask for contact details.

Explain that you no longer reside at the previously given address and supply current contract details.

I believe the letter might lead to prosecution.

You would be correct to think that. And, due to giving out of date contact details, you may find yourself prosecuted in your absence.

We do, however, need more information to advise correctly. Explain fully what is meant by "faulty"?

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

It sounds as though TfL have been gathering evidence and have specifically targetting you. Giving false details was a foolish thing to do, and from a legal point of view worse than committing the fare evasion.

TfL will send you what is called a Verification Letter where you have to confirm or deny the offence and give any mitigation that you want them to take ijnto account when deciding how to proceed. You need to try and get hold of this letter when it arrives - do you have access to the address you gave? If you don't then I would contact TfL's Investigations Appeals and Prosecutions Team telling the what has happened and giving them as much detail as possible and ask if they can send the Verification Letter to your correct address. Their email address is [email protected]

 

[Fayxx]

In what way is the card “faulty”? Please expand on this, as it is important to explore any potential defence you have.

Were you given any paperwork with contact details? If so, use that. If not, use the generic customer service options, explain the situation, and ask for contact details.

Explain that you no longer reside at the previously given address and supply current contract details.



You would be correct to think that. And, due to giving out of date contact details, you may find yourself prosecuted in your absence.

We do, however, need more information to advise correctly. Explain fully what is meant by "faulty"?

basically the card I was using was allowing me to get through the gates only from the EXIT side, so if I want to enter through the gate I tap from the other side.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

basically the card I was using was allowing me to get through the gates only from the EXIT side, so if I want to enter through the gate I tap from the other side.

Other people will be along with detailed advice shortly, but this means that you knew your card wasn't working properly and that you were deliberately using the gates in a way that they weren't meant to be used.

I haven't checked the TfL byelaws, but on National Rail using the barriers other than as designed is an offence and I expect it is on TfL as well. So you will be in trouble for that. But I think it is more likely that TfL will see this as a deliberate, long term attempt to fare dodge. After all, even if you didn't realise it was wrong to use the barriers like that, you must have noticed that your fare wasn't being charged to your card for a year.

As I say, others will advise on how best to respond to TfL. But you should prepare yourself for this not being cheap to settle - whether in or out of court.

 

[AndroidBango]

I don't quite understand how the card would allow you to do that, or how you figured out it would let you do that. Either way, it demonstrates a considerable degree of forethought and deliberation to avoid paying fares and that TFL have been after you for some time. I don't see this ending well, but do follow Hadders advice.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

I don't quite understand how the card would allow you to do that

This is drifting away from advice, but I suspect the system is set out to allow exit if any card is presented, so avoiding getting people trapped in the network and crushes in the limited space inside the barriers.

 

[island]

I don't quite understand how the card would allow you to do that

A contactless card that has been declined for payment or otherwise blocked for use will still work on exit barriers to allow passengers to leave the system. This “hack” has been doing the rounds on Tiktok and the like.

 

[AndroidBango]

This is drifting away from advice, but I suspect the system is set out to allow exit if any card is presented, so avoiding getting people trapped in the network and crushes in the limited space inside the barriers.

island:

A contactless card that has been declined for payment or otherwise blocked for use will still work on exit barriers to allow passengers to leave the system. This “hack” has been doing the rounds on Tiktok and the like.

Many thanks for the explanation - sorry to slightly derail.

So not a 'faulty card' but taking advantage of a known exploit for over a year. Persisting in claiming to TFL that it was a card problem seems unwise, to say the least.

 

[skyhigh]

A contactless card that has been declined for payment or otherwise blocked for use will still work on exit barriers to allow passengers to leave the system. This “hack” has been doing the rounds on Tiktok and the like.

Given TfL are generally happy to prosecute, this got to the stage they collected CCTV and intercepted the OP and were then given a false address - I think it's probably fair to say the chances of avoiding a conviction here are fairly slim.

 

[Brissle Girl]

If you don’t engage with TfL which in the first instance means giving them your correct address then you are likely to be found guilty in court in your absence.

