Littering

[WelshBluebird]

I am sure a fair few of you have seen the same pictures circulating online recently of the amount of littering taking place at our beaches and parks etc. I get that those places will be busy at the moment (hot weather, 3 months of lockdown and millions being paid to not be in work will lead to that - even if I think it is stupid given the current situation - but thats another topic and another section of the site), but some of the scenes are just disgusting.

Why on earth can people not pick their litter up with them? It really isn't difficult, even if you cannot find a bin or if the bins are full - if you bring stuff that will end up as litter to a beach / park etc, why on earth should you not take it away with you too? And of course there are a large number of people who just don't give a crap and won't even bother to try to find a bin.

And I am sure I wasn't the only person who noticed the increase in litter around when some certain fast food chains who had closed during lockdown started to reopen again!

Is it time we need another nationwide campaign like I am sure was the case when I was a kid? Maybe councils and volunteers who help sort out this mess need to go on strike so that the idiots will have to sit and lie in their own filth so they get the message?

 

[STEVIEBOY1]

Yes it is awful, a chap was speaking on the radio yesterday, saying how much litter had appeared at a beauty spot in Surrey in the past few days. (Some of the items he mentioned were really revolting).

I remember those advertising campaigns that you mention. I can also remember, at our schools, if you were caught dropping litter in the playground, or anywhere, then you had to stay behind for an hour picking up litter, if the masters thought there was not enough, they used to empty a litter bin on the ground to add to your duties. They sometimes gave lines or an essay to do on the subject in detention too. Fortunately, that did not happen to me.

 

[PeterC]

I am sure a fair few of you have seen the same pictures circulating online recently of the amount of littering taking place at our beaches and parks etc. I get that those places will be busy at the moment (hot weather, 3 months of lockdown and millions being paid to not be in work will lead to that - even if I think it is stupid given the current situation - but thats another topic and another section of the site), but some of the scenes are just disgusting.

Why on earth can people not pick their litter up with them? It really isn't difficult, even if you cannot find a bin or if the bins are full - if you bring stuff that will end up as litter to a beach / park etc, why on earth should you not take it away with you too? And of course there are a large number of people who just don't give a crap and won't even bother to try to find a bin.

And I am sure I wasn't the only person who noticed the increase in litter around when some certain fast food chains who had closed during lockdown started to reopen again!

Is it time we need another nationwide campaign like I am sure was the case when I was a kid? Maybe councils and volunteers who help sort out this mess need to go on strike so that the idiots will have to sit and lie in their own filth so they get the message?

A week ago I saw a scene straight out of a Giles cartoon. Litter piled all around an empty bin.

 

[trentside]

The day after McDonald’s re-opened here, a road I regularly walk down was covered in litter from it and it’s miles away. There had been nothing much at all down there for weeks. It says a lot that our parish council employ a litter picker for just such reasons.

Our current announcement script for Covid require us to ask passengers to “please take their litter with them and safely dispose of it” - still getting trains covered in the stuff even with reduced passenger numbers.

I’d love to see a national campaign against littering, but would it do any good? That’s another matter.

 

[alex397]

I do think a campaign could help, and more education with young people.

I actually think the current generation of children in schools is better than older generations. They learn a lot more about environmental issues, such as plastics in the sea, and are much more aware of recycling. I remember the other day seeing a child having a go at their parent for putting the wrong thing in a public recycling bin.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I hate littering. No excuse. Just don't do it. There are no circumstances under which it is acceptable (if you drop it by accident, pick it up; if you smoke, carry a container for your fag ends, old style film canisters are ideal if you have them). Get the fines increased and get the enforcers out there.

And on trains, unless it's an IC train where you know cleaners will come through and the next station is the terminus, put it in the bin. Trains are the worst for it.

 

[507021]

Littering is disgusting and there's absolutely no need for it.

 

[Ianno87]

On two occasions now I've had to pick discarded face masks from my front garden. That's a special kind of logical reasoning right there...

 

[alex397]

I hate littering. No excuse. Just don't do it. There are no circumstances under which it is acceptable (if you drop it by accident, pick it up; if you smoke, carry a container for your fag ends, old style film canisters are ideal if you have them). Get the fines increased and get the enforcers out there.

And on trains, unless it's an IC train where you know cleaners will come through and the next station is the terminus, put it in the bin. Trains are the worst for it.

Agree with you. No excuse for it at all, it’s just ignorant and lazy to do so. Unless it is accidental of course.
Another issue is seagulls who I often see emptying bins!
But mostly it is just ignorant people. Seeing the news this evening of the rubbish left behind on the beaches is so disheartening. For example, just now on the ITV Meridian news with Thanet Council using resources to clear up the beaches, knowing they’ll have to do exactly the same thing the next day. There can’t be that many selfish people in this country, surely?! Hopefully it’s just a minority of people, but it seems to be quite a big minority! Councils spend enough time simply emptying bins, they don’t need the added pressure of having to constantly clear up parks and beaches too.

