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Group Bourdon Tool

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paul weston

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7 Jul 2019
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I'm not sure I follow you? If you are asking about another software like this... this is the only free software I am aware of.

This generates SCAAT sheets (you can print) or you can practice on your PC.
so on the SCAAT test what shapes r u looking for can u help
 
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SM22

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30 Jun 2019
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So frustrating !! Keep getting around 9-10 lines down each section which is average I think. But over the whole test I make 1-2 omissions and no errors. I want zero emissions !!
 

SomeoneElse

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21 Jun 2019
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So frustrating !! Keep getting around 9-10 lines down each section which is average I think. But over the whole test I make 1-2 omissions and no errors. I want zero emissions !!


I don't think that's too bad, it's better if you can make no omissions obviously, but the fact that you are seeing your mistakes and crossing them out is good in my opinion.
I reckon you would be okay on the day with that result. Good luck :)
 

N47

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22 Nov 2018
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39
Hi does anyone know if on the real test at the assessment centre you get 1 min or 2 mins per page?
Also is there one block per page or 2?

From my practise I get to about 8-10 lines with 1 or 2 missed.

Thanks
 
Joined
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Hi does anyone know if on the real test at the assessment centre you get 1 min or 2 mins per page?
Also is there one block per page or 2?

From my practise I get to about 8-10 lines with 1 or 2 missed.

Thanks
Hi. It's 2 minutes per block and pretty sure it's 1 block per page, 2 at most. It's bigger than printouts that you get.

I would say 8 perfect lines is a good target. I practiced twice a week and managed about 10 rows on the day.

Hope that helps
 

N47

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22 Nov 2018
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I've been practising Bourdon for over a month now and originally started off, as expected with not as many lines with a number of errors. I'm now in a flow where completing 14 to 15 lines with approx 2 to 3 ommisions in total over the 5 sheets in the 10 mins, I never make the mistake of marking anything other than 4 dots, just sometimes miss them. I'm finding it really difficult now to slow down to try and get zero errors in a panic that I don't complete enough. I know that nobody knows the pass rate, but if I were to score as have been doing today with 14 to 15 lines missing 2 to 3 would that pass? Assessment day coming up in 3 weeks exactly, not that I'm counting :)
If you don’t mind me asking how did you get on? How many lines you get done and was it 2 mins per page ?thanks
 

Quin79

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11 Mar 2019
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If you don’t mind me asking how did you get on? How many lines you get done and was it 2 mins per page ?thanks
2 mins per page....have my test next week. I'd say on average now 15 to 16 lines with one omission on average
 

N47

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22 Nov 2018
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Hi. It's 2 minutes per block and pretty sure it's 1 block per page, 2 at most. It's bigger than printouts that you get.

I would say 8 perfect lines is a good target. I practiced twice a week and managed about 10 rows on the day.

Hope that helps
Thanks, how long did you practise for?
I’ve done a few but I’ve printed them and doing 1-2 pages at a time, when I try doing 5 one after the other I know Will become more difficult
 

Quin79

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Thanks, how long did you practise for?
I’ve done a few but I’ve printed them and doing 1-2 pages at a time, when I try doing 5 one after the other I know Will become more difficult
Been practising a couple of months. On average two to three 10 min tests (15 sheets) per day.
 

Quin79

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11 Mar 2019
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284
Been practising a couple of months. On average two to three 10 min tests (15 sheets) per day.
What I did was print sheets out, laminate them and use a dry wipe marker to mark the dots. Then once counted them all up easy to wipe clean
 
Joined
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I feel like the more times I practice the group bourdon the worse I'm doing. I went from 13 lines 1 omission, to 11 lines 2/3 omissions.
 
Joined
14 May 2019
Messages
38
I feel like the more times I practice the group bourdon the worse I'm doing. I went from 13 lines 1 omission, to 11 lines 2/3 omissions.
My advice would be to practise twice per week, 5 sheets of dots each time, just like the real test. Slow it right down to 8 perfect lines and don't overdo the practice.

That's what I did and I managed on average 10 rows on the day.
 
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Smart idea.

https://traineetraindriverinfo.com/...merce_uploads/2013/12/Mock-Assesment-Copy.pdf

Are you using these tests? And the ones on the software at top of this thread are they they same or different ?

Thanks
They are the tests I printed from that link. Found them suitable enough. On the day, I would say there are more groups of 4 and they are slightly bigger so it was easier in one sense but harder as there were more.

I completed the scaat test yesterday and it was much harder. My eyes were pointing in different directions afterwards!
 

Quin79

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11 Mar 2019
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284
Smart idea.

https://traineetraindriverinfo.com/...merce_uploads/2013/12/Mock-Assesment-Copy.pdf

Are you using these tests? And the ones on the software at top of this thread are they they same or different ?

