Heathrow Express Slashes Fares

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Bletchleyite

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Why should local residents pay a charge to Heathrow for driving to their homes. The Ubers are there because for a family or group of people a taxi is cheaper to central London than than it is to get the Heathrow express
And the public urination issues (not exclusive to Uber) are caused by the non-provision of public toilets in the UK.
 

matt_world2004

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But there is nothing saying a C-charge would have to cover that entire area, just as the London congestion charge does not cover the entirety of the area where TfL has a remit over roads.
It's not where TfL has remit over the roads, the congestion charge would be levelled by the airport and would be in areas where the airport has remit over the roads which includes the whole area that is covered by the aiports bylaws.
 

Failed Unit

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The problem with many areas the public transport isn’t that great to get to Heathrow.

combination of Hex / Tube / train.

many others are bus / train

not ideal for lots of bags. I know they are looking at improvements from the west and south in particular but alternatives to the car not great for Heathrow. Even if they put a £10 per car drop off charge, it will still be cheaper and more comfortable then standing on the HeX.
 

matt_world2004

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They can, like any other driver, park anywhere where parking is neither prohibited nor restricted.
As a pre-booked service they are not allowed to just randomly wait on roads. In fact the private hire guidelines state they should be operating from out of a premises for their bookings.
 

Bletchleyite

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It's not where TfL has remit over the roads, the congestion charge would be levelled by the airport and would be in areas where the airport has remit over the roads which includes the whole area that is covered by the aiports bylaws.
No, you misunderstand.

The area where the airport has a remit is the maximum area over which it could impose a C-charge.

It could, at its option, impose one over a smaller area within that area, just as TfL has done in central London.
 

Tetchytyke

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TBH, a pick up/drop off charge is basically that.
And the eye-watering waiting charges that airports charge- as a revenue-generator- are why the local streets around most airports are full of families or taxis waiting to pick people up off flights. An hour's parking at Heathrow is £11.30!

Most people there use cars because, even in London, it's more convenient. If HEx was in zone 6 I'd still have driven to Heathrow from Hemel Hempstead...
 

Flinn Reed

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Since TFL planned to add additional Crossrail services to Heathrow serving Terminal 5, what does the future look like for Heathrow Express?

The 2tph that will serve T5 are likely to effectively be an express service, but with one additional call at Ealing Broadway (as well as continuing beyond Paddington). Though less frequent than the 4tph Heathrow Express, these 2tph will still have the same fares as the stopping services from T4, significantly cheaper than the express without booking far in advance.

The only real advantage left of the Express is the comfort of services - however this is aimed at business travellers, who are likely to prefer Crossrail as a direct link to the West End, the City or Canary Wharf.

Could we eventually see the Heathrow Express withdrawn in favour of an additional 4tph Elizabeth Line to T5 (by extending some of the Paddington-terminating services)?
 

Joe Paxton

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Since TFL planned to add additional Crossrail services to Heathrow serving Terminal 5, what does the future look like for Heathrow Express?
...
People have been mooting this very question for the past 10+ years!

My answer is let's just see how things play out, which I suspect is the approach of HAL/HAH.
 

matt_world2004

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Since TFL planned to add additional Crossrail services to Heathrow serving Terminal 5, what does the future look like for Heathrow Express?

The 2tph that will serve T5 are likely to effectively be an express service, but with one additional call at Ealing Broadway (as well as continuing beyond Paddington). Though less frequent than the 4tph Heathrow Express, these 2tph will still have the same fares as the stopping services from T4, significantly cheaper than the express without booking far in advance.

The only real advantage left of the Express is the comfort of services - however this is aimed at business travellers, who are likely to prefer Crossrail as a direct link to the West End, the City or Canary Wharf.

Could we eventually see the Heathrow Express withdrawn in favour of an additional 4tph Elizabeth Line to T5 (by extending some of the Paddington-terminating services)?
According to London reconnections all Heathrow services will stop using an all stations Heathrow to Ealing Broadway service pattern and will skip Acton Mainline.
 

Horizon22

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People say HEx is mugging off passengers and tourists would know better - there are still loads at Victoria who ask about the GX services depsite being only 5-10 mins faster than the equivalent Southern (and the first to get cancelled). They're still doing a pretty rousing trade on these services with unsuspecting (or in many cases specifically asking!) foreign tourists.

I doubt HEx will see a significantly decreased trade due to Crossrail, but this may be one to "wait and see" including how well both get promoted and what staff at Paddington start to routinely advise.
 

cactustwirly

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Since TFL planned to add additional Crossrail services to Heathrow serving Terminal 5, what does the future look like for Heathrow Express?

The 2tph that will serve T5 are likely to effectively be an express service, but with one additional call at Ealing Broadway (as well as continuing beyond Paddington). Though less frequent than the 4tph Heathrow Express, these 2tph will still have the same fares as the stopping services from T4, significantly cheaper than the express without booking far in advance.

The only real advantage left of the Express is the comfort of services - however this is aimed at business travellers, who are likely to prefer Crossrail as a direct link to the West End, the City or Canary Wharf.

