Govia Thameslink offence

[Titfield]

No two cases are exactly the same.

Please can you create your own thread outlining the event which has happened together with any letter from the Train Operating Company you have received uploaded and any identifying details obscured.

Advice specific to your issue can then be given. TIA.

EDIT. Just seen you have already done this. Apologies.

 

[bagels]

I have made my own thread on my page. Thank you for the advice Tia

 

[Jimcarey59]

Update: I have received a letter showing that they intend to ‘go forward with the case’

‘Court documentation will be sent to you in due course’

 

[Brissle Girl]

Did you get confirmation from the tracking that they received your letter (or do they acknowledge it in their letter)? It's very unusual that they are not offering you a settlement. Perhaps you could post a copy both of your original response and the latest letter, so that we can advise on the best way forward.

It's GTR, they settle all the time anyway. It is possible to overthink these things.

Maybe this is the exception that proves the rule...

 

[Jimcarey59]

Did you get confirmation from the tracking that they received your letter (or do they acknowledge it in their letter)? It's very unusual that they are not offering you a settlement. Perhaps you could post a copy both of your original response and the latest letter, so that we can advise on the best way forward.

Tracking indicates they received my response letter and their response also mentions that they are pursuing the case having read my response.

 

[AlterEgo]

Update: I have received a letter showing that they intend to ‘go forward with the case’

‘Court documentation will be sent to you in due course’

Is any reasoning given? Please upload the letter with your details removed. This is highly unusual for them.

How much did you evade in fares, roughly?

 

[Hadders]

I agree with @AlterEgo We really need to see copies of all the letters.

It might be worth reaching out the the Prosecutions Department directly but I'd like to see copies of the letters before doing so.

 

[Jimcarey59]

Their response:

I agree with @AlterEgo We really need to see copies of all the letters.

It might be worth reaching out the the Prosecutions Department directly but I'd like to see copies of the letters before doing so.

#14 and #38 are all of the correspondence I’ve received

 

[Hadders]

How many times have you evaded your fare?

 

[Jimcarey59]

How many times have you evaded your fare?

I can’t say for sure. Maybe ~15 times.

If I were to reach out for further information from their department what should I say?

Lastly, where can I find a reputable solicitor for this sort of situation? Thanks.

 

[Hadders]

If you've been using Trainline to purchase your tickets then you'll be able to research your own journey history so you can work out yourself how many times you've done this.

Personally, I would reach out to GTR asking if they received your letter. We know it arrived at their offices and there is a reference to it in their reply but things can got astray or cases get confused.

I don't have recommendations for solicitors but a search of this section of the forum will quickly show some firms who deal with this sort of thing. Finally, when the court papers arrive then do upload a copy of them in this thread (with personal details redacted) so that we can assist with looking for any anomalies etc.

 

[jon0844]

Perhaps the figures from the last DfT ticketless survey has prompted more serious action to be taken against offenders going forward. The DfT appears to be finally showing signs of wanting to reduce fare evasion (a logical, and some might say stupidly obvious, way to go) and could be directing TOCs to take more people to court going forward.

I am sure we'll see if that's true by seeing what happens on here in the coming year.

 

[Jimcarey59]

If you've been using Trainline to purchase your tickets then you'll be able to research your own journey history so you can work out yourself how many times you've done this.

Personally, I would reach out to GTR asking if they received your letter. We know it arrived at their offices and there is a reference to it in their reply but things can got astray or cases get confused.

I don't have recommendations for solicitors but a search of this section of the forum will quickly show some firms who deal with this sort of thing. Finally, when the court papers arrive then do upload a copy of them in this thread (with personal details redacted) so that we can assist with looking for any anomalies etc.

Is there an email address for their prosecutions department? Or should I just write a letter?

 

[WesternLancer]

Is there an email address for their prosecutions department? Or should I just write a letter?

posted on another thread e-mail address for GTR / Thameslink prosecutions team:

[email protected]

I can’t say for sure. Maybe ~15 times.

If I were to reach out for further information from their department what should I say?

Lastly, where can I find a reputable solicitor for this sort of situation? Thanks.

