Locomotive Services Fleet (LSL) updates

[Whistler40145]

AFAI 47712 wasn’t ever fitted with Green Circle multiple working equipment

 

[Nym]

Just returning it to it's as-converted class 57 appearance, seeing as LSL see no requirement for Dellner couplers in their usual business activities.

One does have to wonder what they're going with the 27 way on the front of it... Given that 57/3s don't have multi working and the removal of the Dellner means it's not going to couple to anything other than with a screw coupler.

And no, there has never been any requirement for any head end jumpers on this 57/3 as it hadn't been through the "BIU Mod" for Network Rail that fitted a 27 way to connect to the drop head Dellner.

Some suspicions here that LSL are having some wishful thinking of Multi-Working 57/3s without issues...?

 

[12LDA28C]

AFAI 47712 wasn’t ever fitted with Green Circle multiple working equipment

It is now

 

[Alanko]

I believe the control now runs through the multi-working jumper so the original TDM cables are no longer used and are retained just for authenticity.

I'm sure they could code something up on a Raspberry Pi to make the lights flicker authentically as well!

 

[12LDA28C]

Isn't green circle just a variant of blue star?

The two systems are very similar but not identical. I wouldn't like to try to multi up a blue star loco to a green circle.

One does have to wonder what they're going with the 27 way on the front of it... Given that 57/3s don't have multi working and the removal of the Dellner means it's not going to couple to anything other than with a screw coupler.

And no, there has never been any requirement for any head end jumpers on this 57/3 as it hadn't been through the "BIU Mod" for Network Rail that fitted a 27 way to connect to the drop head Dellner.

Some suspicions here that LSL are having some wishful thinking of Multi-Working 57/3s without issues...?

They are planning to be able to work the 57s in multi with each other I believe, but not with their 47s.

 

[Nym]

The two systems are very similar but not identical. I wouldn't like to try to multi up a blue star loco to a green circle.



They are planning to be able to work the 57s in multi with each other I believe, but not with their 47s.

Well, even though it's not possible for them to work in multiple with Class 47s, I'm sure someone would be hopeful that they could make 57s work in multiple with 47s.

I do suspect that LSL haven't considered the nuances of making 57s work in multiple though. It's not as simple as join them together and shove the control wires through.

 

[Wyrleybart]

Well, even though it's not possible for them to work in multiple with Class 47s, I'm sure someone would be hopeful that they could make 57s work in multiple with 47s.

I do suspect that LSL haven't considered the nuances of making 57s work in multiple though. It's not as simple as join them together and shove the control wires through.

Don't know much, but I do know that the blue star system uses control air (white pipe) to increase and decrease the power application on the locos - because most indigenous Uk locos used air for engine control. North American locos on the other hand tend to work on notches which can be controlled electrically - via the AAR jumper cable, so control air is not used.

What I don't know is how the 57/0 multi works - fitted after they had passed from Freightliner to DRS

 

[The_Train]

I'm sure I have seen a photo of one of the 57s at Eastleigh in a very stateman like livery but I can't seem to find it anywhere now and I'm starting to think I dreamt it (we all dream of trains, right?!?).

Does anyone have a copy of the photo or if it cannot be shared, advise of the colour scheme please?

 

[12LDA28C]

I'm sure I have seen a photo of one of the 57s at Eastleigh in a very stateman like livery but I can't seem to find it anywhere now and I'm starting to think I dreamt it (we all dream of trains, right?!?).

Does anyone have a copy of the photo or if it cannot be shared, advise of the colour scheme please?

It's in LNWR lined black livery, very similar to the colour scheme Pete Waterman had his 47s painted in, in the late 1990s.

Quite surprising that the 57s are not receiving 'chocolate and cream' livery to match the Statesman stock, if that is the train they will be used for.

 

[The_Train]

It's in LNWR lined black livery, very similar to the colour scheme Pete Waterman had his 47s painted in, in the late 1990s.

Quite surprising that the 57s are not receiving 'chocolate and cream' livery to match the Statesman stock, if that is the train they will be used for.

Thanks, it's definitely that which I saw so at least I know I am not dreaming of 57s

The colour scheme would suggest it is planned for the Statesman stock, certainly unlikely to appear on the Intercity jobs. I think sometimes, a loco livery slightly different to the coaching stock but of similar class can look quite good

Edit: Can I also please confirm that it is indeed 57311 that has received this paint job?

 

[12LDA28C]

Thanks, it's definitely that which I saw so at least I know I am not dreaming of 57s

The colour scheme would suggest it is planned for the Statesman stock, certainly unlikely to appear on the Intercity jobs. I think sometimes, a loco livery slightly different to the coaching stock but of similar class can look quite good

Edit: Can I also please confirm that it is indeed 57311 that has received this paint job?

Yes, 57311. The colour scheme doesn't really suggest anything as it doesn't match any stock LSL operate and they don't have any other diesels in this livery, but I understand the 57s are to be used on the Statesman.

Certainly when DRS operated the Northern Belle, the locos were painted to match the stock but clearly LSL are taking a different approach, using more authentic 'historic' liveries for their locos.

