Halifax revamp moves a step closer

[Greetlander]

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/new...go-multi-million-pound-regeneration-1-9065767

Although it’s early days this is great news. Ironic for me given my first thread, only last week, was about the historical slashing of facilities in the 1970’s.

I wonder sometimes if stakeholders ever look at a bigger picture. It’s not that long ago that the disused main building and platform was taken over by Eureka after years of disuse. Almost immediately the debate started about reopening the now unavailable platform, and I imagine this will only add expense.

Also, given the recently noted aspiration to build a Bradford to Manchester route, would you think that any expensive rebuild may be planned to accomodate such a line, were it to arrive in the next couple of decades?

 

[SilentGrade]

I can see the re-opening of the platform being canned with the funding shortfall. As you say it will only add expense especially considering that when I last looked, it wasn't in the greatest condition.

 

[Greetlander]

The cynic in me can see it all being canned, or at least a much reduced project. The third platform has been a blight on the landscape for 50 years, its reopening would be glorious, but nothing ever goes smoothly.

 

[Bertie the bus]

I’m not sure what the point of reopening platform 3 would be other than making the station look a bit more cared for. Are there plans to terminate trains at Halifax? It isn’t a particularly logical place to do that in my opinion.

That article puts forward as one of the reasons to do it as the station has fallen behind the economic growth of the town. An alternative way of looking at it is if the town has experienced economic growth then the station isn’t holding it back so is this a wise way to spend £30 million?

 

[Greetlander]

There is vague talk of Halifax to Leeds shuttles, although I suspect that any reopening would be geared towards the possibility of an increased number of services funnelling in to what is currently a fairly cramped island platform. I’m saying this without any evidence mind you.

There’s also the issue of reopening a grand station building but leaving a trackless platform attached to it.

 

[lejog]

The main driver for wanting to reopen the old platform is that the initial plans show this becoming the main platform for eastbound trains, with the main entrance relocated here and a bus station for town buses built next to it. However there are aspirations to run a "metro" frequency service between Halifax and Leeds and to reopen stations along the route.

http://news.calderdale.gov.uk/transforming-transport-in-halifax/

The Council has considered a number of design options in partnership with Network Rail, Northern and other organisations. The concept design being recommended for Cabinet approval includes:

• A proposed new station at platform level
• A transport interchange combining all modes of travel to and from the station
• Replacement of the station access bridge with an attractive landscaped entrance to the new station
• A new car park and drop-off, pick-up and taxi points
• Reopening the third platform in front of the ‘1855 building’
• New areas for shops or food and drink businesses

Accessibility for everyone, including step-free access, is a key feature of the design, as well as the blend of old and new. The proposals include a modern glass façade for the main building, combined with preserved historic features such as the existing stone arches supporting the access bridge.

 

[Andyh82]

There is no way that the bus companies will extend their commercial services to the proposed interchange without external funding, which won’t be forthcoming there wasn’t even a free town bus in Halifax.

It’ll be like when additional and better bus stops were provided at Huddersfield, and the overall result, after a few years was the same buses serving the station as they always have done.

 

[Bertie the bus]

However there are aspirations to run a "metro" frequency service between Halifax and Leeds and to reopen stations along the route.

Whose aspiration? I thought Leeds station was operating pretty much at capacity so how is a metro frequency from Halifax going to work, have Network Rail agreed to this, and how will it be funded?

 

[lejog]

Whose aspiration? I thought Leeds station was operating pretty much at capacity so how is a metro frequency from Halifax going to work, have Network Rail agreed to this, and how will it be funded?

To answer your questions 1)A WYCA/Bradford/ Calderdale aspiration. 2) To the interested observer they seem more than aware 3) Various sources.

There have been no grand announcements, but some of the necessary infrastructure upgrades to increase capacity are already being implemented, will the rest follow? There were four upgrades identified to be necessary to support a more frequent Halifa-Leeds service:

• Halifax to Bradford resignalling. Currently underway. Northern Hub funding
• Bradford Interchange remodelling. Due later this year, NR funded
• Halifax 3rd platform. WYCA/council/TBD funding
• Leeds Station. Obviously a problem, but is Leeds full? There will be a further 8-10tph using the station in the next year under current franchise plans and further capacity upgrades are due early in CP6.

 

[Halifaxlad]

There is no way that the bus companies will extend their commercial services to the proposed interchange without external funding, which won’t be forthcoming there wasn’t even a free town bus in Halifax.

It’ll be like when additional and better bus stops were provided at Huddersfield, and the overall result, after a few years was the same buses serving the station as they always have done.

