GWR 2019 Timetable Change

[Charlie M.]

When will this be delivered? GWR said January but it seems to not be the case apparently.

Also what is expected in this timetable change? Will the 800s operate the original performance told in the franchise agreement?

 

[jimm]

EDIT: In case my post appears not to make sense, the original poster has removed a substantial portion of the post, including an incorrect claim that the major GWR timetable change point was meant to be last December

The major timetable change was never going to be December 2017.

When the current direct award franchise started in 2015, GWR made a series of presentations to stakeholders setting out the various phases of rolling stock and timetable changes that were planned. Along with planned service enhancements and timetable patterns.

These are the slides from one version of the presentation given to Travelwatch South West later in the year, once the initial Class 802 order had been agreed by the DfT. Earlier versions of the presentation described the proposed order.

http://travelwatchsouthwest.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Travelwatch-Presentation-October-2015.pdf

December 2018 (SLC 3)

• Full benefits from new and cascaded trains
  
  
• Faster journey times, more seats

The schedule was then overtaken by events, not least electrification delays, but the key date was always December 2018 - now shifted back by some weeks into 2019.

 

[Clarence Yard]

It is now planned for either mid February or May 2019. Discussions are ongoing with DfT and NR.

Some in NR would like it to be February but the effect on several other operators could be significant and that would cause even more problems with NR’s stretched train planning department so May 2019 is now being suggested.

 

[Mintona]

That’s a shame, I’m rather looking forward to seeing how it all works together. I guess an extra 5 months isn’t the end of the world, if it gets everything in place and avoids a Thameslink-style breakdown.

Thanks for all the updates Clarence Yard.

 

[The Planner]

Trying to do a change between timetables always has a risk, and with the current climate I doubt many will have the appetite for it.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

One also has to realise that the December 2018 timetable development process itself has been directly affected by the Northern / TPE / GTR debacle and the consequent knock-on impact on NR planning resources as a whole. It is therefore at risk of being seriously compromised in terms of quality.

May 2019 would be a far safer choice IMO, gives NR the chance to get the job done properly.

 

[SwindonBert]

Can anyone really see any manager signing off a totally new timetable at the moment (unless the manager is due to retire between signing it off & implementation date) ?

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

Not quite sure what you mean by ‘signing off’ - there isn’t one person who makes such a call. It’s done collectively by multiple planning organisations over a long period of time.

 

[Mintona]

The Western Region timetable change will happen. It would’ve been a waste of time ordering all the new rolling stock if it wasn’t going to.

 

[YorkshireBear]

The Western Region timetable change will happen. It would’ve been a waste of time ordering all the new rolling stock if it wasn’t going to.

No one is questioning that. But people are questioning when it will be.

 

[SwindonBert]

Not quite sure what you mean by ‘signing off’ - there isn’t one person who makes such a call. It’s done collectively by multiple planning organisations over a long period of time.

Surely there's 1 person who is ultimately responsible (albeit, a number of people would do the work), if not, there should be

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

Ultimately, the Secretary of State.

 

[matt_world2004]

I dont think any new timetable should be introduced until crossrail goes reading and the heathrow express changes are finalised. Seens a waste of time to introduce a new timetable only to change it again a year later

Lengthy interchanges at paddington may change passenger demand patterns unexpectedly. As well

 

[Bedpan]

What is the position so far regarding electrification? I know Didcot is live and I think Newbury will follow in a few months, but what about Oxford and west of Didcot? Is there a Didcot-Newbury shuttle until Oxford goes live?

EDIT - Actually I've just found a very infornative post (#7203 on Great Western Electrification Progress) which provides a full update except for Oxford.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

I dont think any new timetable should be introduced until crossrail goes reading and the heathrow express changes are finalised. Seens a waste of time to introduce a new timetable only to change it again a year later

Lengthy interchanges at paddington may change passenger demand patterns unexpectedly. As well

Crossrail simply takes over existing services operated by GWR, except they go down the rabbit hole at Westbourne Park instead of in/out of the terminus at Paddington. I don’t know what you expect to change with HEx - merely a different type of unit in a different livery, working the same timetable as now. Barring a few different ECS moves, there will be no change to the GWR main line timetable.

 

[matt_world2004]

Crossrail simply takes over existing services operated by GWR, except they go down the rabbit hole at Westbourne Park instead of in/out of the terminus at Paddington. I don’t know what you expect to change with HEx - merely a different type of unit in a different livery, working the same timetable as now. Barring a few different ECS moves, there will be no change to the GWR main line timetable.

I wonder how many people will interchange from fast services to underground lines at paddington rather than remain on the slower service and save interchange time.

 

[Sean Emmett]

I don’t know what you expect to change with HEx - merely a different type of unit in a different livery, working the same timetable as now. Barring a few different ECS moves, there will be no change to the GWR main line timetable.

