Joining TransPennine (maybe) - Few questions

[Yellabowley]

Afternoon all,

New member and apologies but I’m about to ramble a bit and ask a few questions. I have an assessment centre coming up but I am very torn as to what to do. I’m currently a Police Officer with 14.5 years service. I joined at 22 and with the latest legal ruling over pensions it looks like I’m going back onto my old pension scheme (at least until the government change it again). This means I’ll retire at 52 (only 15 years away) with a six figure lump sum and a decent monthly wedge for life. However I struggle badly with the Police style interviews, had around 14 in my career and never passed one. I excel at practical tests, exams (Passed the Sergeants exam with the highest mark in the force that year) and IQ type tests, but every job has an interview. This is what gives me my biggest dilemma. I’m resigned to being a Constable for life and not climbing the ladder. As such I’m on £40k a year. I don’t hate my job, it’s stressful at times but it’s ok, and as sad as it sounds I am still proud of what I do. I’m trying to weigh up the pros and cons but as I said I don’t know enough about the train driver benefits as yet.

First obvious benefit of the TP job is after training I’ll be on £58k a year. And I’m aware that once I’m a qualified driver there are even better paid jobs out there. So what is the scope for progression either within one company or by moving to other companies?

Then are the ones that I can’t find so readily. What is the retirement age of a train driver? Is it just the national retirement age or is there a limit on how old you can be (I know pilots have an age limit for example)?
Are there many opportunities for overtime as a driver? It’s nice knowing as a police Officer that if I have a tight month I can bring some extra income in.
How is the job socially? It appears that it might be a bit of a lonely existence which would be a huge departure from the camaraderie of being on a shift of 15-20 people.
And possibly most crucially, what is the pass rate for training? I will drop to £24k whilst training so if I then didn’t pass and ended up jobless this would be an absolute disaster. I could more than likely rejoin the Police but it’s not a given and not necessarily immediate.

I’m sure there will be other ex-cops here so if anyone knows of any other pros and cons then they’d be greatly appreciated. Finally apologies if the answers are all contained in other posts. I did have a search around but it’s always difficult finding answers bespoke to your own exact circumstances.

Many thanks in advance.

 

[ILoveLamp]

Afternoon all,

New member and apologies but I’m about to ramble a bit and ask a few questions. I have an assessment centre coming up but I am very torn as to what to do. I’m currently a Police Officer with 14.5 years service. I joined at 22 and with the latest legal ruling over pensions it looks like I’m going back onto my old pension scheme (at least until the government change it again). This means I’ll retire at 52 (only 15 years away) with a six figure lump sum and a decent monthly wedge for life. However I struggle badly with the Police style interviews, had around 14 in my career and never passed one. I excel at practical tests, exams (Passed the Sergeants exam with the highest mark in the force that year) and IQ type tests, but every job has an interview. This is what gives me my biggest dilemma. I’m resigned to being a Constable for life and not climbing the ladder. As such I’m on £40k a year. I don’t hate my job, it’s stressful at times but it’s ok, and as sad as it sounds I am still proud of what I do. I’m trying to weigh up the pros and cons but as I said I don’t know enough about the train driver benefits as yet.

First obvious benefit of the TP job is after training I’ll be on £58k a year. And I’m aware that once I’m a qualified driver there are even better paid jobs out there. So what is the scope for progression either within one company or by moving to other companies?

Then are the ones that I can’t find so readily. What is the retirement age of a train driver? Is it just the national retirement age or is there a limit on how old you can be (I know pilots have an age limit for example)?
Are there many opportunities for overtime as a driver? It’s nice knowing as a police Officer that if I have a tight month I can bring some extra income in.
How is the job socially? It appears that it might be a bit of a lonely existence which would be a huge departure from the camaraderie of being on a shift of 15-20 people.
And possibly most crucially, what is the pass rate for training? I will drop to £24k whilst training so if I then didn’t pass and ended up jobless this would be an absolute disaster. I could more than likely rejoin the Police but it’s not a given and not necessarily immediate.

