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How far is 60 minutes?

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DriverEight

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There's a huge amount of posts on here about travelling time to work, and most companies seem work on the principle that you must live within 60 minutes of your place of work. That begs the question how far is a reasonable travelling distance in 60 mins? I live in Sunderland and if I drove like a maniac I could maybe scrape into York, 70 miles away, in sixty mins. On the other hand, in London you'd do well to cover 15 miles in an hour. Grand Central recruiting in Bradford means people in Manchester and Sheffield are within 45 miles of Bradford Station, but could you do that in rush hour? Almost certainly not. So, how is 60 minutes travel calculated?
 
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Martin93

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I’ve heard they just use google maps. Your address to the place of work
 

DriverEight

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I’ve heard they just use google maps. Your address to the place of work
That's a bit random. Google maps uses traffic flow data to calculate travel times. My current commute is 12 miles but my tavel time according to Google varies between 15 minutes and 35 minutes, depending on the time of day.
 

Stigy

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They do indeed simply use Google Maps (or similar). What other way would be reasonable? Seems the fairest way. I guess in inner city areas they may take public transport in to consideration?

It probably is more to do with mileage rather than time, but the two often go hand in hand. And the only way they’re likely to understand how far a post code is from the work location is by using a mapping system. For example, it’s probably unreasonable to decline somebody based on living in central London, if they have a London post code. Not many people I’d imagine actually drive to work within London, and in fact come from outside London, that being the case, 99% of the travel to and from work would probably, quite reasonably, be undertaken by train.
 
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DriverEight

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I wonder how many applications have been rejected because applicants think they are within 60 minutes, but companies disagree. Or how many applicants have said "I live 80 miles away, but I have a very fast motorbike!"
 
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I'm borderline with a few companies due to the 1 hr rule. When I lived near Bilbrook train station (Wolverhampton) I just about fell within the time criteria for EMR Derby or any TOC/FOC with a depot in Crewe. I moved 2 miles west and now think an app for EMR would be filed in their confidential waste.
Also worth remembering that a commute at 4am would be a breeze compared to one at 8am.
Edit: ian_sayer beat me to the last point
 

Stigy

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To add as well, within city centres, there’s generally a far better public transport infrastructure 24 hours a day, therefore if you live in say London, and have any London Post Code, it wouldn’t matter so much about time it takes by using your own transport to get to work.
 

TheGoldfish

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At my dmi they did the journey on google maps which came out over the 60mins ... but I told them (truthfully) even in traffic its only 40mins by bike and that at extreme early / late times even in a car it would obvs be quicker and they were ok with that
 

DriverEight

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To add as well, within city centres, there’s generally a far better public transport infrastructure 24 hours a day, therefore if you live in say London, and have any London Post Code, it wouldn’t matter so much about time it takes by using your own transport to get to work
Many ads for drivers say that due to early starts and finishes, you must be able to get to and from work without relying on public transport. You might get away with this in London, with it's night bus and tube services, but in most places its a non starter. Even in London, night services on public transport are greatly reduced.
 

4F89

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The average for non City living without motorways is approx 40 miles in a car, and 30 miles by public transport/lorry, I seem to remember.
 

DriverEight

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Presuming that the private car is going to be the most common way of getting to work, how many TOCs provide staff parking? I'd imagine staff based at City centre stations may struggle to find free parking. I know Grand Central provide staff parking in Sunderland, but it's quite a way from Sunderland Station!
 

Fawkes Cat

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There's a huge amount of posts on here about travelling time to work, and most companies seem work on the principle that you must live within 60 minutes of your place of work. That begs the question how far is a reasonable travelling distance in 60 mins? I live in Sunderland and if I drove like a maniac I could maybe scrape into York, 70 miles away, in sixty mins. On the other hand, in London you'd do well to cover 15 miles in an hour. Grand Central recruiting in Bradford means people in Manchester and Sheffield are within 45 miles of Bradford Station, but could you do that in rush hour? Almost certainly not. So, how is 60 minutes travel calculated?
Realistically, is this restriction about employers refusing job applications because the applicant turns out to live 65 minutes away from their signing on point, or about getting applicants to think about what journey to and from work they would be prepared to undertake on a regular basis - and still be fit for work when they got there?
 

