Manchester - Liverpool Electrification

[Manchester77]

The MR article states how work has slipped with parts of the OHLE suspended with blue rope supporting the registration arm, temporary droppers still to be replaced, poorly installed contact droppers (the one pictured in the article says that it's s badly installed the loop could be hit by a pantograph), a contact wire upside down... and they were just pictures taken at Eccles...

The article states that these appear to be signs work overran in possessions and so weren't finished off

 

[YorkshireBear]

How much scope is their for coming back and fixing it?

 

[Manchester77]

The wires are supposed to go live on the 24th so it'd just leave this weekend the likelihood of this happening is questionable.

 

[swt_passenger]

How much scope is their for coming back and fixing it?

Depends what the lead time is for a Modern Railways article. It could be referring to the situation 2 or 3 weeks ago for all I know...

 

[YorkshireBear]

Depends what the lead time is for a Modern Railways article. It could be referring to the situation 2 or 3 weeks ago for all I know...

I think that is likely to be lead time based on previous issues where thing 10 days before they go on sale are not even mentioned and things two weeks before the deadline get 2 sentences in a corner clearly as just about get it in. 3-4 weeks wouldn't surprise me.

 

[Darren R]

Would have put it more down to lack of planning by BB, rushing to get the wires up at all costs by a set date, and cheap wire purchased, than the recruitment and skill of the various wiring teams involved.

That fills me with confidence! Doesn't bode well for the future, does it? OLE problems have caused disruption around Eccles twice already.

 

[steverailer]

The MR article states how work has slipped with parts of the OHLE suspended with blue rope supporting the registration arm, temporary droppers still to be replaced, poorly installed contact droppers (the one pictured in the article says that it's s badly installed the loop could be hit by a pantograph), a contact wire upside down... and they were just pictures taken at Eccles...

The article states that these appear to be signs work overran in possessions and so weren't finished off

Can clarify that one for you.

The contact droppers were installed to get it safe to turn the power on for section proving and short circuit tests. No electric trains were running on there at the time and they were out of the way of the diesels.

Later the twists in the contact wire that caused the above were chased out so the droppers were aligned properly.

They are definatly not signs of work over run, just a way of getting to the end target on timeish. If it had all been perfect before the switch on, well you'd still be waiting for the power to go on now.

All this is normal, there will still be night and weekend possesions going into the new year to do the snagging jobs.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

How much scope is their for coming back and fixing it?

Lots, currently have possesions everynight except Fridays from 00.30 to 05.00, by the time the iso's are up and c form granted about a 3 hourish work window.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Depends what the lead time is for a Modern Railways article. It could be referring to the situation 2 or 3 weeks ago for all I know...

This would be the point where the rush was on to make it electrically safe so they could turn it on for section proving and short circuit testing.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

That fills me with confidence! Doesn't bode well for the future, does it? OLE problems have caused disruption around Eccles twice already.

One of those problems was down to the planning. Wires run with no tensioner equipment in place, so temp anchored. Then hot weather causing the wires to sag needing retensioning.

Had the correct equipment been inplace before the wire was run there would have been no problem

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

One of those problems was down to the planning. Wires run with no tensioner equipment in place, so temp anchored. Then hot weather causing the wires to sag needing retensioning.
Had the correct equipment been inplace before the wire was run there would have been no problem

To be fair to the wiring team, it was evident months ago that the base and mast installation was running late, particularly the specialist sites over the Moss.
Even around Ordsall Lane there were steelwork gaps very late in the schedule.

 

[edwin_m]

Having had time to read the Modern Railways article thorougly, it mentions that the pictures were taken on 22 October at Eccles but the situation four days later was similar.

 

[HowardGWR]

Can clarify that one for you.

The contact droppers were installed to get it safe to turn the power on for section proving and short circuit tests. No electric trains were running on there at the time and they were out of the way of the diesels.

Later the twists in the contact wire that caused the above were chased out so the droppers were aligned properly.

They are definatly not signs of work over run, just a way of getting to the end target on timeish. If it had all been perfect before the switch on, well you'd still be waiting for the power to go on now.

All this is normal, there will still be night and weekend possesions going into the new year to do the snagging jobs.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Lots, currently have possesions everynight except Fridays from 00.30 to 05.00, by the time the iso's are up and c form granted about a 3 hourish work window.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


This would be the point where the rush was on to make it electrically safe so they could turn it on for section proving and short circuit testing.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


One of those problems was down to the planning. Wires run with no tensioner equipment in place, so temp anchored. Then hot weather causing the wires to sag needing retensioning.

Had the correct equipment been inplace before the wire was run there would have been no problem

Those are tremendously informative answers, thank you. I hope you will post now and then and keep us informed without of course being disloyal or anything.

 

[WatcherZero]

Depends what the lead time is for a Modern Railways article. It could be referring to the situation 2 or 3 weeks ago for all I know...

Article says they were the conditions in late October and some of the things the photographer saw were fixed when he came back a couple of days later.

 

[Bevan Price]

Some people on here think the Warrington BQ service will be diverted to Manchester Victoria to make 2tph.
I don't suppose anybody's consulted Warrington about it.
It makes very good connections with the London train for St Helens etc.

But very few passengers use the Liverpool - Bank Quay service south of Earlestown. Many of the off-peak trains are nearly empty when I see them whilst taking photos at Winwick.

St, Helens passengers for London mostly travel via Liverpool Lime St., or drive to Runcorn.


Now if they were ever to reopen St. Helens Junction to Central, they could always extend the LM Euston - Crewe services to Preston via Warrington, Earlestown, St. Helens & Wigan...... (well, I can dream.............)