I’m sure there will be other ex-cops here so if anyone knows of any other pros and cons then they’d be greatly appreciated. Finally apologies if the answers are all contained in other posts. I did have a search around but it’s always difficult finding answers bespoke to your own exact circumstances.

Many thanks in advance.

Hi

it sounds to me, that with the reinstatement of your previous pension and it’s associated benefits, plus the fact you dont hate your job, makes me think it may be a case of ‘better the devil you know’! Being able to retire at 52 with such great benefits could be something you may regret losing in years to come if you move to something you don’t like.. Sometimes the grass isnt always greener! Only you can answer that question I suppose. I have been offered quite a few jobs over the last few years (not railway ones) that I have actually turned down after finding out more info during the recruitment process, so I suppose it wouldn’t harm if you continued your applications until such a point as being offered a position, should you be that lucky! You could then make a more informed decision as to which way to go. Don’t let money be your driver though (pardon the pun), money won’t make up for a job you may hate.

just my ten pence worth, good luck either way

 

[golfingdaddy]

Hey,
Some of the stuff you've asked here can only be answered by you - only you can decide if you want to retire in 15 years or not; only you can decide if you'd rather earn 58k a year or 40k. And if you're increasing your wage by almost 50% do you really need overtime too? Though that is of course a personal choice.
There are plenty of benefits of being a train driver - good salary, good pension, promotion opportunities, less nights etc. Retirement age is a bit older than what you have in the police but it's not the national retirement age.
But it's not an easy job - lonely, stressful, high levels of concentration and the safety of hundreds/thousands of people everyday on your shoulders. The initial training is intense too - think back to when you joined the police and you'll get a rough idea of the degree of difficulty.
I don't know what the pass rate is for TPE, but they'd only take you on if they thought you were able to meet the competencies and pass the training. And there are many, many ex-cops that have changed career to become a train driver.
I'd try and focus on whether you really want to be a train driver or whether you're just desperate to get out the police and see trains as the only real available option. That said, I know that a copper can find it difficult to find another career where you have a transferable skillset.
Cheers.

 

[fabs]

If you get through the TPE selection process the pass rate is almost 100%.

 

[Atishyou]

Tpe just upped their training rate to full money after 8 weeks.

As a driver, you see other drivers in the messroom and at handovers, but I'm guessing if you're single crewed on shift in the police, it'd be similar to that.

Free travel on tpe. 75% off some other tickets on most operators and 10 boxes to use a year on other First Group TOCs. Depending on where you'd apply for, there may be some local benefits too.

Some TOCs and FOCs were looking at bring in justified retirement ages. I'm not sure if TPE have signed up to that, where you have to go at your state pension age. New overtime agreement is pretty decent too.

Can't say what you'd get pension wise tbh.

 

[Yellabowley]

Thanks both of you.

A lot is down to my personal choice. I suppose my biggest issue is retirement. If I leave the police my pension is deferred until national retirement age. There’s every possibility that will be 70 by the time I get there. I could have been claiming it for 18 years by that point. Financially in the here and now its a big pay hike if I get the job (and yeah hopefully I won’t need the overtime but there’s always that chance If I’m earning more I’ll spend more). But the pull of retiring while I’m young enough to enjoy it is still as appealing as ever.

What sort of age or level of service do train drivers have to work to until they can retire?

 

[Yellabowley]

Apologies Atishyou,

I was typing when you posted. Thanks for that as well, that’s very useful.

 

[Atishyou]

You can retire when you want from 55 I believe, but between 55 and 60, you lose a certain percentage of your pension. I *think* this may be 2% a year, but I may be wrong on that.

The question is, do you want to be getting up for shifts when you're 53 or do you want to be sat watching Homes Under the Hammer?

 

[Yellabowley]

Haha. The pull of Martin Roberts is strong!

 

[ST]

Do you end up getting used to the shifts as time goes on or do they get more difficult the older you get?

 

[Atishyou]

Haha. The pull of Martin Roberts is strong!

Just think, you could sit in your pants all day!

 

[Atishyou]

Do you end up getting used to the shifts as time goes on or do they get more difficult the older you get?