As Hadders says it is unusual for Thameslink not to settle, but Chiltern for example often do not settle at 1st request, and the general advice given there is advice you could use - which is to go back to them again as suggested, re-iterate your apology and understand that you did wrong, try to convince them you will never do it again and ask again if they will reconsider in terms of offering an out of court settlement

Ref Solicitors, (and you can search other threads where they are mentioned) people have regularly mentioned Manak Solicitors positively in terms of dealing with Thameslink. I have no connection with the firm. You could maybe at least seek quotes

Manak Solicitors

Manak Solicitors | Sevenoaks, Orpington, Gravesend and London

Manak Solicitors: Your trusted legal experts for Family Law, Immigration, Conveyancing, Wills & Probate, and Employment Law. Experience professional, bespoke services.

manaksolicitors.co.uk

another firm mentioned in the past has been

Penman Sedgwick Solicitors

Fare Evasion - Penman Sedgwick​

penmansedgwick.com

 

[Jimcarey59]

posted on another thread e-mail address for GTR / Thameslink prosecutions team:

[email protected]


As Hadders says it is unusual for Thameslink not to settle, but Chiltern for example often do not settle at 1st request, and the general advice given there is advice you could use - which is to go back to them again as suggested, re-iterate your apology and understand that you did wrong, try to convince them you will never do it again and ask again if they will reconsider in terms of offering an out of court settlement

Ref Solicitors, (and you can search other threads where they are mentioned) people have regularly mentioned Manak Solicitors positively in terms of dealing with Thameslink. I have no connection with the firm. You could maybe at least seek quotes

Manak Solicitors

Manak Solicitors | Sevenoaks, Orpington, Gravesend and London

Manak Solicitors: Your trusted legal experts for Family Law, Immigration, Conveyancing, Wills & Probate, and Employment Law. Experience professional, bespoke services.

manaksolicitors.co.uk

another firm mentioned in the past has been

Penman Sedgwick Solicitors

Fare Evasion - Penman Sedgwick​

penmansedgwick.com

Thank you.

My initial draft for the follow up letter is below - please feel free to offer and amendments.

Dear Govia Thameslink Railway,

I am writing to enquire as to whether my response to the intent to prosecute letter has been received and read by your department. Reference x

I am extremely regretful and ashamed about my actions and do not overlook the extent to which actions similar to mine are detrimental to both Govia Thameslink Railway and the rail industry. I fully understand the responsibility as a passenger to uphold my duty of paying for full and valid tickets for every journey. I am completely committed to doing so for all journeys I seek to make in the future. I will always make sure to do my duty as a passenger.

If this matter could be solved without the need of court action, I would be exceedingly grateful. I am fully prepared to co-operate and I am willing to cover whatever costs Govia Thameslink have incurred during this matter, plus my full fare for this journey.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you.

My initial draft for the follow up letter is below - please feel free to offer and amendments.

Dear Govia Thameslink Railway,

I am writing to enquire as to whether my response to the intent to prosecute letter has been received and read by your department. Reference x

I am extremely regretful and ashamed about my actions and do not overlook the extent to which actions similar to mine are detrimental to both Govia Thameslink Railway and the rail industry. I fully understand the responsibility as a passenger to uphold my duty of paying for full and valid tickets for every journey. I am completely committed to doing so for all journeys I seek to make in the future. I will always make sure to do my duty as a passenger.

If this matter could be solved without the need of court action, I would be exceedingly grateful. I am fully prepared to co-operate and I am willing to cover whatever costs Govia Thameslink have incurred during this matter, plus my full fare for this journey.

Generally covers the matter, but one issue here at the end is that if you have doen this on more than one occasion, and they know that, then you offering to pay for only 1 journey may not be hitting the mark

you could consider changing :

plus my full fare for this journey.

to eg 'paying my full fare for travel' (which is ambiguous as to whether you mean 1 or more trips so they can ask for what they seek if they are prepared to do so)

See what others think but you could e-mail that in (and post it too perhaps).

 

[Jimcarey59]

Generally covers the matter, but one issue here at the end is that if you have doen this on more than one occasion, and they know that, then you offering to pay for only 1 journey may not be hitting the mark

you could consider changing :


to eg 'paying my full fare for travel' (which is ambiguous as to whether you mean 1 or more trips so they can ask for what they seek if they are prepared to do so)

See what others think but you could e-mail that in (and post it too perhaps).

Good shout. Thanks.

 

[ikcdab]

you are far far better off writing this is plain, everyday language. Wjat you have written sounds a lot like chatGPT and is overblown.

Try this:

I am writing to enquire as to whether my response to the intent to prosecute letter has been received and read by your department. Reference x

I am regretful and ashamed about my actions and I understand the extent to which actions similar to mine are detrimental to both Govia Thameslink Railway and the rail industry. I fully understand the need to pay properly for full and valid tickets for every journey. I am completely committed to doing so for all journeys I make in the future.

If this matter could be solved without the need of court action, I would be exceedingly grateful. I am fully prepared to co-operate and I am willing to cover whatever costs Govia Thameslink have incurred during this matter.

