Is Manchester United FC Halt closed?

[pemma]

Not like it's exactly expensive round there.

I'm pretty sure some houses in that area have sold for £1 on condition the buyer is local, fully renovates them and lives in them for a certain number of years afterwards.

 

[NoOnesFool]

Is there no demand for a "proper" station/service? I would've thought with the football/cricket grounds nearby and Salford Quays not a million miles away that at least an hourly stopper if not EMT stopping there too would be a decent shout

EMT?!! Seriously? Why would a long-distance express service even be considered to call at a minute station that hasn't even been served since last year?

 

[DarloRich]

Not like it's exactly expensive round there.

harsh! No worse than the areas around many of our older football grounds. BTW You still have to persuade the owners to sell

 

[Old Yard Dog]

There are a number of Metrolink stations on different lines as near or almost as near to Old Trafford football ground as the eponymous Old Trafford. These include Exchange Quay, Pomona, Trafford Bar and even Firswood and dissipate the demand. But the NR station is far nearer than any of them although it is so well hidden that many supporters are blissfully unaware of its existence.

The only time I ever used Manchester Central was to catch a football special to Old Trafford in the late 1960s.

 

[Kite159]

Would anybody notice if it quietly closed for good?

As someone mentioned earlier on in the thread it was last served December 2017 without much of an outcry from football goers (considering someone only noticed it wasn't getting served for a Chumpions League game), tickets to the halt are more expensive for non-railcard holders compared to the Metrolink. The Metrolink has more stops nearby and run at a higher frequency.

In a way it is a bit like Wembley Stadium, most folk don't know the existence of the Chiltern station next to the stadium and hence most tend to head towards Wembley Park to queue for 45+ minutes for a LU service, some will decide to walk the half-mile (or so) to Wembley Central in the hope that it will be quieter.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It is in a way quite similar to the innersuburban Chiltern stations generally - there is barely any point in them because the areas are also better served by the Tube, and if they all closed few would probably notice.

 

[bussnapperwm]

On Metrolink adult single is £3 or £3.20 return for Piccadilly to Old Trafford with no railcard discounts. I can't find the NR fare on brfares.com

£4.40 single, £6odd return

 

[greyman42]

harsh! No worse than the areas around many of our older football grounds. BTW You still have to persuade the owners to sell

When Liverpool FC extended their Kemlyn Road stand (now the Kenny Dalglish Stand) they bought all the houses on Kemlyn Road apart from one where two elderly sisters lived who, despite very generous offers, refused to sell. It held up the buiding of the stand for quite a length of time.

 

[Kite159]

It did, but it was reopened.

Could it be those security issues which closed it back in 2016 have reappeared?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Could it be those security issues which closed it back in 2016 have reappeared?

Possible, but I suspect it's more that Northern are barely able to resource anything at the moment, let alone a footy special that isn't really needed when the trams can cope.

 

[WatcherZero]

I'm pretty sure some houses in that area have sold for £1 on condition the buyer is local, fully renovates them and lives in them for a certain number of years afterwards.

Prices in Anfield start at £35,000 for a refurbished two bed terrace and go upto around £250k (couple of large 8 bedroom semi-detached homes for £425k)

 

[Kneedown]

Ok, i've tried to resist but I cannot anymore......

Surely the use of Man U halt has declined since Man U stopped winning trophies, and the majority of the fans have switched allegience to whoever is winning the most?

 

[Altfish]

Ok, i've tried to resist but I cannot anymore......

Surely the use of Man U halt has declined since Man U stopped winning trophies, and the majority of the fans have switched allegience to whoever is winning the most?

You are a wit.

 

[janb]

Not like it's exactly expensive round there.

Which Liverpool's policy of buying homes and leaving them empty contributed to.
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...blog/2013/may/06/anfield-liverpool-david-conn

 

[Bletchleyite]

Which Liverpool's policy of buying homes and leaving them empty contributed to.
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...blog/2013/may/06/anfield-liverpool-david-conn

Contributed to I'm sure (why did they not rent them out on short term contracts and make "a few bob" into the bargain, I wonder?) - but it is just not a nice area anyway and so only those who cannot afford better will choose to live there - and in depopulated Liverpool there is lots of very affordable "better".

 

[Kite159]

I was thinking earlier, as the last train ran in December last year, would it mean drivers/guards have lost route knowledge of that little spur from the main Warrington Central line?

 

[Kneedown]

You are a wit.

