Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[Avenger20]

Looks like the new Amazon contacts have now started, this Flickr page has several photos: https://www.flickr.com/photos/blaircamerontransport/page1

Going by these photos the buses and coaches in use yesterday were as follows:

1126 - SB19 GLK
1127 - SB19 GLV
1128 - SB19 GLY
1129 - SB19 GLZ
1130 - SB19 GME
1131 - SB19 GMF
9001 - SN18 CVT
9002 - SN18 CVU
9004 - SN18 CVW
9005 - SN18 CVX
9201 - SB19 GKE
9202 - SB19 GKF

Edit - looks like Bus9120UK beat me to it!

Very interesting to see so many vehicles in use for this operation.

Are there any more specifics on what the work entails? I imagine it must pay well as there is surely a lot of empty running involved.

 

[OmniCity999]

Very interesting to see so many vehicles in use for this operation.

Are there any more specifics on what the work entails? I imagine it must pay well as there is surely a lot of empty running involved.

Without being cheeky, its just picking people up and dropping them off - i understand, though that there is a lot of waiting around and empty miles.

But there is good profit in it.

Amazon have worked very closely to ensure their standards are met with regards to capacity and distancing. But as mentioned, its allowing private hire work to continue which means all of the subsidiaries are bringing money in.

I have however heard that Longstone is to receive upgraded coach handling hardware, toilet dumping and the such so we could be seeing the end of Newbridge, however for the time being it has been very useful. OR we could just be getting more useful facilities to spread the fleet out. It would however be nice to pick up some Citylink, Megabus or National Express work once Covid is done with - Longstone would be a better base for this.

A few of the Green Arrows are being prepped for paint into LMC colours so one would assume that LMC are here to stay for the time being. Im lead to believe not all are being done, though. I'd imagine LMC will last at least until the current load of coaches are considered life expired - it could prove to be more "fruitful" than selling up etc.

 

[dominiktezenis]

For me,
Driving position, derated engine doesn't work well with the I-shift,

The nearside mirror is unnecessarily bulky, low hanging and sticks out too far - have to be extra wary of this at bus stops in regards to people and places where you're tight against walls or foliage.

See - View attachment 85307

When battery charge is low they're very jerky in low gears, in regen mode / low charge they're jerky pulling away and difficult to drive smoothly and struggle climbing hills often trying to use almost every gear. Gear changes can be slow so if you've pulled out safely on a roundabout or junction traffic quickly catches up to you so you have to bear this in mind when making decisions to pull out.

There's certain situations (e.g turning left off Hailesland Road onto Murrayburn Road) where they'll try to pull off on electric power but the motors aren't powerful enough so they'll just stop, engage gear and try again in diesel. Occasionally the 13 plates just stall in that situation.

General build quality isn't very good, I believe they were made in Poland - I've driven Swedish and Polish built Scania OmniCitys before and the difference was night and day in regards to build quality. The cab area in particular is quite rattly on a 7900.

Capacity is/was an issue before covid.

Don't know why the B5LHs are so different to drive, rarely have any of the above issues when I've driven those so can only really put it down to the single deck chassis being derated in terms of engine power and presumably the motors. The 14/64 plates with the more powerful euro 6 engine are better but still suffer with the same issues.

Obviously they're maintained to the highest standards so there's no issues there - but in my opinion they're just a flawed design.
Probably why there's so few of them in the UK but I don't think there was any real full diesel alternative at the time for single decks?

That's my Top Gear review of a 7900 - brought to you from inside a 7900 . Wouldn't know much from the engineering perspective of them but the impression I get is they're not well liked either.

Bad news for you.
Both Scanias was made in this same factory in Poland.

 

[CN04NRJ]

Bad news for you.
Both Scanias was made in this same factory in Poland.

Bad news how? Thanks for the correction I guess?

Either way, build quality of Scania bodies nosedived after 2006.

 

[Swanny200]

Without being cheeky, its just picking people up and dropping them off - i understand, though that there is a lot of waiting around and empty miles.

But there is good profit in it.

Amazon have worked very closely to ensure their standards are met with regards to capacity and distancing. But as mentioned, its allowing private hire work to continue which means all of the subsidiaries are bringing money in.

