Local services operated by 'express' stock for operational convenience

[Mitchell Hurd]

Don't First Great Western use 5 car 800's on local services from Paddington to Bedwyn & Oxford/Great Malvern etc sure I saw one at Paddington with Radley included as a stopping point?

I know the 17:18 from London Paddington to Oxford (stopping services between Reading and Didcot this was) one time was booked for a 5-car 180, a double Turbo, a 9-car IET then 8l guess now a 12-car 387 but of course terminating at Didcot Parkway.

 

[RPI]

Used to stop at every lamppost with 50s and mk2s….

Ah they were the days.... but back then there were a few faster ones throughout the day, quite a few ran Honiton > Exeter Central fast at least

 

[PeterC]

It's not too rare to see Chiltern running some of the local midlands services with 168s, I've seen them on Stratford runs a few times (usually they use 165s for this)

They have turned up on Aylesbury services from time to time as well.

 

[JonathanH]

They have turned up on Aylesbury services from time to time as well.

168s have to turn up on Aylesbury services for maintenance purposes.

 

[nw1]

I mean, dare I mention, Waterloo to Exeter? Stops at every lamp post using 159's

Kind-of but not really the services I had in mind, which were local stopping services of limited journey duration. These fall into the category of 'fast, becoming stopping as they approach their destination'; obviously if one was only travelling to Salisbury, the services would be pretty fast!

So this is not what you are interested in: 1C25

But would this be more like what you are interested in: 2C73

Kind-of. The second service is an oddity: a long-distance service which stops almost everywhere.

In this area, something like a Bristol to Taunton or Bristol to Westbury stopper would be the sort of working I have in mind, or a Bristol to Cardiff all-stations (I am aware that there are a few Bristol-Cardiff workings, but it would have to be all stations rather than just something like Filton Abbey Wood-Severn Tunnel Junction-Newport). So the post further up-thread with IC stock off a Manchester service working a Bristol to Taunton local (assuming it's a separate advertised service) would be a good example.

 

[RH Liner]

They also, recently, had a Matlock to Skegness single journey for operational convenience although it didn’t last long at all.

Meridians sometimes worked Leicester to Lincoln stoppers and, as mentioned, the Crewe service when it got extremely busy

I believe the use of Meridians on the Leicester to Lincoln Route was to cover for refurbishment of 158s. The service tended to run fast from Nottingham to Newark Castle with the Matlock-Newarks serving the intermediate stations between. Then again my memory could be playing tricks, it often does these days.

 

[vlad]

I once got a 158 on the Walsall to Birmingham stopper rather than the 323 I was expecting. I don't know whether this interworked with the Chase Line services or they just put the train on because they had one free. It's a good job they did as due to flooding, all electric trains out of Birmingham New Street were cancelled.

 

[Strathclyder]

Then there were the 90 + hauled stock workings to North Berwick…

The North Berwick 90+short Mk3 sets+DVTs are most associated with the National Express era (believe it started in earnest after the demise of the 305s in late 2001/early 2002, but am willing to be corrected there; they shared the route with SPT 318s on and off too during this time), but it managed to last well into the First ScotRail era. Indeed, the second of the linked images below is dated 30th June 2005, 8 months into First's franchise.

North Berwick 90

In the period when weekday Edinburgh to North Berwick services were operated using Class 90 locomotives and ex-VWC Mark 3 stock with a DVT, 90017 approaches Drem Junction with the 13:17 North Berwick to Edinburgh service. Drem Junction is where the North Berwick branch joins the ECML.

www.flickr.com

North Berwick 'Law'

On 30th June 2005, during the period of locomotive-haulage on North Berwick services, EWS Class 90 No. 90026 is seen rounding the curve on the approach to Drem Junction, where the North Berwick branch joins the East Coast Mainline, while heading a North Berwick - Edinburgh Waverley service. Note...

www.flickr.com

90030 PST 1617 NBW-EDB 23-7-04

Owing to an EMU shortage in the summer of 2004, North Berwick services used 90s and a short push-pull set on Mon-Fri for the duration; on 23 July 2004 we see 90030 at Prestonpans on the 1617 North Berwick - Edinburgh.

www.flickr.com

EWS 90036, Drem

English Welsh & Scottish Railway Class 90, 90036, passes through Drem Up Passenger Loop with a ScotRail Railways service from Edinburgh to North Berwick

www.flickr.com

(linked images copyright of Flickr's RobT653, John Whitehouse, 6089Gardener & Ewan respectively)

Their continued frequent use was puntucated by relevent stop signs being erected at the intermediate stations, such as here at Musselburgh:


(318253 arrives at Musselburgh with the 1519 from Glasgow Central to North Berwick - 17th September 2004. Copyright of Flickr's 6089Gardener)

 

[apinnard]

A lot of Southend Victoria - Liverpool Street services are Class 2 throughout

I believe the class 2 is to signify the timetabled stop at Romford vs the class 1s which do not stop there.

 

[Shimbleshanks]

I remember about 20 years ago trundling through the south London suburbs on an all-stations stopper via South Bemondsey in one of the class 319/2s that had that strange little buffet/lounge area in one of the middle cars. No drinks being served, alas...