You forgot the "t"

 

[Tomnick]

I was thinking earlier, as the last train ran in December last year, would it mean drivers/guards have lost route knowledge of that little spur from the main Warrington Central line?

No - it’s part of the same line of route, so if you sign the route, you sign the platform line.

 

[jizzer]

From what I can gather it was united that stopped the trains from running due to crowd management issues. When fans were waiting for the trains the walk way beneath the stand was getting blocked causing issues

 

[PR1Berske]

Is there no demand for a "proper" station/service? I would've thought with the football/cricket grounds nearby and Salford Quays not a million miles away that at least an hourly stopper if not EMT stopping there too would be a decent shout

As said above and below your post, the expanded/ing Metrolink services do what this halt used to, over a wider area and offering better connectivity. On other threads the subject of congestion around central Manchester has been discussed a hundred-million times, and the current lack of paths out of Piccadilly is well known. Trying to cram an extended stopper to the Halt under the current circumstances, through tickets gates onto a narrow platform, is perhaps no longer something Northern or the industry generally are keen to do.

I note @jcollins ' post above mine while i type, a "proper" station is unlikely to fit anywhere on the existing track near Old Trafford as it is. Meanwhile, Metrolink offer three stops.

Maybe we could now discuss how the industry goes about officially closing an infrequently used halt!

 

[Chester1]

Speaking from experience, they make no adjustments to the service for the Etihad events - single units still run through, when you would hope and expect double units during the peak. Metrolink don't strengthen services, either. Reason: "we don't get paid extra to do that". Rather neatly ignores the fare paying crush loaded customer they have in a captive market. I know as I managed to have a chat with one of their ops managers a couple of years ago when I complained about the p!ss poor service.

Luckily my back is fixed and I don't need the Tram any more. Also, no trains on match day has forced me into the car.

And don't get me started with the two lines, soon to be three, serving Old Trafford!

I must admit I'm not sure what happens now BUT when the Altrincham to Etihad serves was not cut back to Piccadilly, they used to swap the double trams to the Etihad trams on days City were at home.

They do opperate some double trams on Media City-Etihad and Eccles-Ashton when there are matches or events at the Etihad. It is less common now because more trams are required to opperate normal services, meaning fewer spares. Next year Media City services are being extended to Ashton, which will stretch the fleet further. 27 new trams are due to arrive from early 2020 for the opening of the Trafford Park Line and then for doubling more services. What I think the guy meant was that Metrolink won't invest money to increase capacity for events, which is hardly surprising. Metrolink does make an opperating profit, with some lines subsidising the others. The money oriented approach has made the expansion of the network possible.

I doubt building over the railway on some kind of bridge/tunnel like structure would be *that* complex. A football stand is relatively lightweight compared to say putting housing on a bridge over the railway, and there are plenty of cases of that.

And it's not like MUFC are short of cash.

Last year United said that any plans to build over the railway would not need a tunnel as new construction techniques would allow them to build up and out. (Temporary scafolding tunnel would probably be needed above overheads) There are no immediate plans to build an extension partly due to lack of suitable alternative home whilst work takes place, I don't think groundshare with City would go down well. Building work would mean Old Trafford would have to be shut for at least a year due as site compounds and closure of Munich tunnel would prevent the remaining stands getting a safety certificate.

United are a very rich club but the chances of the current (or future owners) investing in expanding the stadium are slim. Old Trafford is already the largest football club stadium in the UK by nearly 15,000 seats. Anfield only had 45,000 seats until 2016 which meant demand far exceeded supply making the main stand expansion a great idea (with 6 year payback due to corporate seat revenue). Anfield Road stand rebuild has stalled (although is still very likely) because extra behind goal seating would be general admission only and the payback would be 15+ years. Highbury was a bit less than 40,000 and White Hart Lane 36,000. Man City and West Ham's new stadiums had very different finances for obvious reasons. I don't know United's position in terms of ticket demand, expanding the Bobby Charlton stand over the railway would provide options for both general admission and corporate seatings but do they need it? I very much doubt they could fill 90,000 seats for less desirable premier league or champions league matches, let alone the FA and League cups. The main way to try would be slashing ticket prices which would remove the financial benefit of expanding the stadium.

 

[greyman42]

Anfield Road stand rebuild has stalled

Will there be a change to the layout of Anfield Road itself, when the stand is expanded?