I have however heard that Longstone is to receive upgraded coach handling hardware, toilet dumping and the such so we could be seeing the end of Newbridge, however for the time being it has been very useful. OR we could just be getting more useful facilities to spread the fleet out. It would however be nice to pick up some Citylink, Megabus or National Express work once Covid is done with - Longstone would be a better base for this.

A few of the Green Arrows are being prepped for paint into LMC colours so one would assume that LMC are here to stay for the time being. Im lead to believe not all are being done, though. I'd imagine LMC will last at least until the current load of coaches are considered life expired - it could prove to be more "fruitful" than selling up etc.

Has Lothian ever had NX work?, I would imagine that if they were to gain some NX work, then they would have to use Levante's

 

[CN04NRJ]

Has Lothian ever had NX work?, I would imagine that if they were to gain some NX work, then they would have to use Levante's

I think they've done some dupes at some point, one NX destination was certainly programmed into the Hanover blinds at one point.

 

[Swanny200]

I think they've done some dupes at some point, one NX destination was certainly programmed into the Hanover blinds at one point (photo of a B7RLE displaying 440 London.)

View attachment 85417

That would have been a nice and comfy trip, that's for sure

 

[CN04NRJ]

That would have been a nice and comfy trip, that's for sure

I seem to recall seeing some photos of LMC actually doing NX dupes (unlike that B7RLE! ) but I can't find them at the moment. @OmniCity999 would probably be able to confirm.

 

[OmniCity999]

Has Lothian ever had NX work?, I would imagine that if they were to gain some NX work, then they would have to use Levante's

Levantes aren't a requirement - coaches of a similar spec are allowed, namely Elites, which share the same chassis anyway.

I seem to recall seeing some photos of LMC actually doing NX dupes (unlike that B7RLE! ) but I can't find them at the moment. @OmniCity999 would probably be able to confirm.

They have indeed run dupes a couple times, there was talk of national express work being taken on well before covid, with some used Elites on the order books, but the order was cancelled as well as the order for used wheelchair accessible coaches.

I think they've done some dupes at some point, one NX destination was certainly programmed into the Hanover blinds at one point.

Would you be able to PM me that photo you edited out? :P got a bit of a thing for weird destinations! It was the thing that actually got me into buses.

When I say a thing, I mean an interest, not a fetish...

 

[Bungle965]

They have indeed run dupes a couple times, there was talk of national express work being taken on well before covid, with some used Elites on the order books, but the order was cancelled as well as the order for used wheelchair accessible coaches.

National Express allowing them to operate Elite's is interesting given that they made all of their other contractors use Levantes including Parks who were most fond of their Elite's.

 

[OmniCity999]

National Express allowing them to operate Elite's is interesting given that they made all of their other contractors use Levantes including Parks who were most fond of their Elite's.

I believe it was down to Lothian wanting to prove the viability of the routes/work first. Start second hand then buy new when the work has proven itself.

It was decided not to go in all guns blazing, which seemed sensible compared to previous experience.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Some (if not all) of the GreenArrow Leopards have been debranded.

It was decided not to go in all guns blazing, which seemed sensible compared to previous experience.

That makes a change then! Hopefully GreenArrow can be a lesson for them in the future.

 

[Highland050261]

Will 181 return to the road or was it to badly damaged

 

[ScotRail158725]

Will 181 return to the road or was it to badly damaged

the extent of damage isnt what determines if it gets fixed. the damage wasn’t even that bad and is definitely easily fixable however covid circumstances, book value etc... all coming into play Lothian could manage with one less vehicle

 

[Graham Alexand]

the extent of damage isnt what determines if it gets fixed. the damage wasn’t even that bad and is definitely easily fixable however covid circumstances, book value etc... all coming into play Lothian could manage with one less vehicle

Is there any photos of the damage?

 

[ScotRail158725]

Is there any photos of the damage?

From the old West Lothian buses forum:

 

[Graham Alexand]

From the old West Lothian buses forum:

Thank you.

What even started the fire?

 

[ScotRail158725]

Thank you.

What even started the fire?