IIRC 387s allowed 110 mph compared with 100 for the 332s.

Appreciate this won't save much time out to Stockley Jn, half minute at most, but won't this give a bit more flexibility for the timetable planners?

 

[Nicholas43]

When TfL is running all stations and shacks Reading to Paddington Low Level (and beyond) every ?10 minutes, will GWR be able to run, for example, (Oxford?) - Didcot - all stations to Reading and then selected stations to Paddington High Level?
Will (some?) GWR main line services call at, for example, Slough, to allow a (relatively) easy interchange to TfL for, say, Bond Street?

 

[paulravuslante]

This sheet from Crossrail suggests that ‘other’ services will run a semi fast service along the reliefs in the off peak in addition to fast services on the main lines.

http://74f85f59f39b887b696f-ab65625...service_pattern-reading_to_central_london.pdf

When TfL is running all stations and shacks Reading to Paddington Low Level (and beyond) every ?10 minutes, will GWR be able to run, for example, (Oxford?) - Didcot - all stations to Reading and then selected stations to Paddington High Level?
Will (some?) GWR main line services call at, for example, Slough, to allow a (relatively) easy interchange to TfL for, say, Bond Street?

 

[Nicholas43]

This sheet from Crossrail suggests that ‘other’ services will run a semi fast service along the reliefs in the off peak in addition to fast services on the main lines.

http://74f85f59f39b887b696f-ab65625...service_pattern-reading_to_central_london.pdf

Many thanks.

 

[matt_world2004]

I am surprised there is no plan for the fast services to call at ealing broadway for cross platform interchange. It would be more advantageous for the majority of customers

 

[cjp]

I am surprised there is no plan for the fast services to call at ealing broadway for cross platform interchange. It would be more advantageous for the majority of customers

No because it is not cross platform with the up fast platformed across from the down relief. Everything else is a get off and walk so it is better to do this at Paddington.

 

[coppercapped]

I am surprised there is no plan for the fast services to call at ealing broadway for cross platform interchange. It would be more advantageous for the majority of customers

Cross platform?

Have you ever been there?

 

[matt_world2004]

Cross platform?

Have you ever been there?

Yes have you? The platforms are next to each other a two minute walk, compared to the 8 minutes at Paddington and on Sundays it is the same platform

 

[causton]

Yes have you? The platforms are next to each other a two minute walk, compared to the 8 minutes at Paddington and on Sundays it is the same platform

Cross-platform means level interchange without going up and down steps.

 

[nw1]

Crossrail simply takes over existing services operated by GWR, except they go down the rabbit hole at Westbourne Park instead of in/out of the terminus at Paddington. I don’t know what you expect to change with HEx - merely a different type of unit in a different livery, working the same timetable as now. Barring a few different ECS moves, there will be no change to the GWR main line timetable.

I thought there were going to be significant changes, e.g. the half-hourly(?) fast to Bristol TM via Bristol Parkway; the two-hourly Exeter semi-fast; Didcot Paddington services making less stops than now between Reading and London (as Crossrail will take over the all-stations and almost-all-stations services) and maybe additional fasts to Newbury - not to mention a recast of the actual departure times from Paddington. Are these not happening now during winter 18/19?

For one thing I'd have thought the Didcot locals moving to the fast lines on arrival of Crossrail would more or less force a recast of the main line timetable even if the additional services aren't immediately introduced.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

I thought there were going to be significant changes, e.g. the half-hourly(?) fast to Bristol TM via Bristol Parkway; the two-hourly Exeter semi-fast; Didcot Paddington services making less stops than now between Reading and London (as Crossrail will take over the all-stations and almost-all-stations services) and maybe additional fasts to Newbury - not to mention a recast of the actual departure times from Paddington. Are these not happening now during winter 18/19?

For one thing I'd have thought the Didcot locals moving to the fast lines on arrival of Crossrail would more or less force a recast of the main line timetable even if the additional services aren't immediately introduced.

Yes, other than Crossrail and the semi-fast ‘residuals’ this all happens from early 2018. The idea is that the ML timetable will not be recast further when Dec 19 happens. There is currently some discussion about what form the residual off-peak services will take. DfT and GWR want them retained, but whether they are fast paths on the ML, slower paths along the RL or something else entirely remains to be seen, and Network Rail will ultimately have the final say.

 

[ATW158Xpress]

Looks GWR are deferred the changes back to May 2019 by reading other trends rencently.

 

[cactustwirly]

I am surprised there is no plan for the fast services to call at ealing broadway for cross platform interchange. It would be more advantageous for the majority of customers

There isn't the capacity for on the mains to do this, and it would seriously slow down intercity journies.

 

[PHILIPE]

Everything has been overtaken by new events nationwide:-

www.railforums.co.uk/threads/december-2018-timetable-changes-now-confirmed-scrapped-contagion-spreads.166907