 

[jfollows]

Historically, in 1979 there was an 07:20 Chertsey-Waterloo which came off Clapham Yard empty with an ED (Class 73) and used a West of England rake which worked an Exeter service after arriving into Waterloo.

 

[47827]

Another rather odd one just sprung to mind. In the early 90s all the Allerton bound services off Lime Street had to be diverted via Edge Hill depot due to engineering works (it would never be allowed now but in BR days was still doable) and it was decided the Liverpool to Crewe stoppers, among other things, should start at Allerton. To provide a connection to there from the other 3 intermediate stations the Euston service was "all stations" with various electrics and mostly mk3 dvt sets.

 

[Mat17]

Back in 2001-2003, FNW did both versions - express units on stoppers and stoppers on expresses.

Sheffield- Manchester, Hope Valley stoppers sometimes landed a 156 - instead of the more usual 142 or 150/1.

Conversely, the Manchester - Marple expresses were booked as 101s.

 

[LowLevel]

Back in 2001-2003, FNW did both versions - express units on stoppers and stoppers on expresses.

Sheffield- Manchester, Hope Valley stoppers sometimes landed a 156 - instead of the more usual 142 or 150/1.

Conversely, the Manchester - Marple expresses were booked as 101s.

Can a 9 mile suburban shuttle to Marple really be considered an express

 

[Mat17]

Can a 9 mile suburban shuttle to Marple really be considered an express

Well it missed out all the stops except Romiley and Marple. Surely that qualifies as an express? Sure it's not a long distance one, but it's certainly not a stopper. Let's call it a local express

And yet the New Mills Central stoppers were also 156s.

 

[QSK19]

The 0558, 2A00, off Derby to Nottingham is booked a XC 220.

It's not unknown for a 222 to end up on an early morning Nottingham - Leicester, and they're used pretty frequently when the races are on at Uttoxeter.

The 222s have been used on the Ivanhoe line for major events in Leicester such as when the football team was on course to win the Premier League and associated celebrations thereafter - it was a case of ferrying loads of people from Barrow/Sileby/Syston to/from the city. I’ve also seen one operate the Ivanhoe line during the afternoon rush hour too - I remember returning to Loughborough one day after jury service ended for the day and just missed the 222 in question by seconds!

A video of a 222 using the Ivanhoe line is here:

 

[Devon Sunset]

The North Berwick 90+short Mk3 sets+DVTs are most associated with the National Express era (believe it started in earnest after the demise of the 305s in late 2001/early 2002, but am willing to be corrected there; they shared the route with SPT 318s on and off too during this time), but it managed to last well into the First ScotRail era. Indeed, the second of the linked images below is dated 30th June 2005, 8 months into First's franchise.

North Berwick 90

In the period when weekday Edinburgh to North Berwick services were operated using Class 90 locomotives and ex-VWC Mark 3 stock with a DVT, 90017 approaches Drem Junction with the 13:17 North Berwick to Edinburgh service. Drem Junction is where the North Berwick branch joins the ECML.

www.flickr.com

North Berwick 'Law'

On 30th June 2005, during the period of locomotive-haulage on North Berwick services, EWS Class 90 No. 90026 is seen rounding the curve on the approach to Drem Junction, where the North Berwick branch joins the East Coast Mainline, while heading a North Berwick - Edinburgh Waverley service. Note...

www.flickr.com

90030 PST 1617 NBW-EDB 23-7-04

Owing to an EMU shortage in the summer of 2004, North Berwick services used 90s and a short push-pull set on Mon-Fri for the duration; on 23 July 2004 we see 90030 at Prestonpans on the 1617 North Berwick - Edinburgh.

www.flickr.com

EWS 90036, Drem

English Welsh & Scottish Railway Class 90, 90036, passes through Drem Up Passenger Loop with a ScotRail Railways service from Edinburgh to North Berwick

www.flickr.com

(linked images copyright of Flickr's RobT653, John Whitehouse, 6089Gardener & Ewan respectively)

Their continued frequent use was puntucated by relevent stop signs being erected at the intermediate stations, such as here at Musselburgh:

View attachment 110366
(318253 arrives at Musselburgh with the 1519 from Glasgow Central to North Berwick - 17th September 2004. Copyright of Flickr's 6089Gardener)

These were route conducted by drivers and guards from Edinburgh to North Berwick and back.

 

[47827]

These were route conducted by drivers and guards from Edinburgh to North Berwick and back.

I think it was EWS drivers hired in as Scotrail had no competency on 90s but they did have some Edinburgh based staff competent on Mk3s off various sleeper portions. No idea if there was enough of the latter for the full North Berwick service to be Mk3s at the time but imagine there could be some dual competency up there at the time.

 

[Devon Sunset]

I think it was EWS drivers hired in as Scotrail had no competency on 90s but they did have some Edinburgh based staff competent on Mk3s off various sleeper portions. No idea if there was enough of the latter for the full North Berwick service to be Mk3s at the time but imagine there could be some dual competency up there at the time.