Thanks
I am using both yes. The ones you print out from the computer programme are smaller but same number of dots per line. As smaller it takes less time to do a line so your score is higher. I'm practising both just in case as I don't know how big the dots ate on the test on the day
 

N47

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Joined
22 Nov 2018
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39
I am using both yes. The ones you print out from the computer programme are smaller but same number of dots per line. As smaller it takes less time to do a line so your score is higher. I'm practising both just in case as I don't know how big the dots ate on the test on the day


Hi how did you get on ?hope it went well
 

N47

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22 Nov 2018
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They are the tests I printed from that link. Found them suitable enough. On the day, I would say there are more groups of 4 and they are slightly bigger so it was easier in one sense but harder as there were more.

I completed the scaat test yesterday and it was much harder. My eyes were pointing in different directions afterwards!

What is this scaat test? I don’t see in mentioned in the mtr assessment pack
 

Sharp Boy

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31 Jul 2019
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16
I am sure this may of been asked before... with the online version downloaded from here on the shapes test, as it progresses you are asked to find two shapes... the one on the front page which is constant, but also to highlight the same shape as it appears at the start of each line... for that line only.

Is this the same in the tests on the day?

I do ok when I just need to find one shape..but finding 2.... i am really struggling with.

Anyone????
 
Joined
14 May 2019
Messages
38
I am sure this may of been asked before... with the online version downloaded from here on the shapes test, as it progresses you are asked to find two shapes... the one on the front page which is constant, but also to highlight the same shape as it appears at the start of each line... for that line only.

Is this the same in the tests on the day?

I do ok when I just need to find one shape..but finding 2.... i am really struggling with.

Anyone????
Yes. There are 9 one minute sections. 1st 3 are 1 shape, 2nd 3 are 2 shapes and last 3 are 1 constant and the 1st of the row.

When is your assessment?
 

N47

Member
Joined
22 Nov 2018
Messages
39
Which test is this for ?

I am sure this may of been asked before... with the online version downloaded from here on the shapes test, as it progresses you are asked to find two shapes... the one on the front page which is constant, but also to highlight the same shape as it appears at the start of each line... for that line only.

Is this the same in the tests on the day?

I do ok when I just need to find one shape..but finding 2.... i am really struggling with.

Anyone????
 

Sharp Boy

Member
Joined
31 Jul 2019
Messages
16
Yes. There are 9 one minute sections. 1st 3 are 1 shape, 2nd 3 are 2 shapes and last 3 are 1 constant and the 1st of the row.

When is your assessment?

Cheers for this.
No idea when my assessment might be. Just been told "we will be in touch"
 
Joined
14 May 2019
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38
Cheers for this.
No idea when my assessment might be. Just been told "we will be in touch"
No worries.

My advice would be to slow it right down until you get zero omissions, then practice 2 to 3 times per week.

I found that repeating the 2 shapes in my head helped, for example, W < W < W <, etc.

I did my driver assessment 1st which was the dots so that got me into a good rhythm so only practiced the shapes a couple of times.

Hope that helps.
 

MathewB

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Joined
9 Aug 2019
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Hello. im currently going through to process and im through to test stage for LNER. please correct me if im wrong, with the bourdon test... obviously they want you to complete as many lines as possible but with the correct dots crossed out. so quality is better and quantity? by this I mean say you manage 15 lines but get 5 incorrect..... and someone manages 10 lines but with no errors?
ive been practising the test on paper and im managing 12 lines with 1 error and 2 errors on one page.
any advice or help welcome...

thanks
 

Dynamonic

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Joined
10 Jan 2013
Messages
648
Location
Nottinghamshire
Hello. im currently going through to process and im through to test stage for LNER. please correct me if im wrong, with the bourdon test... obviously they want you to complete as many lines as possible but with the correct dots crossed out. so quality is better and quantity? by this I mean say you manage 15 lines but get 5 incorrect..... and someone manages 10 lines but with no errors?
ive been practising the test on paper and im managing 12 lines with 1 error and 2 errors on one page.
any advice or help welcome...

thanks

Accuracy and consistency should be your main priority. Work on speed once you’ve mastered these first.
I would say 10 lines with 0 errors is significantly better than 15 lines with 5 errors. (Funny enough, I was getting 10-11 lines down with no more than 1 error when practicing, and passed to my TOC’s Enhanced standard on the day)
For consistency, you should get to roughly the same point on every sheet you complete and avoid appearing to get ‘better’ or ‘worse’ as the test goes on.
Also, if you’re not doing so already, remember to practice using paper printouts, to better simulate the test on the day. :)
 

MathewB

New Member
Joined
9 Aug 2019
Messages
2
Accuracy and consistency should be your main priority. Work on speed once you’ve mastered these first.
I would say 10 lines with 0 errors is significantly better than 15 lines with 5 errors. (Funny enough, I was getting 10-11 lines down with no more than 1 error when practicing, and passed to my TOC’s Enhanced standard on the day)
For consistency, you should get to roughly the same point on every sheet you complete and avoid appearing to get ‘better’ or ‘worse’ as the test goes on.
Also, if you’re not doing so already, remember to practice using paper printouts, to better simulate the test on the day. :)
Hello thankyou for the speedy reply, and yeah im currently using paper printouts to practice instead on the digital version. thankyou for your feedback, which toc did you apply for and pass?
 
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