Could we eventually see the Heathrow Express withdrawn in favour of an additional 4tph Elizabeth Line to T5 (by extending some of the Paddington-terminating services)?
No there is no capacity to do that, it's HEx or nowt.
The portal for XR is on the relief line side, so in order for the Crossrail to use HEx paths they would have to cross over to the mainlines.
 

matt_world2004

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Have they? Do you have a source for this? Given there's no capacity at all on the Relief Lines for HEx, would be a surprising statement from them.
London and South East Route Utilisation Strategy (L&SE RUS) published by Network Rail in July 2011. Here the future requirements for peak passenger flows on the Great Western route to/from London lead to a suggestion that Heathrow Express be shunted to the Relief Lines to allow a 20 trains per hour (tph) service on the main (fast) lines, all serving the Thames Valley and beyond instead of Heathrow Airport.
https://www.northstarconsultancy.co...roads-in-great-western-franchise-consultation
 

Kite159

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London and South East Route Utilisation Strategy (L&SE RUS) published by Network Rail in July 2011. Here the future requirements for peak passenger flows on the Great Western route to/from London lead to a suggestion that Heathrow Express be shunted to the Relief Lines to allow a 20 trains per hour (tph) service on the main (fast) lines, all serving the Thames Valley and beyond instead of Heathrow Airport.
https://www.northstarconsultancy.co...roads-in-great-western-franchise-consultation
I dare say the railway in 2019 is different than the railway in 2011.

Having Heathrow Express on the mains allows Slough calls for the Oxford services.
 

matt_world2004

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I dare say the railway in 2019 is different than the railway in 2011.

Having Heathrow Express on the mains allows Slough calls for the Oxford services.
Yes in 2019 when the route utilisation strategy was written has increased demand for journeys beyond reading requiring higher frequency services on the mains.
 

Ianno87

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London and South East Route Utilisation Strategy (L&SE RUS) published by Network Rail in July 2011. Here the future requirements for peak passenger flows on the Great Western route to/from London lead to a suggestion that Heathrow Express be shunted to the Relief Lines to allow a 20 trains per hour (tph) service on the main (fast) lines, all serving the Thames Valley and beyond instead of Heathrow Airport.
https://www.northstarconsultancy.co...roads-in-great-western-franchise-consultation
That's a suggestion of a future capacity-trade off/choice made 8 years ago, not 'wanting for years'.

This is not repeated in the more recent Great Western Route Study.
 

JN114

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HX have committed to the current contractual arrangement with GWR for the next 10 (well, 9 now) years - at not inconsiderable cost. Their renewed track access agreement required that commitment.

2028 would be the natural contractual breakpoint if Heathrow really want out; however they're confident enough to have paid or committed to pay GWR all this money. On top of that they're as indicated looking to drop some fares; again underlining their confidence in their market share (they can make enough to pay GWR and their own staff from existing and expected market share despite lower fare pot).

Heathrow Express has thrived over the past 21 years - I concede partly driven by the premium fares. But in the face of considerable competition, including that which it partly introduced against itself with its operating share in Heathrow Connect, ridership has continued to rise.

Crossrail will encourage new customer growth at the Airport, make no mistake. But those betting on a mass exodus of passengers to Crossrail when that finally opens will I squarely believe be sorely disappointed.
 

CyrusWuff

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And the eye-watering waiting charges that airports charge- as a revenue-generator- are why the local streets around most airports are full of families or taxis waiting to pick people up off flights. An hour's parking at Heathrow is £11.30!
<panto> Oh no it isn't! </panto>

Private vehicles can park in the Long Stay car parks at Heathrow for up to 2 hours free of charge. See: https://www.heathrow.com/transport-and-directions/heathrow-parking/heathrow-long-stay-parking

Granted you'll have to pay if you want to park in the short stay or "fast track" parking areas (£7.50 for up to 1 hour in the short stay car parks, £13 for up to 2 hours in the fast track ones), and there's a dedicated area for pre-booked private hire vehicles and taxis to wait, which is £1 per hour for the first five hours.
 

Tetchytyke

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Private vehicles can park in the Long Stay car parks at Heathrow for up to 2 hours free of charge.
True, but neither use nor ornament if you're there to pick someone up, it's a long old shuttle bus ride to and from the terminal. I've done it once and only just got back to the car in time, and that was off a domestic flight. Private hires are, of course, banned from there.

The prices for short stay have gone up by 70p since my post, which goes to prove my point even more!
 

Joe Paxton

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True, but neither use nor ornament if you're there to pick someone up, it's a long old shuttle bus ride to and from the terminal. I've done it once and only just got back to the car in time, and that was off a domestic flight. ...
I've done a pick-up before from the long stay, they've caught shuttle bus from the terminal under their own steam. Worked out fine, but I grant you it's not quite the same as greeting people at the arrivals hall.

Otherwise there are a number of places to wait in a car near Heathrow without being on a residential street.waiting

You're not supposed to, but if both parties are on the ball it is possible to do a pick-up at the drop-off area at Heathrow. Definitely no waiting there though!
 

GodAtum

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People say HEx is mugging off passengers and tourists would know better - there are still loads at Victoria who ask about the GX services depsite being only 5-10 mins faster than the equivalent Southern (and the first to get cancelled). They're still doing a pretty rousing trade on these services with unsuspecting (or in many cases specifically asking!) foreign tourists.

I doubt HEx will see a significantly decreased trade due to Crossrail, but this may be one to "wait and see" including how well both get promoted and what staff at Paddington start to routinely advise.
I would prefer if holiday makers took the HEX or GatEx rather than take up space on commuter trains.
 

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