GWR Class 800

[Bletchleyite]

Despite controversial opinions on the 800, would you be happy if there were plans to replace the current XC stock with IEPs on the CrossCountry route?

They seem much better than Voyagers so I can't see much dissent likely there.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Agreed.
As others have posted, any significant acceleration of services between Waterloo and Exeter seems unlikely due to the constraints imposed by the route and infrastructure.
However "proper mainline trains" does not just mean faster.
A proper main line train is gangwayed along the whole train, has a buffet, and possibly a restaurant, has largely facing seats across decent size tables, ample stowage for cycles, surfboards and bulky luggage, and first class at one end.

A cobbled together collection of DMUs simply does not feel like a proper mainline or inter city train.
Not certain that an 800 or derivative thereof is much better than the present DMUs.

Exactly! I wasn't saying they should be faster! I was just saying because they take so long they should have better IC trains!

 

[Agent_Squash]

Exactly! I wasn't saying they should be faster! I was just saying because they take so long they should have better IC trains!

But Weymouth isn’t an intercity route, and Exeter already has an IC service? TOCs can’t just make a service intercity because they want to - and besides, they’re both too slow for it.

 

[The Planner]

Has one done the Newquay branch yet? If not, that will be the last part of the network it needs to get done. That's if it's covered Hereford yet?

Have they done the Marches, Banbury, Chepstow and Cheltenham to Worcester yet? There are a lot of diversionary routes listed for them to cover, such as Tondu and Swansea district as well as above.

 

[broadgage]

Despite controversial opinions on the 800, would you be happy if there were plans to replace the current XC stock with IEPs on the CrossCountry route?

Many of my criticisms of the IEPs may be summarised by stating that I expect them to be rather like voyagers, cramped seating, not aligned with windows, few tables, limited luggage space and so on.
I also expect that the raised floors will make them feel claustrophobic. and be an impediment to the trolley service.

I doubt that IEPs will be much worse than voyagers, but I don't expect them to be much better either.

 

[Bornin1980s]

Many of my criticisms of the IEPs may be summarised by stating that I expect them to be rather like voyagers, cramped seating, not aligned with windows, few tables, limited luggage space and so on.
I also expect that the raised floors will make them feel claustrophobic. and be an impediment to the trolley service.

I doubt that IEPs will be much worse than voyagers, but I don't expect them to be much better either.

The non-tilt profile should at least improve the feeling of space, compared to the Voyagers.

 

[800001]

Many of my criticisms of the IEPs may be summarised by stating that I expect them to be rather like voyagers, cramped seating, not aligned with windows, few tables, limited luggage space and so on.
I also expect that the raised floors will make them feel claustrophobic. and be an impediment to the trolley service.

I doubt that IEPs will be much worse than voyagers, but I don't expect them to be much better either.

Leg room is good, im 6ft 4" and in airline seat i have plenty of room. Same amount of tables as HST/MK4s i seem to recall.
The 'raised floor'is hardly noticable, you only notice it as we know about it.

 

[devonexpress]

Many of my criticisms of the IEPs may be summarised by stating that I expect them to be rather like voyagers, cramped seating, not aligned with windows, few tables, limited luggage space and so on.
I also expect that the raised floors will make them feel claustrophobic. and be an impediment to the trolley service.

I doubt that IEPs will be much worse than voyagers, but I don't expect them to be much better either.

For god sake the trains haven't even had their first paying passengers yet! Besides the 800 is a completely different model to that of the Voyagers, in reality the 800 should be compared with a 395 Javelin.

On another note, from this video (skip too 0:07 to hear) but the Class 800s seem just as quiet as a HST mark 3, or at the very least a Class 180. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0b3CIGz5NrU

 

[leomartin125]

For god sake the trains haven't even had their first paying passengers yet! Besides the 800 is a completely different model to that of the Voyagers, in reality the 800 should be compared with a 395 Javelin.

On another note, from this video (skip too 0:07 to hear) but the Class 800s seem just as quiet as a HST mark 3, or at the very least a Class 180. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0b3CIGz5NrU

As can be seen in my video showing 800003 passing Maidenhead twice today, to Swindon in the morning on driver training, and returning from driver training this afternoon, the train makes very little noise on diesel as it passes at high speed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nx0aJi6dBlM

 

[BestWestern]

Have they done the Marches, Banbury, Chepstow and Cheltenham to Worcester yet? There are a lot of diversionary routes listed for them to cover, such as Tondu and Swansea district as well as above.

Unlikely to need Banbury now, unless GWR want to use them on a service to there. The diversion is now via Oxford Parkway & Bicester Village.

 

[The Planner]

Down as a route to be cleared though and I don't recall seeing anything but the Wycombe Single being cleared on the Chilterns.

 

[47802]

Many of my criticisms of the IEPs may be summarised by stating that I expect them to be rather like voyagers, cramped seating, not aligned with windows, few tables, limited luggage space and so on.
I also expect that the raised floors will make them feel claustrophobic. and be an impediment to the trolley service.

I doubt that IEPs will be much worse than voyagers, but I don't expect them to be much better either.

What nonsense the raised floor is so minimal you will probably hardly notice it, they don't have tilt profile sides, I think the main justifiable comment is the use of sliding doors and the 4 seats next to the door pocket with no view and arm rests.

 

[RichmondCommu]

What nonsense the raised floor is so minimal you will probably hardly notice it, they don't have tilt profile sides, I think the main justifiable comment is the use of sliding doors and the 4 seats next to the door pocket with no view and arm rests.

As long as you can charge a phone / tablet this really shouldn't be too much of an issue. I would have no qualms in sitting there if the train was packed to the rafters. In my opinion a seat is a seat.