Consideration is being given to the pedestrianization of Market St, that will funnel bus services down Horton and a lot closer to the railway station! Although currently it is yet unclear whenever or not this decision has been made.

 

[Halifaxlad]

According to the document entitled "PR13 Initial Industry Plan Supporting Document/Definition of proposed CP5 enhancements" that was previously available from Network Rail's own website. I downloaded it a while ago so I don't know if it is still available to download.

It does state on page 109 on the page with the heading 'Halifax Station Capacity' that...

"the Yorkshire & Humber RUS (option CV1) identified the need for an additional hourly passenger shuttle service between Halifax and Leeds to cope with future passenger growth forecasts;"

it also states...

"The output driver of this scheme is to provide a turnback facility at Halifax, facing Leeds, which will improve capacity, performance and journey times between Halifax, Bradford and Leeds to meet RUS and Northern Hub outputs and to meet passenger growth forecasts"

Your thoughts please gentlemen?

 

[IanXC]

"The output driver of this scheme is to provide a turnback facility at Halifax, facing Leeds, which will improve capacity, performance and journey times between Halifax, Bradford and Leeds to meet RUS and Northern Hub outputs and to meet passenger growth forecasts"

Your thoughts please gentlemen?

Immediate thought is that there already is a turnback facility at Halifax.

 

[Halifaxlad]

Immediate thought is that there already is a turnback facility at Halifax.

I know but from my understanding for some reason they felt that it required a central turn-back in order to remove crossing conflicts. Which is probably useful considering how unreliable the service is along this line. I just don't know whenever or not this is still being delivered by Network Rail? I do know that the current plan for Halifax station doesn't include a third platform with track, just widening it out probably in the event that this doesn't get delivered.

 

[Greetlander]

I realise there are busier stations operating with only two platforms, but given the aspiration to double passenger numbers, the huge improvement to services on the way (assuming Northern doesn't collapse in a heap first) and the future proofing that. may be required to introduce "shuttle" services in either direction, would it not be terribly short sighted to build out platform 3 and retain only two working platforms?

 

[yorksrob]

Why build out platform 3 in the first place. If you´re renewing the main building, but only operating two platforms surely the answer is to slew the eastbound running line so that Bradford services use the new platform while Westbound services use the island.

That way Bradford passengers get ground level access, overcrowding is avoided and an additional centre platform can be added in future if needed.

 

[Halifaxlad]

The idea of building out platform 3 is simply because the Council want to bring the third platform back into use but don't want to spend £8.5 million in order to do so!

What I don't get is that Network Rail have recently (within the past two years) completed a Manchester facing turn-back at Rochdale. Although I'm pretty sure that Halifax see's more trains, Leeds - Manchester, Preston & Huddersfield all ran by Northern and Bradford to London services ran by Grand Central. Apparently the justification behind the one at Rochdale was down to 'benefits to timetabling from terminating services being able to run straight into the platform'.

 

[lammergeier]

I know but from my understanding for some reason they felt that it required a central turn-back in order to remove crossing conflicts. Which is probably useful considering how unreliable the service is along this line. I just don't know whenever or not this is still being delivered by Network Rail? I do know that the current plan for Halifax station doesn't include a third platform with track, just widening it out probably in the event that this doesn't get delivered.

It would save quite a bit of time though as currently the train has to be checked to ensure it is empty, dispatched, totter into the sidings at 5mph, change ends, totter out at 5mph and load pax. With a turnback the pax can load and unload whilst guard and driver change ends and no need for a slow speed move into and out of sidings.

 

[Halifaxlad]

It would save quite a bit of time though as currently the train has to be checked to ensure it is empty, dispatched, totter into the sidings at 5mph, change ends, totter out at 5mph and load pax. With a turnback the pax can load and unload whilst guard and driver change ends and no need for a slow speed move into and out of sidings.

Aye, save time running straight into it too! Not to mention once Bradford's long awaited connection get built, the Calder Valley through Halifax may even see freight trains. Will more than likely need it then! Really want to know why it was scrapped by Network Rail?

 

[NorthernSpirit]

There is no way that the bus companies will extend their commercial services to the proposed interchange without external funding, which won’t be forthcoming there wasn’t even a free town bus in Halifax.

It’ll be like when additional and better bus stops were provided at Huddersfield, and the overall result, after a few years was the same buses serving the station as they always have done.

The only way bus companies will serve the railway station would be if Halifax bus station was closed and shunted down to the railway station, thereby creating a Halifax Interchange where all services would start and terminate.