Sorry I meant the 318's. The 90's and mk111's were EWS drivers and ScotRail guards.

 

[CAF397]

Another rather odd one just sprung to mind. In the early 90s all the Allerton bound services off Lime Street had to be diverted via Edge Hill depot due to engineering works (it would never be allowed now but in BR days was still doable)

Just last year GWR services were diverted through St Philips Marsh depot in Bristol due to engineering works.

 

[brad465]

A long time ago, back in the days that 16x 365s were with CSE, a 365 did a stopper run between Victoria and Dartford, before going up to Cannon St as another stopper service, in order to be in position for a peak working down the Chatham Mainline from Cannon St. Apparently 375s did this for a short while as well up to 2005.

 

[py_megapixel]

Back in 2001-2003, FNW did both versions - express units on stoppers and stoppers on expresses.

Sheffield- Manchester, Hope Valley stoppers sometimes landed a 156 - instead of the more usual 142 or 150/1.

Conversely, the Manchester - Marple expresses were booked as 101s.

Even now, 156s are not uncommon on all-stoppers to Buxton, and also one often gets put on the Southport line when (not if!) a 769 fails.

 

[Sleepy]

A lot of Southend Victoria - Liverpool Street services are Class 2 throughout

The Romford effect ! Lol

 

[61653 HTAFC]

A historic one, the FGW/GWR HST sets to Weston-super-Mare had morning and evening calls at some of the smaller stations between Weston and Bristol, doubling as Bristol commuter services. A full length HST set calling at Weston Milton was always an odd sight to me!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Even now, 156s are not uncommon on all-stoppers to Buxton, and also one often gets put on the Southport line when (not if!) a 769 fails.

Since the Pacers’ withdrawal, the 156s and 158s have become more common stock for stopping services while CAFs drive on the expresses.

 

[TXMISTA]

A historic one, the FGW/GWR HST sets to Weston-super-Mare had morning and evening calls at some of the smaller stations between Weston and Bristol, doubling as Bristol commuter services. A full length HST set calling at Weston Milton was always an odd sight to me!

They still do, albeit with IETs instead.

 

[nw1]

Ah they were the days.... but back then there were a few faster ones throughout the day, quite a few ran Honiton > Exeter Central fast at least

Indeed, the usual announcement at Woking was "...Axminster, Honiton, Exeter Central and Exeter St. Davids". Still ingrained in my memory; Feniton, Whimple and Pinhoe seemed to receive very few stops. This is the 1983-85 period.

They still do, albeit with IETs instead.

And they did in BR days too, I distinctly remember Weston Milton as a calling point for some HSTs at Reading in the 1983-86 period.

Well it missed out all the stops except Romiley and Marple. Surely that qualifies as an express? Sure it's not a long distance one, but it's certainly not a stopper. Let's call it a local express

And yet the New Mills Central stoppers were also 156s.

Might be the equivalent of a peak service starting at Waterloo then fast to Walton-on-Thames, Weybridge, and Woking, before going into the sidings.

I would not expect (at various times) CIGs, 442s, or 444s on such a service, other than for operational convenience!

 

[nw1]

A bit late to the party but to confirm something that I swear I noticed in early 1984 and can now confirm to be true thanks to working books on the groups.io brcoachingstock group:

13.01 Paddington to Oxford stopping service that year (a regular hourly off peak stopper in the standard clockface pattern, most services formed by 117 DMUs), formed of loco-hauled stock. Returned to Paddington as a fast before working a Newbury peak service.

 

[Andy Pacer]

It's not unknown for a 222 to end up on an early morning Nottingham - Leicester.

I've not noticed instances of this since Covid though.

I believe the use of Meridians on the Leicester to Lincoln Route was to cover for refurbishment of 158s. The service tended to run fast from Nottingham to Newark Castle with the Matlock-Newarks serving the intermediate stations between. Then again my memory could be playing tricks, it often does these days.

You're quite right, they had a regular 4 car diagram (Monday and Friday only).

The 222s have been used on the Ivanhoe line for major events in Leicester such as when the football team was on course to win the Premier League and associated celebrations thereafter - it was a case of ferrying loads of people from Barrow/Sileby/Syston to/from the city. I’ve also seen one operate the Ivanhoe line during the afternoon rush hour too - I remember returning to Loughborough one day after jury service ended for the day and just missed the 222 in question by seconds!

A video of a 222 using the Ivanhoe line is here:

More recently the additional specials have been 6 car DMU combinations, the same with the Uttoxeter line.
The Monday and Friday diagram used to do the 1630 (ish) of Leicester which may be the one you used.
Good to see my home station in your video!

 

[Saj8]

Just before covid, in order to save an extra turbo having to be kept overnight at Oxford, GWR introduced an early 9 car IET Oxford to Didcot class 2 calling at Radley, which then came back empty stock to Oxford. The set was stabled overnight at Oxford, but not required to start its express work until later on, so they made use of it on the stopper. There's normally never more than 5 passengers on it. But because of the Radley stop, they had to taxi a guard from Reading to Oxford to work it because it ran before the first train from Reading got to Oxford. I think it still runs now, but with a 5 car.