 

[The_Train]

Yes, 57311. The colour scheme doesn't really suggest anything as it doesn't match any stock LSL operate and they don't have any other diesels in this livery, but I understand the 57s are to be used on the Statesman.

Certainly when DRS operated the Northern Belle, the locos were painted to match the stock but clearly LSL are taking a different approach, using more authentic 'historic' liveries for their locos.

I don't think anyone would have batted an eyelid had it been painted to match the stock but I often think LSL prefer to turn eyes. Will be interesting to see how it looks with the stock!

As one final question, I presume it has also lost it's "Thunderbird" name since leaving DRS?

 

[12LDA28C]

I don't think anyone would have batted an eyelid had it been painted to match the stock but I often think LSL prefer to turn eyes. Will be interesting to see how it looks with the stock!

As one final question, I presume it has also lost it's "Thunderbird" name since leaving DRS?

I would certainly assume so as it would appear rather incongruous now, no longer being a 'rescue' loco. Most likely LSL will apply their own name in time, as they see fit.

 

[Nym]

LSL being attention seekers, no... who'd have thunk it...

Wonder if they'll apply the same enthusiasm for liveries to making the locomotives work properly?

 

[12LDA28C]

LSL being attention seekers, no... who'd have thunk it...

Wonder if they'll apply the same enthusiasm for liveries to making the locomotives work properly?

I'm sure you'd aim the same question at Arlington, as they're doing the overhauls.

 

[Nym]

I'm sure you'd aim the same question at Arlington, as they're doing the overhauls.

I don't wish for this to descend into a B-wording contest but I've never been too happy with the work done by Arlington either.

 

[Cowley]

I don't wish for this to descend into a B-wording contest but I've never been too happy with the work done by Arlington either.

I wouldn’t worry too much because I don’t expect the bills are coming to you @Nym.

 

[D365]

I wouldn’t worry too much because I don’t expect the bills are coming to you @Nym.

We’re not high enough up the food chain for those kinds of concerns!

 

[31160]

Is there any sign at all of 45118 doing anything constructive

 

[45076]

Is there any sign at all of 45118 doing anything constructive

The last I heard about 118 was that it was still in bits, the bogies had been shot blasted and were waiting on reassembly. I think it's still a way off being ready for anything.

 

[Cowley]

The last I heard about 118 was that it was still in bits, the bogies had been shot blasted and were waiting on reassembly. I think it's still a way off being ready for anything.

I might be getting my Peaks mixed up but wasn’t that booked to run a railtour fairly recently?

 

[45076]

I might be getting my Peaks mixed up but wasn’t that booked to run a railtour fairly recently?

it should have done at least 2 last year LSL did say in their adverts that the loco may not be ready and if so other traction would be provided in the form of class 37's.

 

[31160]

The last I heard about 118 was that it was still in bits, the bogies had been shot blasted and were waiting on reassembly. I think it's still a way off being ready for anything.

Thanks, the clock is ticking on having out of the Cross before the new fangled signals are put in then its a big full stop on that

 

[Jamesrob637]

Thanks, the clock is ticking on having out of the Cross before the new fangled signals are put in then its a big full stop on that

Is an old locomotive not compatible with new signals?

 

[Intercity110]

Is an old locomotive not compatible with new signals?

they could mean ETCS and the loco may not have enough space for that.

 

[Wyrleybart]

Is an old locomotive not compatible with new signals?

As Intercity110 implied ETCS is going to be installed between Kings Cross and Stoke tunnel. This is basically an upscale of the system used on the Cambrian lines since it replaced RETB. The class 37s fitted with it had to have one of the boiler / fuel tanks removed to fit the ETCS kit underneath, and the TfW class 158s have had a pair of seats removed to get the "suitcase" of ETCS kit into the salon.

You will appreciate that any train working the ECML between Kings Cross and Grantham will in future need the same "suitcase" of electronic gubbins to allow it to run. I believe the track between Peterborough and the Helpston will have signals whereas south of Peterborough I believe they eventually intend to chop down all the signals and rely totally on in cab signaling.

You might want to look at the work being done on the steam loco 60163 "Tornado" as that will be the first ETCS fitted steam loco, a deltic also to be fitted.
Take a look at this video from about 36 minutes

 

[D365]

You might want to look at the work being done on the steam loco 60163 "Tornado" as that will be the first ETCS fitted steam loco, a deltic also to be fitted.
Take a look at this video from about 36 minutes

Also worth noting that ETCS fitments for Class 37 are also being progressed, although the future of this particular workstream really depends on whether DRS/Colas see a long term future for heritage vehicles in their respective fleets.

they could mean ETCS and the loco may not have enough space for that.

Most ex-BR locos don’t have space, but we’re still trying!

 

[Meerkat]

I thought modern electronics were supposed to be small!

 

[D365]

I thought modern electronics were supposed to be small!

It's not just the computers; at least half of the volume is relays and power supplies.

 

[Richard Scott]

It's not just the computers; at least half of the volume is relays and power supplies.

Going back to 45118, 45s have next to no space inside for any substantial kit. In a 45/1, if the equipment is not too large, may be space in former boiler room.