 

[Jimcarey59]

you are far far better off writing this is plain, everyday language. Wjat you have written sounds a lot like chatGPT and is overblown.

Try this:

I am writing to enquire as to whether my response to the intent to prosecute letter has been received and read by your department. Reference x

I am regretful and ashamed about my actions and I understand the extent to which actions similar to mine are detrimental to both Govia Thameslink Railway and the rail industry. I fully understand the need to pay properly for full and valid tickets for every journey. I am completely committed to doing so for all journeys I make in the future.

If this matter could be solved without the need of court action, I would be exceedingly grateful. I am fully prepared to co-operate and I am willing to cover whatever costs Govia Thameslink have incurred during this matter.

Thank you, have amended.

 

[alholmes]

you are far far better off writing this is plain, everyday language. Wjat you have written sounds a lot like chatGPT and is overblown.

Try this:

I am writing to enquire as to whether my response to the intent to prosecute letter has been received and read by your department. Reference x

I am regretful and ashamed about my actions and I understand the extent to which actions similar to mine are detrimental to both Govia Thameslink Railway and the rail industry. I fully understand the need to pay properly for full and valid tickets for every journey. I am completely committed to doing so for all journeys I make in the future.

If this matter could be solved without the need of court action, I would be exceedingly grateful. I am fully prepared to co-operate and I am willing to cover whatever costs Govia Thameslink have incurred during this matter.

Include dates - what was the date of your response, and what was the date of their intent to prosecute letter. Include those dates on this response, to help the person at GTR understand the sequence of events.

 

[Jimcarey59]

They’ve emailed confirming it all. Guess I’ll wait for the court documents and contact a solicitor.

 

[Brissle Girl]

They’ve emailed confirming it all. Guess I’ll wait for the court documents and contact a solicitor.

If you are going to (and I understand why you might given the position GTR appear to be taking) I would suggest doing it prior to getting the court documents. They may be able to change GTR's mind before any more costs are incurred by GTR. They are probably in a better position than you are to ask why you appear to be treated differently to others who have engaged in a positive manner.

 

[AlterEgo]

Either this marks a severe departure from GTR’s custom and practice, settling with every single offender, or there are significant factors not disclosed to the forum. Time will tell, I suppose, if more people come to the forum and say they find it difficult to settle with GTR.

 

[WesternLancer]

They’ve emailed confirming it all. Guess I’ll wait for the court documents and contact a solicitor.

To save you searching lots of threads other posters who have used a solicitor reported that Manak solicitors claimed to have a clear channel of communication with GTR / Thameslink to help resolve cases before court, and that those posters benefitted from this. I can't make any comment on the severity of the cases concerned etc, nor have a personal view on this, but just thought it may help you to share what has been posted before. I guess you can search the forum for 'Manak' and see if that generates info for you.

Here's one example
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/fare-evasion-pos-prosecution.258478/#post-6626105

 

[Haywain]

Guess I’ll wait for the court documents and contact a solicitor.

Be warned that a solicitor won't be a cheap option - on another thread yesterday a poster quoted £725:

We have an initial consultation booked with one he found specializing in rail fare prosecution for £725.

 

[Ducky88]

not going to lie, this does not spark confidence in my own process.. scary that they chose to prosecute

 

[Haywain]

this does not spark confidence in my own process.. scary that they chose to prosecute

You have to bear in mind that there is more than one side to a story and we only have the OP's (limited) version of events. There may be more to this than we are aware of.

 

[Jimcarey59]

Be warned that a solicitor won't be a cheap option - on another thread yesterday a poster quoted £725:

To save you searching lots of threads other posters who have used a solicitor reported that Manak solicitors claimed to have a clear channel of communication with GTR / Thameslink to help resolve cases before court, and that those posters benefitted from this. I can't make any comment on the severity of the cases concerned etc, nor have a personal view on this, but just thought it may help you to share what has been posted before. I guess you can search the forum for 'Manak' and see if that generates info for you.

Here's one example
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/fare-evasion-pos-prosecution.258478/#post-6626105

Thanks

 

[Jimcarey59]

Although the direction of my situation isn’t looking good, just wanted to say appreciate any and all support that’s been given throughout!

I’ll update if significant things happen.

 

[Ducky88]

You have to bear in mind that there is more than one side to a story and we only have the OP's (limited) version of events. There may be more to this than we are aware of.

you didn't have to but you have eased my mind. So thank you

Although the direction of my situation isn’t looking good, just wanted to say appreciate any and all support that’s been given throughout!

I’ll update if significant things happen

Perhaps it was the letter, was too short.

don't know if its worth sending another however. but can't be worse to try