Not sure I’d ever leave rubbish on a train though, even if it is a terminus with cleaners.

 

[robbeech]

The thing that really strikes me as "odd" is that with most topics there is a somewhat divided view, to use this forum as an example, there are people for and against most topics of conversation, no matter how far apart the 2 views may be. (Examples, of a wide range of topics and in no way wishing to discuss any of them here as they all have multiple threads of their own) include railway based discussions such as DOO, and Fares simplification, but then more generic things such as subsidy in the railway, tea or coffee, razor blade types, use of metric or imperial units of measurement to name but a few recent topics). With these there are people for and against, or for one side, and for the other, with (usually, but subjectively) justifiable reasons for their opinion.

Why then, are the people that throw the litter on the floor not standing up for themselves? Why is it that whenever there are discussions like this, everyone has the same opinion? It's bad, we shouldn't do it, and most importantly "I" don't do it. Who does it? Who is it that throws their litter out the car window, or leaves it on a bench in a park or at the beach and why don't they put their argument for its justification forwards?

 

[mmh]

I hate littering. No excuse. Just don't do it. There are no circumstances under which it is acceptable (if you drop it by accident, pick it up; if you smoke, carry a container for your fag ends, old style film canisters are ideal if you have them). Get the fines increased and get the enforcers out there.

And on trains, unless it's an IC train where you know cleaners will come through and the next station is the terminus, put it in the bin. Trains are the worst for it.

No, don't litter anywhere because someone else will clear it up, as the "dad says it gives people jobs" public information film used to point out.

 

[mmh]

Why then, are the people that throw the litter on the floor not standing up for themselves? Why is it that whenever there are discussions like this, everyone has the same opinion? It's bad, we shouldn't do it, and most importantly "I" don't do it. Who does it? Who is it that throws their litter out the car window, or leaves it on a bench in a park or at the beach and why don't they put their argument for its justification forwards?

Because even, or maybe especially because, the litterers know it's universally frowned upon. Despite that, at some point virtually everyone will have. I'll be the first to admit it, I have.

 

[Ianno87]

Because even, or maybe especially because, the litterers know it's universally frowned upon. Despite that, at some point virtually everyone will have. I'll be the first to admit it, I have.

I'm sure some people do it simply because they think it bestows a kind of "status" on them, i.e. someone 'lower' than them will come and pick up their crap.

 

[FQTV]

Littering and spitting.

Now would be the optimal time to come down on them both, hard.

 

[py_megapixel]

Sure, you might drop a receipt, or a sweet wrapper might fall from your pocket without you noticing. But plastic bottles? Fast food packages? Childs' toys? There's no excuse.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not sure I’d ever leave rubbish on a train though, even if it is a terminus with cleaners.

I never used to then I observed how they clean it - on most TOCs they take each item out of the bin by hand rather than taking the bin bag out, so it's actually easier to pick it off a table or seat. The place really not to put it is in the elastic magazine holder thing as that would be most effort to get it.

Always in the bin on any TOC that don't clean on every turnaround.

 

[FQTV]

Ths image is of an LBSCR sign, post Spanish Flu, saying:

LONDON, BRIGHTON & SOUTH COAST RAILWAY
PREVENTION OF CONSUMPTION
——————————§——————————
PASSENGERS ARE EARNESTLY REQUESTED
TO ABSTAIN FROM THE DANGEROUS
AND OBJECTIONABLE HABIT OF
SPITTING.​

 

[bearhugger]

I never used to then I observed how they clean it - on most TOCs they take each item out of the bin by hand rather than taking the bin bag out, so it's actually easier to pick it off a table or seat. The place really not to put it is in the elastic magazine holder thing as that would be most effort to get it.

Always in the bin on any TOC that don't clean on every turnaround.

That's interesting as the cleaners based at Middlesbrough station that used to do the Northern trains a few years ago used to pull the bin bags out of the bins and put them all into one bag. They used to stay on the train to do, for example, Middlesbrough to Nunthorpe & return, dump the rubbish in a skip, Middlesbrough - Thornaby, jump on the next train coming back to Middlesbrough & do that one , dump the rubbish, jump on another train to Redcar / Saltburn and jump off partway along the route to catch another train coming back to Middlesbrough. They even made a note of which train services they had done and probably had a minimum of trains they had to do in a shift.

 

[Huntergreed]

What's been concerning to me over the last few days in particular is the amount of broken glass left in a nearby park, clearly from alcohol bottles smashed or left by people who've been drinking. People go walking in this park barefoot in nice weather and children also run around and play in this park, and it scares me to think that someone could stand on something one day just because someone couldn't be bothered to pick up their litter!