You can either do shifts or you can't. I prefer the extra days off. Am I tired some days? You bet, but that's how it is some times. I've got young kids, so I'm probably more tired than someone older who gets a good 8 hours!

I should add that I don't work for TPE, I do do shifts on the railway though.

 

[Yellabowley]

Yeah shifts are the one thing I do know about. Been doing 24/7 shifts my whole career so far. You definitely become accustomed to them and learn to cope with them but loads of studies have shown that they aren’t good for you in the long run.

 

[Atishyou]

Yeah shifts are the one thing I do know about. Been doing 24/7 shifts my whole career so far. You definitely become accustomed to them and learn to cope with them but loads of studies have shown that they aren’t good for you in the long run.

Life isn't good for you. My grandfather worked shifts and he's still going strong in his 90s.

My nan didn't work shifts and she died 5 years ago in her 80s.

 

[golfingdaddy]

Are they really paying full rate for a trainee train driver after only 2 months?? Amazing if they are...

Tpe just upped their training rate to full money after 8 weeks.

As a driver, you see other drivers in the messroom and at handovers, but I'm guessing if you're single crewed on shift in the police, it'd be similar to that.

Free travel on tpe. 75% off some other tickets on most operators and 10 boxes to use a year on other First Group TOCs. Depending on where you'd apply for, there may be some local benefits too.

Some TOCs and FOCs were looking at bring in justified retirement ages. I'm not sure if TPE have signed up to that, where you have to go at your state pension age. New overtime agreement is pretty decent too.

Can't say what you'd get pension wise tbh.

 

[golfingdaddy]

Sent you a DM.

Thanks both of you.

A lot is down to my personal choice. I suppose my biggest issue is retirement. If I leave the police my pension is deferred until national retirement age. There’s every possibility that will be 70 by the time I get there. I could have been claiming it for 18 years by that point. Financially in the here and now its a big pay hike if I get the job (and yeah hopefully I won’t need the overtime but there’s always that chance If I’m earning more I’ll spend more). But the pull of retiring while I’m young enough to enjoy it is still as appealing as ever.

What sort of age or level of service do train drivers have to work to until they can retire?

 

[Atishyou]

Are they really paying full rate for a trainee train driver after only 2 months?? Amazing if they are...

That's what someone posted on here somewhere!

 

[notadriver]

I’ve heard Transpennine is extremely popular with thousands of applications per trainee driver position. Are you sure you cut the mustard ?

 

[golfingdaddy]

That's what someone posted on here somewhere!

Hmmm....I have my doubts.

 

[Atishyou]

Hmmm....I have my doubts.

You're welcome to those doubts. I also know a TPE driver, who has confirmed.

 

[TheVicLine]

Hmmm....I have my doubts.

Trainee drivers at TPE now get full drivers pay after their initial probation period of only 8 weeks, it was agreed with ASLEF and implemented last month as part of the new rest day working agreement.

 

[TheVicLine]

Congrats Yellabowley, and good luck with the impending assessment. I will try and answer some of your questions...


You will receive the full drivers salary 8 weeks after you start, which is only 2 months at the reduced training rate, so not so bad there.

You get paid every 4 weeks and will work a 35 hr 4 day week on average. There is plenty of overtime available, you work one of your days off rather than a couple of hours here and there and you can very easily add £20k+ to your salary by doing this, most do but it's not compulsorily and you can pick and choose when you do it. Most of your day is obviously spent driving and on your own in the cab, however there are constant interactions with other onboard staff, station staff and even signallers. During a typical day you generally drive for a few hours and then get an hour or 2 in the messroom so plenty of time to catch up with the other drivers and guards and to put the world to rights. You also get days when you are "spare" (a standby driver), on these days you may be allocated cover work as required or if you are lucky sit spare in the messroom, watch TV for a bit and then go home, this doesn't happen very often though lol. The work is varied and mixed up so although you drive the same routes every day (sort of) no 2 days are the same (again sort of). Shift work is good and the union make sure that it is sensibly allocated, you wont go from an early start one day to a late the next and then back to early for example. Be aware though you will be expected to work weekends and bank holidays, which obviously no one likes at first but it's part of the job.
You will get 5 full weeks holiday and 8 random days of you choice.