The court will then try to recover payment, in the first instance via your previous address, and then by other means. They are likely to catch up with you, by which time the costs will have soared, and in any event non-payment will mean your credit history will probably be severely impaired as credit reference agencies will link you with a prior address.

 

[Snow1964]

A contactless card that has been declined for payment or otherwise blocked for use will still work on exit barriers to allow passengers to leave the system. This “hack” has been doing the rounds on Tiktok and the like.

OK, so calling it a faulty bank card is wrong, and misleading, it is just a bank card with no funds that TfL have chosen to allow to be used to exit.

The subtle difference is if TfL allows the exit, then need to be charged with entering or travelling without intention to pay, because otherwise someone accidentally (and unknowingly) being short of funds is guilty of same action.

The significance is willingly knowing aiming to avoid payment

 

[AlterEgo]

basically the card I was using was allowing me to get through the gates only from the EXIT side, so if I want to enter through the gate I tap from the other side.

So, not a faulty card, and merely an entry-level way of trying to game the system. You committed a further offence by giving an address you are not contactable at.

TfL will most likely prosecute you for the offence/s in the Magistrates' Court, but this is not a foregone conclusion.

 

[Brissle Girl]

So, not a faulty card, and merely an entry-level way of trying to game the system. You committed a further offence by giving an address you are not contactable at.

TfL will most likely prosecute you for the offence/s in the Magistrates' Court, but this is not a foregone conclusion.

As @skyhigh has said, since TfL has gone to considerable trouble to get CCTV or similar evidence to find the OP, and will consider it to be clear fraudulent activity, I doubt they will not take this to court, when they prosecute for much more straightforward offences.

 

[AlterEgo]

As @skyhigh has said, since TfL has gone to considerable trouble to get CCTV or similar evidence to find the OP, and will consider it to be clear fraudulent activity, I doubt they will not take this to court, when they prosecute for much more straightforward offences.

True, but in this case they have hard evidence of a lot of unpaid fares; they will recoup their costs better by settling with the OP. It might be a good idea to get a solicitor.

 

[AndroidBango]

True, but in this case they have hard evidence of a lot of unpaid fares; they will recoup their costs better by settling with the OP. It might be a good idea to get a solicitor.

I imagine TFL will have to weigh up recouping their costs versus a prosecution to deter others from using this exploit, pour encourager les autres and all that.

 

[swt_passenger]

basically the card I was using was allowing me to get through the gates only from the EXIT side, so if I want to enter through the gate I tap from the other side.

That’s not something you can do accidentally, and I’d strongly suspect they’ve got evidence of you doing it. You‘re not likely to convince anyone you thought your card was faulty.

You must have known all that time you weren’t actually paying any contactless fares?

 

[Haywain]

That’s not something you can do accidentally, and I’d strongly suspect they’ve got evidence of you doing it. You‘re not likely to convince anyone you thought your card was faulty.

It's already been stated they've got images, and they knew where and when to stop the OP. This is far from being a trivial matter!

 

[Grvrdvicdr]

Am I the only one thinking something is missing or not been explained?

If the card only works from the EXIT side, that means the OP has to reach over and tap the card to enter hence paying a full fare and then having to tap out again meaning 2 full fares for 1 journey?

And bear in mind this only works 3(?) times before the card is blocked for travel

So I’m assuming (could be wrong) the OP taps in, then immediately taps out to not be charged and then exits at destination through alternate means. Only thing that would make sense if this is fare evasion.

 

[skyhigh]

Am I the only one thinking something is missing or not been explained?

If the card only works from the EXIT side, that means the OP has to reach over and tap the card to enter hence paying a full fare and then having to tap out again meaning 2 full fares for 1 journey?

And bear in mind this only works 3(?) times before the card is blocked for travel

So I’m assuming (could be wrong) the OP taps in, then immediately taps out to not be charged and then exits at destination through alternate means. Only thing that would make sense if this is fare evasion.