Should this platform 3 be built, I can only imagine it being a short platform that will only just fit in a two coach DMU.

 

[modernrail]

The station at Halifax is sub-standard and ha been for years. 3 platforms seems like the minimum required for operational resilience and the passenger environment is dreadful for a major town. I massively support the idea of the eastbound platform (which is the main 'waiting' platform for passenger flows at this station) moving to the restored platform with a proper station building as its entry point. I would keep westbound trains where they are and then use the current eastbound for flexibility and maybe eventually a metro.

As for the bus station - time to stop messing about. Unless there is clear evidence passengers prefer the current location I would move the bus station to sit alongside the train station with a good town centre route coming from it to help the elderly and less abled to get around the town centre. I used to live in Brighouse many years ago and the situation in Halifax was a mess then - it has not got any better.

 

[LDECRexile]

Terminating trains inevitably lower platform utilisation or require the likes of turnback sidings.

A proposed Leeds-Halifax shuttle could be served by running in a horseshoe : Leeds-Bradford-Halifax-Brighouse-Dewsbury-Leeds (or ...Brighouse-Wakefield Kirkgate-Leeds) and vice versa, expanding the range of communities joined by direct trains and meaning Leeds was the only terminus, which it would be in any event.

 

[Mollman]

What I don't get is that Network Rail have recently (within the past two years) completed a Manchester facing turn-back at Rochdale. Although I'm pretty sure that Halifax see's more trains, Leeds - Manchester, Preston & Huddersfield all ran by Northern and Bradford to London services ran by Grand Central. Apparently the justification behind the one at Rochdale was down to 'benefits to timetabling from terminating services being able to run straight into the platform'.

Rochdale is now the terminal point for the half-hourly service from Blackburn via Victoria. The associated speed improvements were related more to the through platforms in anticipation of diversions from the Transpennine Route Upgrade.

 

[lejog]

Yes Rochdale now has 6tph while Halifax has 4tph, with each probably seeing a new Liverpool service next year.

The funding for the Rochdale new platform came from the Northern Hub project in order to reduce terminators from the west at Victoria.The Calder Valley Journey Time Improvement project is also Northern Hub funded and comprises two phases - the first south of Rochdale already completed, the second Todmorden to Bradford ongoing.

The Northern Hub improvements were approved seperately from TPE electrification and despite what NR write were nothing to do with them and no part of their business case. Sprinter differentials apply to the Rochdale improvements with TPE's 185s seeing no increases.

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Sprinter differentials apply to the Rochdale improvements with TPE's 185s seeing no increases.

Not Sprinter (SP) differentials - they are Multiple Unit (MU); two different classifications (all SP are MU, but MU includes many more classes than SP does). There is no justification now for SP, it was a low-cost workround introduced by British Rail to avoid track renewals.

 

[edwin_m]

Not Sprinter (SP) differentials - they are Multiple Unit (MU); two different classifications (all SP are MU, but MU includes many more classes than SP does). There is no justification now for SP, it was a low-cost workround introduced by British Rail to avoid track renewals.

I'm pretty sure 185s can't use MU differentials either (though the Rule Book and the Sectional Appendix each claim the other contains the actual list of classes...).

 

[Crossover]

Isn't Halifax already bi-di to allow turnback within the platform rather than in the siding?

 

[Joseph_Locke]

I'm pretty sure 185s can't use MU differentials either (though the Rule Book and the Sectional Appendix each claim the other contains the actual list of classes...).

Correct. 185s are not multiple units, despite all visual evidence to the contrary - its an axleweight issue, I understand.

 

[SilentGrade]

Isn't Halifax already bi-di to allow turnback within the platform rather than in the siding?

Indeed it is

 

[Halifaxlad]

As for the bus station - time to stop messing about. Unless there is clear evidence passengers prefer the current location I would move the bus station to sit alongside the train station with a good town centre route coming from it to help the elderly and less abled to get around the town centre. I used to live in Brighouse many years ago and the situation in Halifax was a mess then - it has not got any better.

If it was built upon a deck adjacent to the existing high level station entrance that in my opinion should be kept, although not necessarily the existing building then I would be more favorable towards it moving. But when the railway station is already out at the bottom edge of the town centre I can't see how moving the bus station they're will serve the town effectively. Probably great for those travelling by bus across Calderdale, but not those visiting Halifax.

 

[Tractor37]

Platform 3 won't be happening as the nursery currently occupying the building requested NR to find another building suitable, none were, so as they own the building have said no we don't want to sell (from a manager who lives in the town).