The railway pension is very good, you can retire at 62 and claim your full pension, or you can retire earlier and get a reduced pension. You can also work on after you are 62 for as long as you want or at least as long as you can complete the company medical.
You get free travel on TPE trains as does your partner and kids, if applicable, you also get free travel on any other First Group trains and 75% off all other trains, although in reality we all look out for each other and most trains you can travel on for free. You also get free and reduced travel throughout Europe and on the Eurostar trains.

There are opportunities for progression within the industry, you can continue driving and become an instructor, after that there is an assessors role as a driver or you could move into the driver management side of things.

As for failing your training, it doesn't happen, I don't known of anyone failing. The training is very thorough and you are supported all the way, it takes about a year to qualify and after that a new driver is assessed very regularly.

The interviews are hard going but as long as you revise what type of questions you are going to be asked and prepare then they are nothing that you can't handle as a police officer,
Name a time when you have had to deal with an emergency?
Name a time when you have had to work on your own? etc. etc. you should have plenty of examples.

Any questions on TPE then feel free to PM me, and again good luck with the assessments.

 

[golfingdaddy]

Trainee drivers at TPE now get full drivers pay after their initial probation period of only 8 weeks, it was agreed with ASLEF and implemented last month as part of the new rest day working agreement.

That is brilliant.

 

[bouff34]

I will drop to £24k whilst training so if I then didn’t pass and ended up jobless this would be an absolute disaster. I could more than likely rejoin the Police but it’s not a given and not necessarily immediate.

If you rejoined the police you wouldn't be able to rejoin the 1987 pension - you would have to go on to the current one (2005??) with whatever that retirement age is now (60? 65?). This makes rejoining even less attractive if you realise trains aren't for you...

 

[Bellbell]

People do fail the training. I can't speak for TPE but it is absolutely the case that people fail the training and are sent on their way. The vast majority pass though.

 

[Yellabowley]

Thanks again everyone, especially TheVicLine, that’s a huge help.

 

[Yellabowley]

I’ve heard Transpennine is extremely popular with thousands of applications per trainee driver position. Are you sure you cut the mustard ?

Only one way to find out!

 

[C J Snarzell]

Afternoon,

I'm a former police officer with Greater Manchester Police and I left in December 2018 after 15 years. I could write a book about my experiences of cop life but I don't want to dominate this forum with all the nonsense of the job. Needless to say the pension is a important one.

However, as a member of the police family you will know that ex-PM Teresa May shafted every cop in the UK when she was Home Secretary in 2012 by bringing in that time & motion man Tom Winsor to implement changes to police pay and conditions which saw the existing pension schemes being drastically changed. In a nutshell - any serving cop who joined after 1993, will probably have to work until they are 60. Ms May is hated in my household and I had a little cheer last July when Boris got the keys to number 10 and we saw the back of the witch from Berkshire who I believe has destroyed many of our emergency services beyond repair.

The Police Federation of England & Wales is still fighting the government through a very long winded tribunal that is likely to drag on for quite some time yet. The point I'm making is that there is no guarantee of retirement at 52. If I had stuck it out in the police I might have retired at 52 too but I wasn't prepared to do another 15 years of my life doing a job I hated!!! The moral in the police service is rock bottom and most older cops are simply staying in the job for the sake of the pension and sadly wishing their life away.

What I will say to you is that I have absolutely no regrets about leaving the police and my quality of life has improved greatly. I'm now working in railway control and the job is very demanding and what I would describe as a different kind of busy to cop world.

What I will end my thread on is this - you are clearly as unhappy being in the police service as I was. I would go for the TPE role as it's a fantastic opportunity to go for and I'm sure you'll have no regrets afterwards.

All the best.