It has been explained that a blocked card will still allow an exit from the system. So yes, the OP has been reaching over to tap out then entering through the open gate (or starting at an unbarriered station and using the card to exit). As the card is blocked/has no funds no penalty is applied.

 

[Brissle Girl]

Am I the only one thinking something is missing or not been explained?

If the card only works from the EXIT side, that means the OP has to reach over and tap the card to enter hence paying a full fare and then having to tap out again meaning 2 full fares for 1 journey?

And bear in mind this only works 3(?) times before the card is blocked for travel

So I’m assuming (could be wrong) the OP taps in, then immediately taps out to not be charged and then exits at destination through alternate means. Only thing that would make sense if this is fare evasion.

I think the point is that the card had been blocked or in some other way was not actually being charged.

 

[Grvrdvicdr]

Noooo, they definitely don’t work as an exit means if blocked. Throws up a blocked code on the gates ‘blocked by TFL’ so doesn’t allow entry or exit. Something I remember well form my revenue protection days

 

[swt_passenger]

Am I the only one thinking something is missing or not been explained?

If the card only works from the EXIT side, that means the OP has to reach over and tap the card to enter hence paying a full fare and then having to tap out again meaning 2 full fares for 1 journey?

And bear in mind this only works 3(?) times before the card is blocked for travel

So I’m assuming (could be wrong) the OP taps in, then immediately taps out to not be charged and then exits at destination through alternate means. Only thing that would make sense if this is fare evasion.

No, the reaching over will be assumed to be an exit attempt by the system. He’s then passing through an open exit gate but in the wrong direction. There’s not going to be an entry attempted or recorded. If TfL have nothing but exits recorded they’ll know exactly what’s been happening, potentially they’ll know the exact journeys being made.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Am I the only one thinking something is missing or not been explained?

If the card only works from the EXIT side, that means the OP has to reach over and tap the card to enter hence paying a full fare and then having to tap out again meaning 2 full fares for 1 journey?

And bear in mind this only works 3(?) times before the card is blocked for travel

So I’m assuming (could be wrong) the OP taps in, then immediately taps out to not be charged and then exits at destination through alternate means. Only thing that would make sense if this is fare evasion.

As I came up with the first explanation, it’s probably for me to acknowledge that I could be wrong - except as someone else said, the OP notes that the inspectors

Showed me several pictures and files of me when im not paying for the journey which I was using faulty bank card all that time

So we know that the OP has been identified as doing something out of order, even if we don’t know precisely what the ‘something’ was. And all (or at least most) of the advice given is on how the OP should cope with having been pulled up for long term fare evasion. And as I and others have commented, if the OP has done this for around a year, it’d close to inconceivable that they won’t have notice that this is saving them money, and while it is conceivable that someone might not go on to consider whether that meant that what they were doing was fare dodging, I don’t think that a court would have any difficulty with considering that a reasonable person would have thought about whether it was fare dodging or not, and would have decided that it was.

In short, even without the mechanism being understood, the OP needs to understand that TfL have everything they need to prosecute for intentionally avoiding fares.

 

[ChewChewTrain]

Noooo, they definitely don’t work as an exit means if blocked. Throws up a blocked code on the gates ‘blocked by TFL’ so doesn’t allow entry or exit. Something I remember well form my revenue protection days

I must say I was very surprised to hear that blocked cards were allowed to exit. Seems like letting people off the hook for no real reason, when they’re physically contained and (often) bang to rights.

I had thought exit of a blocked card was only allowed when the block was due to a card verification failing earlier that day (which is presumably to stop people being potentially prosecuted because of a bank error or outage).

Now, I don’t quite know what to think.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

So, is the general consensus that the OP (= @Fayxx) would probably be best advised seeking out specialist legal representation in view of the amount(s) potentially at stake and the likelihood of being found guilty ending up with a court conviction?

 

[Grvrdvicdr]

If blocked cards could exit then people would get on at unmanned stations and still be able to tap out. I’ve used many a penalty for blocked cards trying to exit