 

[Andyh82]

I wonder how many of those people littering are the same people who jumped on the environment bandwagon when it meant they could get a day off school ‘protesting’

The government should come down hard on littering like we’ve seen in recent days, but if they did they’d be ridiculed for spending time on something so trival

 

[Mcr Warrior]

General littering in urban areas (parks, road verges, etc.) invariably seems to comprise mostly of food wrappers, cigarette related detritus and empty drinks containers. The "mentality" seems to be that someone else is being kept in a paid job to tidy up any mess created. Not sure if full and overflowing litter bins (if not emptied promptly) sometimes then become a focal point for further littering. It would be far better to require folk to take all their litter home with them (having brought it with them in the first place) than dump it next to an already overflowing bin.

Ultimately it's an attitudinal problem, how do you change the mindset of ignorant folk who are selfish and uncaring of the environment?

And don't get me going on rural fly tipping where someone has gone well out of their way to dump a van load of household/commercial waste in some out of the way location so as to avoid paying disposal charges.

 

[C J Snarzell]

I was really disappointed in the state the Liverpool fans left the Pier Head after the football celebrations. The whole place looked like a scene from a disaster film afterwards.

Given the amount of empty bottles & cans I saw on the news footage I wouldn't be surprised if every off licence as far as St Helens had sold out it's stock!!!

I have friends living in Merseyside and people from the city are usually very proud and extremely protective of the landmarks and their heritage. Even the Mayor has spoke up about feeling saddened by their actions which has cost the City Council alot of money to clean up.

CJ

 

[GatwickDepress]

I wonder how many of those people littering are the same people who jumped on the environment bandwagon when it meant they could get a day off school ‘protesting’

The vast majority of people I see littering are adults. I don't think there's any need to rev the engine of the outrage bus over environmentally-conscious children here.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

The vast majority of people I see littering are adults.

Can't imagine that it's primary school children leaving cigarette related detritus and empty beer cans all over the place!

Secondary school kids, however...

 

[Tom B]

Putting hands into a litter bin to empty it is an absolute no-no and any person doing it needs a stern talking to. Who's to say what's in the bin? If you're lucky, it might be a broken beer bottle, if you're unlucky a needle.

McDonalds etc did make a big scene about how they were supporting communities by litter picking around their 'restaurants'. I think it was a planning condition for certain outlets that they get one of their staff to do x hours per day to mitigate the anticipated waste from them.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Putting hands into a litter bin to empty it is an absolute no-no and any person doing it needs a stern talking to. Who's to say what's in the bin? If you're lucky, it might be a broken beer bottle, if you're unlucky a needle.

Literally every time I've seen someone empty a bin on a train it's been done that way. I agree with you, but it very much seems to be the norm on most TOCs.

I'd assume the bags are changed during overnight cleaning, though.

The best option would be to fit large bins as some stock has, then they only need emptying once a day, but I wonder if there are security risk issues with the bin being too big in certain settings/different TOCs have different risk assessments.

 

[Tom B]

Literally every time I've seen someone empty a bin on a train it's been done that way. I agree with you, but it very much seems to be the norm on most TOCs.

I'd assume the bags are changed during overnight cleaning, though.

The best option would be to fit large bins as some stock has, then they only need emptying once a day, but I wonder if there are security risk issues with the bin being too big in certain settings/different TOCs have different risk assessments.

It is incredibly dangerous to the staff. Probably a shortcut that saves them time (and probably one fostered by a management culture who, if a cleaner pushed for time cut his hand, would say that he's seen the risk assessment) but not one I would ever take.

 

[C J Snarzell]

Putting hands into a litter bin to empty it is an absolute no-no and any person doing it needs a stern talking to. Who's to say what's in the bin? If you're lucky, it might be a broken beer bottle, if you're unlucky a needle.

McDonalds etc did make a big scene about how they were supporting communities by litter picking around their 'restaurants'. I think it was a planning condition for certain outlets that they get one of their staff to do x hours per day to mitigate the anticipated waste from them.

The are two McD drive thru's close to where I live. Up until lockdown started they regularly had dedicated staff doing the litter picking around the car park and adjacent areas which is commendable but I still think councils should target the people who leave the litter in the first place as there are no excuses for it.

 

[Tom B]

You are right, ultimately the issue is with the people who behave in a disgusting manner. Part of it, though, comes down to "broken windows" ie if there is litter there already, some people will think it acceptable to add to it.

 

[Bevan Price]

The main problem is that a small, but significant proportion of the population are lazy, ignorant scruffs who don't care about the environment. And I am afraid that I do not know the solution. Heavy fines might deter a few - that minority that gets caught - but the rest rely on the low probabilty of being caught.
And then we also have the sick vandals who think it is some kind of "fun" to go round smashing things and leave hazardous debris on the ground......