CJ

 

[Choochoo0001]

Afternoon all,

New member and apologies but I’m about to ramble a bit and ask a few questions. I have an assessment centre coming up but I am very torn as to what to do. I’m currently a Police Officer with 14.5 years service. I joined at 22 and with the latest legal ruling over pensions it looks like I’m going back onto my old pension scheme (at least until the government change it again). This means I’ll retire at 52 (only 15 years away) with a six figure lump sum and a decent monthly wedge for life. However I struggle badly with the Police style interviews, had around 14 in my career and never passed one. I excel at practical tests, exams (Passed the Sergeants exam with the highest mark in the force that year) and IQ type tests, but every job has an interview. This is what gives me my biggest dilemma. I’m resigned to being a Constable for life and not climbing the ladder. As such I’m on £40k a year. I don’t hate my job, it’s stressful at times but it’s ok, and as sad as it sounds I am still proud of what I do. I’m trying to weigh up the pros and cons but as I said I don’t know enough about the train driver benefits as yet.

First obvious benefit of the TP job is after training I’ll be on £58k a year. And I’m aware that once I’m a qualified driver there are even better paid jobs out there. So what is the scope for progression either within one company or by moving to other companies?

Then are the ones that I can’t find so readily. What is the retirement age of a train driver? Is it just the national retirement age or is there a limit on how old you can be (I know pilots have an age limit for example)?
Are there many opportunities for overtime as a driver? It’s nice knowing as a police Officer that if I have a tight month I can bring some extra income in.
How is the job socially? It appears that it might be a bit of a lonely existence which would be a huge departure from the camaraderie of being on a shift of 15-20 people.
And possibly most crucially, what is the pass rate for training? I will drop to £24k whilst training so if I then didn’t pass and ended up jobless this would be an absolute disaster. I could more than likely rejoin the Police but it’s not a given and not necessarily immediate.

I’m sure there will be other ex-cops here so if anyone knows of any other pros and cons then they’d be greatly appreciated. Finally apologies if the answers are all contained in other posts. I did have a search around but it’s always difficult finding answers bespoke to your own exact circumstances.

Many thanks in advance.

Evening mate.

I left the Met after 10 years as a frontline PC in April 2018 - to undertake a role as a trainee driver with a London based TOC.

My personal reasons for leaving were that I had started to feel Jaded with the job itself. Windsor / May’s changes to our terms and conditions coupled with that “7 year itch” made me start to feel hugely undervalued and under appreciated. Everything seemed like an uphill battle, all the time - need overtime? Have to get approval from the Insp on shift. Need more than an hour? Have to go back cap in hand just before your hour was up to ask for more.
Reported a burglary? Call CID to confirm that it is actually a burglary, then complete a 50 step report plan that renders your CRIS totally unreadable and practically guarantees you’ll be fielding memos for the next few weeks - and that was before the Met started “restructuring”.

Anyway, I digress! I’m now just over a year passed since qualifying and really enjoying my new career.

For me, the move wasn’t without its difficulties. I had to endure just under a year on a reduced salary of 27k - instead of the 40k I had become accustomed to. We made lifestyle changes obviously and cut back almost everything, but the reduced wages meant I leant more heavily on debt and credit to get through that period.
I didn’t do horrific damage - but I’m still paying off the debts to get back to the level I was at before taking the job (although with a now much improved disposable income). Obviously your situation may be different, but that’s food for thought.

Training wise, I felt that I was actually quite well prepared for rules and practical handling.
As a frontline officer, you’re obviously accustomed to learning legislation and local SOPs until they come out of your ears. So front loading all that boring, dry and factual text wasn’t as difficult for me as it was for some of my other classmates.
I found that my sim time was easier. I didn’t have a tendency to panic in the over the top “everything has gone wrong at the same time” situations - I attribute that to my time on the frontline as well, as it’s similar to responding to emergency calls in the way you set your mind in order before dealing with anything.
I also found that communication (with the signaller etc on the GSMR/phone) were much more natural to me. Little things like repeating back messages and ensuring pertinent information is spelled out phonetically is something you’ll be doing as standard already - so it won’t be as much of a foreign concept as it may be to other trainees.