 

[JamesT]

United are a very rich club but the chances of the current (or future owners) investing in expanding the stadium are slim. Old Trafford is already the largest football club stadium in the UK by nearly 15,000 seats. Anfield only had 45,000 seats until 2016 which meant demand far exceeded supply making the main stand expansion a great idea (with 6 year payback due to corporate seat revenue). Anfield Road stand rebuild has stalled (although is still very likely) because extra behind goal seating would be general admission only and the payback would be 15+ years. Highbury was a bit less than 40,000 and White Hart Lane 36,000. Man City and West Ham's new stadiums had very different finances for obvious reasons. I don't know United's position in terms of ticket demand, expanding the Bobby Charlton stand over the railway would provide options for both general admission and corporate seatings but do they need it? I very much doubt they could fill 90,000 seats for less desirable premier league or champions league matches, let alone the FA and League cups. The main way to try would be slashing ticket prices which would remove the financial benefit of expanding the stadium.

Although demand has probably dropped off somewhat with the decline in the team, I think it’s still pretty strong. I believe there around 55,000 season ticket holders, which only leaves around 20,000 for ad hoc purchases. League games require joining the supporters club, I can’t recall a league game going to general sale.
There was the expansion in 2006 which added 8,000 seats which was fairly quickly gobbled up. There is also the factor that capacity is about to reduce as seats are converted to add more disabled area.
Expanding Bobby Charlton would supposedly take capacity to 80,000. https://www.statista.com/statistics/268646/manchester-united-average-per-game-attendance/ says average attendance has been around 75,000 for the last decade, adding another 5,000 doesn’t seem much of a stretch.
Though coming back to the original topic, I wonder if the council would insist on transport improvements as part of any planning permission. It’s already horrible to get away from after a match, more people would only make it worse.

 

[greyman42]

Expanding Bobby Charlton would supposedly take capacity to 80,000. https://www.statista.com/statistics/268646/manchester-united-average-per-game-attendance/ says average attendance has been around 75,000 for the last decade, adding another 5,000 doesn’t seem much of a stretch.
Though coming back to the original topic, I wonder if the council would insist on transport improvements as part of any planning permission. It’s already horrible to get away from after a match, more people would only make it worse.

I would of thought that the costs of expanding the Charlton stand would be considerable to gain 5000 seats which would not be corporate. Regarding planning permission, Chelsea had to make transport improvements as part of there plans to build a new stadium which coincidently also involved building over 2 railway lines. The lines are the District and West London.

 

[Hophead]

.....Though coming back to the original topic, I wonder if the council would insist on transport improvements as part of any planning permission. It’s already horrible to get away from after a match, more people would only make it worse.

When Brighton & Hove Albion had to switch to the athletics stadium at Withdean, the council insisted that the club subsidise local public transport in order to reduce match-day congestion in a residential area. The same still applies now that they have moved to the edge-of-town Amex Stadium at Falmer. You get free pre- and post-match bus and train travel over a wide area.

Given the revenue coming in to every premier league club, I can see few reasons why something similar should not be universally applied. I can see that London might present some problems, but I can't think of any reason why the proposal cannot be at least considered.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It’s a very common thing for all kinds of event in Germany. An excellent idea to reduce car use.

 

[pemma]

It’s a very common thing for all kinds of event in Germany. An excellent idea to reduce car use.

In Germany it's very common to see groups going on school trips or organised day trips boarding trains rather than getting a private hire coach.

 

[Ianno87]

In Germany it's very common to see groups going on school trips or organised day trips boarding trains rather than getting a private hire coach.

Quite common to see school groups on trains/tubes into and around London, including from quite far out into the Home Counties.

Much less common in rest of UK.

 

[londonbridge]

Last time I used the station (several years ago now) the match was a Saturday 5.30 kick off. I had an advance from Piccadilly back to London at 8.35. Game ended, I came straight out and was in the queue by 7.30. first train was due at 7.35 but didn't get on as the police were holding the queue. Second train was due at 7.55. It arrived at 8.30! Got back to Piccadilly and Northern refused to do anything to help me get home. Ended up forking out for the overnight National Express coach. (Full details posted in previous threads).

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Quite common to see school groups on trains/tubes into and around London, including from quite far out into the Home Counties.

Much less common in rest of UK.

Happens quite a lot to Halifax for the Eureka! childrens' museum. Probably is more common in places with cheaper tickets though, such as the school party which took over one carriage of the Spanish train I was on a couple of days ago.