Speculation that it was the exhaust conversion as its at the right rear corner where as you can see the damage is around aswell as the fact it happened on the second day out after its conversion

 

[Bus9120UK]

Speculation that it was the exhaust conversion as its at the right rear corner where as you can see the damage is around aswell as the fact it happened on the second day out after its conversion

Small correction, it was the third day in service following its conversion, not two days after it got converted.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Some (if not all) of the GreenArrow Leopards have been debranded.



That makes a change then! Hopefully GreenArrow can be a lesson for them in the future.

*drinks tea*
oh boy lets hope this dosnt start another forum civil war

 

[CN04NRJ]

Some (if not all) of the GreenArrow Leopards have been debranded.



That makes a change then! Hopefully GreenArrow can be a lesson for them in the future.

Not to try new things and innovate? Obviously it didn't work in this case but still..

 

[Graham Alexand]

Speculation that it was the exhaust conversion as its at the right rear corner where as you can see the damage is around aswell as the fact it happened on the second day out after its conversion

So i take it it used to be a Euro 5 bus.

 

[OmniCity999]

So i take it it used to be a Euro 5 bus.

well, technically it still is, its just damaged and out of service

 

[Graham Alexand]

well, technically it still is, its just damaged and out of service

I thought it was upgraded to Euro 6 was it not?

 

[OmniCity999]

I thought it was upgraded to Euro 6 was it not?

Ah yes, apologies - i read that without paying attention.

 

[Graham Alexand]

Ah yes, apologies - i read that without paying attention.

Thank you, its ok you don't have to apologise

 

[Jordan Adam]

Not to try new things and innovate? Obviously it didn't work in this case but still..

No not at all, I'm more talking about not to overinvest in high risk ventures, it would've made more commercial sense to invest in midlife vehicles or refurbish midlife vehicles already in the fleet with coach seating for the services rather than invest in 8 brand new custom built coaches, i don't think it's a discussion that needs to be had any further but i'd hate to imagine the losses they've made from it.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

Minor changes from November 15th: https://www.lothianbuses.com/news/2020/11/service-change-15-november-2020

Lothian will introduce a further service change to the network from Sunday 15 November.

Teams across Lothian have continued to analyse travel patterns and customer feedback to ensure the business is meeting the needs of as many customers as possible in line with current Scottish Government guidance and public health information, in response to the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic.

The following are some of the key changes on Lothian Buses’ network which will take effect from 15 November:

• Service 19 – new Monday to Friday morning peak duplicate journey introduced between Granton and the West End.
• Service 22 – minor timetable changes on Mondays to Fridays including the introduction of an earlier morning journey from The Gyle on all days of the week. Saturday daytime frequency is increased to every 10-minutes and Sunday daytime frequency increased to every 15-minutes.
• Service 30 – revised timetable with improved daytime and early evening frequency on all days of the week.
• Service 38 – on Mondays to Fridays an additional morning peak journey will be introduced between Balgreen and the RIE. On Mondays to Saturdays, new journeys from the RIE to Longstone will be introduced at 19:50 and 20:50.
• Service 42 – journeys between Leith Links and Holyrood High School will now commence and terminate at North Junction Street to provide better coverage of the Leith area.

Changes to Airport buses are as follows:

• Airlink 100 – revised timetable on all days of the week with the frequency between 04:00 & 24:00 reduced to every 15-minutes. Night journeys will continue to operate every 30-minutes.
• Skylink 400 – additional afternoon duplicate introduced between The Gyle and Hyvots for school pupils.

There are no changes to Lothian Country, EastCoastbuses or Nightbus services at this time.

 

[CN04NRJ]

I

No not at all, I'm more talking about not to overinvest in high risk ventures, it would've made more commercial sense to invest in midlife vehicles or refurbish midlife vehicles already in the fleet with coach seating for the services rather than invest in 8 brand new custom built coaches, i don't think it's a discussion that needs to be had any further but i'd hate to imagine the losses they've made from it.

I'm inclined to agree with you actually now with your expanded point.

I do wonder how things would have panned out with the EX2/X38 and LMC if covid hadn't have happened.


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Also, 175 made it out last night for one trip on the 30 - it's good to see these back on the road.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Minor changes from November 15th: https://www.lothianbuses.com/news/2020/11/service-change-15-november-2020

Folk: Pls extend the 15 and 300 back to its full route and reinstate the X38

lothian: hmmmm.. thats a good idea, nahhh