Tine wise, certainly throughout my training period I was investing many more hours than I was contracted to. I often came to class an hour or two before the day started and stayed back an hour or two after it had finished. I had a family to support and didn’t want to risk failing the course, so I made sure to invest extra time revising and talking through lessons with my colleagues. I absolutely think this helped me get through without incident.
Once you get out handling, you mostly follow your instructors schedules. The shift aren’t too different to what you will have encountered in the Police but they can be more irregular. There’s no 6 on, 4 off at my TOC. In fact, looking through the roster it often appears that there’s no rhyme or reason to the shift pattern at all.

You’ll have to have a sit down (with your family / significant other) and discuss the pros and cons. Be realistic and try to figure out whether or not the move is something you COULD do and then, is it something you SHOULD do? Only you guys will be able to answer that one!

For me personally, what tipped me over the edge was not wanting to regret passing the opportunity up. I personally would rather have come over and hated it (and then tried to go back as rejoiner), as opposed to not taking the plunge and spending another 20-25 years in a career that I was already Jaded with wondering “what if...?”

Good luck with whatever you choose!

 

[Owen2323]

Afternoon all,

New member and apologies but I’m about to ramble a bit and ask a few questions. I have an assessment centre coming up but I am very torn as to what to do. I’m currently a Police Officer with 14.5 years service. I joined at 22 and with the latest legal ruling over pensions it looks like I’m going back onto my old pension scheme (at least until the government change it again). This means I’ll retire at 52 (only 15 years away) with a six figure lump sum and a decent monthly wedge for life. However I struggle badly with the Police style interviews, had around 14 in my career and never passed one. I excel at practical tests, exams (Passed the Sergeants exam with the highest mark in the force that year) and IQ type tests, but every job has an interview. This is what gives me my biggest dilemma. I’m resigned to being a Constable for life and not climbing the ladder. As such I’m on £40k a year. I don’t hate my job, it’s stressful at times but it’s ok, and as sad as it sounds I am still proud of what I do. I’m trying to weigh up the pros and cons but as I said I don’t know enough about the train driver benefits as yet.

First obvious benefit of the TP job is after training I’ll be on £58k a year. And I’m aware that once I’m a qualified driver there are even better paid jobs out there. So what is the scope for progression either within one company or by moving to other companies?

Then are the ones that I can’t find so readily. What is the retirement age of a train driver? Is it just the national retirement age or is there a limit on how old you can be (I know pilots have an age limit for example)?
Are there many opportunities for overtime as a driver? It’s nice knowing as a police Officer that if I have a tight month I can bring some extra income in.
How is the job socially? It appears that it might be a bit of a lonely existence which would be a huge departure from the camaraderie of being on a shift of 15-20 people.
And possibly most crucially, what is the pass rate for training? I will drop to £24k whilst training so if I then didn’t pass and ended up jobless this would be an absolute disaster. I could more than likely rejoin the Police but it’s not a given and not necessarily immediate.

I’m sure there will be other ex-cops here so if anyone knows of any other pros and cons then they’d be greatly appreciated. Finally apologies if the answers are all contained in other posts. I did have a search around but it’s always difficult finding answers bespoke to your own exact circumstances.

Many thanks in advance.

I was in a very similar position to you as a cop with 12 years service and left to pursue an alternative which didn't work out and I found myself unemployed 9 months later! As much as I disliked the job for a whole host of reasons I have to say leaving is probably the biggest mistake I've ever made (professionally it definitely is!)

I deliberately left quietly and with dignity just in case I ever wanted to come back and it hasn't helped me get back in at all. I was told when I first enquired that there weren't taking on rejoiners at that time. I took up a police staff role to get my foot back in the door and reapplied to come back as a cop on the latest transferee/rejoiner campaign only to have the door slammed shut in my face (again!)

Becoming successful as a train driver could well work out very well for you (don't forget you'll have to get through an MMI and DMI as well as everything else!) and it's a decision only you can make whether to resign from the police but from my experience I would strongly advise against it! It is a job for life and the rumour's are rife about the pension upheaval being overturned!

I know in my force you used to be able to take career breaks (although they're a lot less likely to be handed out these days I gather). That might be worth looking into as a safety net..........?

Good luck whichever you choose and feel free to PM me if you have any questions