 

[D1009]

Many of my criticisms of the IEPs may be summarised by stating that I expect them to be rather like voyagers, cramped seating, not aligned with windows, few tables, limited luggage space and so on.
I also expect that the raised floors will make them feel claustrophobic. and be an impediment to the trolley service.

I doubt that IEPs will be much worse than voyagers, but I don't expect them to be much better either.

So your criticisms are all based on expectations. Have you considered going and looking at one from the outside? There are a few of them about on test and driver training, and RTT will give you an idea where to find them and when.

Or are you on a mission to criticise them from a viewpoint of ignorance at every opportunity.

 

[Adsy125]

Has an IEP done the Frome loop yet? And are there any plans for one to visit Weymouth so they could replace the Weymouth Wizard?

 

[deltic08]

Have they done the Marches, Banbury, Chepstow and Cheltenham to Worcester yet? There are a lot of diversionary routes listed for them to cover, such as Tondu and Swansea district as well as above.

Severn Tunnel Junction-Gloucester was done about 3am 28th June but I saw no report of a run in the opposite direction.

 

[D1009]

Has an IEP done the Frome loop yet? And are there any plans for one to visit Weymouth so they could replace the Weymouth Wizard?

The answer to the first question is yes, and the second one no. For more info see post #3211 from 9 months ago.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

So your criticisms are all based on expectations. Have you considered going and looking at one from the outside?

I did that at Reading today! Compared to the GWR Hsts:

Space/Leg Room: Improvement
Standard class seats: Improvement
First class seats: Disappointment

Very modern, very swish. I love them, it's just first class that looks awful. Then again, it is not the finalised interior.

 

[jimm]

Have they done the Marches, Banbury, Chepstow and Cheltenham to Worcester yet? There are a lot of diversionary routes listed for them to cover, such as Tondu and Swansea district as well as above.

Newport-Hereford (and Hereford-Worcester) - not yet
Newport-Gloucester - yes
Bristol-Gloucester-Cheltenham-Worcester - yes, two workings on consecutive nights last month that also ran along the Cotswold Line to Oxford, one of these also did Westbury-Bath on its way back to the depot
Oxford-Banbury - not yet, I expect it will be covered at some point, even if regular services look unlikely

In South Wales someone posted previously that there has been a visit to the Vale of Glamorgan Line but I think Tondu and Swansea District are still on the to do list. Last week's first run to Carmarthen stuck to the main line both ways.

 

[jimm]

So your criticisms are all based on expectations. Have you considered going and looking at one from the outside? There are a few of them about on test and driver training, and RTT will give you an idea where to find them and when.

Or are you on a mission to criticise them from a viewpoint of ignorance at every opportunity.

He has been on a mission to criticise the 800s on much the same grounds both here and in another forum for several years now, irrespective of anything that is said to the contrary.

 

[leomartin125]

I did that at Reading today! Compared to the GWR Hsts:

Space/Leg Room: Improvement
Standard class seats: Improvement
First class seats: Disappointment

Very modern, very swish. I love them, it's just first class that looks awful. Then again, it is not the finalised interior.

I have done exactly that, and the seats aren't that bad, so any thoughts about presuming they will be horrible based on nothing but conjecture would be wrong. I have also sat in a standard class IET seat and it's not bad, I wouldn't complain on a Bristol or a Swansea run at all. I may have an opportunity in the future before they enter service to try them out for real whilst the train is moving, and if so I will definitely provide some real opinions.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've sat in the Standard seats (they're the same ones as ScotRail are using for 1st on the new EMUs) and they are decent enough, though quite hard, so if your preference (unlike mine) is for soft seats you won't like them.

They are quite low-backed, so those who dislike the claustrophobic effect of the Grammer seating in the HSTs will approve.

The GWR green strip breaks up the monotony of the grey a bit.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Voyager haters watch out! The seats are all completely plastic backed!

 

[swt_passenger]

He has been on a mission to criticise the 800s on much the same grounds both here and in another forum for several years now, irrespective of anything that is said to the contrary.

Yes, even when the seating dimensions from the spec have been quoted, and the number of tables have been shown in photographs, they have been completely ignored, as they don't support his criticism. It gets very repetitive...

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I love the 800s from what I've seen. So swish, so modern. Ok, so what they weren't made here? At least they look like 21st Century Trains!

 

[Agent_Squash]

I love the 800s from what I've seen. So swish, so modern. Ok, so what they weren't made here? At least they look like 21st Century Trains!

They’re not *made* here, but there’s certainly Newton Aycliffe...

 

[RichmondCommu]

I love the 800s from what I've seen. So swish, so modern. Ok, so what they weren't made here? At least they look like 21st Century Trains!

Sports sock at the ready?

 

[dp21]

I have done exactly that, and the seats aren't that bad, so any thoughts about presuming they will be horrible based on nothing but conjecture would be wrong. I have also sat in a standard class IET seat and it's not bad, I wouldn't complain on a Bristol or a Swansea run at all. I may have an opportunity in the future before they enter service to try them out for real whilst the train is moving, and if so I will definitely provide some real opinions.

Is it just me or do the seats look very 395-esque?

I'm sorry if that's been covered before.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Is it just me or do the seats look very 395-esque?

I'm sorry if that's been covered before.

I couldn't agree more. They have more padding though.

 

[leomartin125]

Is it just me or do the seats look very 395-esque?

I'm sorry if that's been covered before.

In the cab, the second mans seat I'm pretty sure has been taken out of a 395 and plopped in there! Exactly the same. The seating in the IET's is a bit different to the Javelin, definitely built for more wear and tear and longer journey times.

Class 800 Cab and Class 395 Standard Class Interior below for reference.