tiptoptaff

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Realistically, is this restriction about employers refusing job applications because the applicant turns out to live 65 minutes away from their signing on point, or about getting applicants to think about what journey to and from work they would be prepared to undertake on a regular basis - and still be fit for work when they got there?
The former. The fatigue risk index calculations are based on 60minutes each way being the maximum. If you're over, your fatigue level is going to be higher than they have calculated is safe for the roster to work, and the FRI is looked at post-incident
 

GRALISTAIR

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I wonder how many applications have been rejected because applicants think they are within 60 minutes, but companies disagree. Or how many applicants have said "I live 80 miles away, but I have a very fast motorbike!"
That seems unfair. Surely if someone were willing to relocate or other they should not be rejected. I guess its different here in the USA.
 

221129

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That seems unfair. Surely if someone were willing to relocate or other they should not be rejected. I guess its different here in the USA.
Unfortunately life isn't fair. TOCs often have thousands of candidates to choose from, so why would you take an additional risk on someone claiming they will relocate when you have hundreds of others that don't need to.
 

DriverEight

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That seems unfair. Surely if someone were willing to relocate or other they should not be rejected. I guess its different here in the USA.
Its much different in the USA. Here 60 minutes is considered quite a journey, over there it's considered a reasonable distance to go for a taco.
 

snakeydave24

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I wonder how many applications have been rejected because applicants think they are within 60 minutes, but companies disagree. Or how many applicants have said "I live 80 miles away, but I have a very fast motorbike!"

Mine was refused over 5 mins, yet the journey by car was normally around 50 mins, there was just bad traffic on that day of my DMI, I'd done the journey every day that week to make sure at different times and was always under an hour and di stress this point to them but they weren't having any of it
 

Undiscovered

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Unless you plan on booking on bang on time and working your train 15minutes later, realistically, you're looking to get to work about 15minutes early, just to have a brew before going out.
Add fudge time onto your journey and that 60minutes turns into a lot more.
And, while you may start at a quiet time, if you book off at peak, you're sitting in traffic on a hot, summer day, getting home just in time to go to bed to get your 8hrs kip to be up tomorrow and do it all again.
 

Stigy

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Unless you plan on booking on bang on time and working your train 15minutes later, realistically, you're looking to get to work about 15minutes early, just to have a brew before going out.
Add fudge time onto your journey and that 60minutes turns into a lot more.
And, while you may start at a quiet time, if you book off at peak, you're sitting in traffic on a hot, summer day, getting home just in time to go to bed to get your 8hrs kip to be up tomorrow and do it all again.
Most sensible people allow to arrive 15 minutes early. It’s all part of effective NTS and defensive thinking. Although there’s booking on time at the beginning of the shift, in my experience, that’s not enough time to be comfortable. All it takes is to not be able to find a parking space or get held up in a bit of traffic.
 

ComUtoR

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That seems unfair. Surely if someone were willing to relocate or other they should not be rejected. I guess its different here in the USA.

If you had 10 applicants who were all perfectly matched on their application and assessments but the only difference was the varying distances they lived from the depot. You could rank them in order of fatifue risk and then score each appliant. The furthest away would lose out because they posed the highest risk and the other applicants become the preferential candidate.

It isn't so much about excluding those who are "willing" to relocate but other applicants just come out better. The application process is notoriously ruthless and as an employer with an huge pool to pick from; you can cherry pick.

When all applicants are all judged using the same criteria then the process is 'fair'
 

Stigy

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If you had 10 applicants who were all perfectly matched on their application and assessments but the only difference was the varying distances they lived from the depot. You could rank them in order of fatifue risk and then score each appliant. The furthest away would lose out because they posed the highest risk and the other applicants become the preferential candidate.

It isn't so much about excluding those who are "willing" to relocate but other applicants just come out better. The application process is notoriously ruthless and as an employer with an huge pool to pick from; you can cherry pick.

When all applicants are all judged using the same criteria then the process is 'fair'
Exactly. The reality is, it's a captive audience, and these things stand out as frankly sensible ways to sift applicants out at an early stage.

Even beyond sifting, It makes sense to take the people forward who live the closest if they're equal in terms of other criteria. Even if someone is happy to relocate, this isn't without its risks.
 
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