 

[DJH1971]

Now if they were ever to reopen St. Helens Junction to Central, they could always extend the LM Euston - Crewe services to Preston via Warrington, Earlestown, St. Helens & Wigan...... (well, I can dream.............)

Damn good idea there!

 

[Bayum]

Was driving back from Manchester this evening and my GPS took me a very strange way...

Ended up taking the flyovers onto a motorway ring road type thing out towards Eccles on the M602 before being taken onto the M60 via the cloverleaf outside what I now know is Eccles.

My question is, as I was driving along the M602, there was a double track, with OHLE on my left for a few miles or so, before the road then lost sight with it.

Didn't see any trams or trains, so was just wondering if this was part of the wiring effort or whether it was the Metrolink lines.

To be more precise, my map is showing the track next to the M602 from the roundabout on the A5063 and continues until just after Eccles station (which wasn't seen from the motorway)

 

[ianhr]

Damn good idea there!

Is the St.Helen's Junction-St.Helen's Central trackbed reasonably unobstructed? If so I would have thought there is now a strong case for re-instatement. After all they are now talking about putting back the skelmersdale branch.

 

[DJH1971]

Is the St.Helen's Junction-St.Helen's Central trackbed reasonably unobstructed? If so I would have thought there is now a strong case for re-instatement. After all they are now talking about putting back the skelmersdale branch.

It's pretty much unobstructed, and wouldn't take much work getting it back into use.

BTW; travelling into Manchester from St Helens Junction this morning, I saw some excavations actually on both platforms for planting masts/foundations.

 

[Whistler40145]

Would it be beneficial to reopen & electrify St Helens Junction to St Helens Central?

 

[DJH1971]

Would it be beneficial to reopen & electrify St Helens Junction to St Helens Central?

Can't see why not.

It looks rather do-able.

 

[Whistler40145]

Would also be useful if Parkside Jn to Golborne Jn is shut?

 

[The Planner]

Would also be useful if Parkside Jn to Golborne Jn is shut?

Good god no, that now has massive importance now the knitting is up.

As for St Helens Jn to Central, never going to happen. Skelmersdale is just early stages yet, it hasn't even been value managed and decided if there is a business case. It could quite easily get canned.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Would it be beneficial to reopen & electrify St Helens Junction to St Helens Central?

St Helens Jn to Central was last used in 1965 by the Warrington BQ-St Helens Central shuttle (the "St Helens Donkey" I think it was called locally).
That was in the days of big industry at both ends and at Earlestown.

Further up this thread people are saying nobody uses the existing WBQ-Earlestown-St Helens Jn service, so why would they use a service to St Helens Central?
Who else would use such a route? St Helens-Manchester will be quicker via Wigan.
I can't see a Preston-Crewe via St Helens service or any other indirect routeing via St Helens.
The former line to Widnes via Clock Face (which is how the line started) is even less likely to be restored, as most of it vanished under the A562.

There is also a pile of signalling equipment across the former Junction junction .

 

[Dunc108]

St Helens Jn to Central was last used in 1965 by the Warrington BQ-St Helens Central shuttle (the "St Helens Donkey" I think it was called locally).
That was in the days of big industry at both ends and at Earlestown.

Further up this thread people are saying nobody uses the existing WBQ-Earlestown-St Helens Jn service, so why would they use a service to St Helens Central?
Who else would use such a route? St Helens-Manchester will be quicker via Wigan.
I can't see a Preston-Crewe via St Helens service or any other indirect routeing via St Helens.
The former line to Widnes via Clock Face (which is how the line started) is even less likely to be restored, as most of it vanished under the A562.

There is also a pile of signalling equipment across the former Junction junction .

Agree about the Runcorn Gap section via Farnworth & Bold, im not sure if even the trackbed at Clockface has been either filled in or certainly landscaped... it did carry some interesting diversions prior to its 1981 closure, such as some Liverpool - Newcastles & Lime St - Preston DMUs.

 

[WatcherZero]

Merseytravel have included the St Helens link in their list of priority schemes, though its near the bottom.

http://moderngov.merseytravel.uk.net/documents/s9022/Enc. 1 Final Prioritised List.pdf

 

[The Planner]

What is left of that branch is likely to be ripped out when St Helens gets resignalled in the next year or so anyway.

 

[8A Rail]

What is left of that branch is likely to be ripped out when St Helens gets resignalled in the next year or so anyway.

Fact or fiction? Although not 100% sure but I recall the junction at St Helens Central has been renewed in the last few years after the last train to Hayes Chemical's operated. If that is the case a strange thing to do in the circumstances although not unheard of by NR.

 

[The Planner]

All shown in green on the last signalling plan I saw.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Merseytravel have included the St Helens link in their list of priority schemes, though its near the bottom.

http://moderngov.merseytravel.uk.net/documents/s9022/Enc. 1 Final Prioritised List.pdf

I like the idea of something being near the bottom of a list of priority schemes...

 

[DJH1971]

Any more news on the planned Parkside Junction to Castlefield Junction energisation that is planned any time now?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Following on from what I saw yesterday morning at St Helens Junction, here are some pictures that I took.

Phase 2 work is now in my neck of the woods!

 

[DavidL]

Just a quick report to say that things again seem to have sped on around Garswood and St Helens Central. Central's Liverpool bound platform looks much like the Junction's does in DJH1971's pictures above, but there now seems to be pretty continuous mast or gantry upright work both ways from Garswood. Not sure how much further than Spindle Hillock or the M6 they've got (if even there!) in a Wigan direction, but things have certainly flown up this weekend.
Additionally, towards St Helens, there now seems to be an increase in gantry uprights around the college and timberyard by the Gerard's Bridge spur.
(sorry for the lack of appropriate terminology, but hopefully it's clear enough!)

Would love to see a renewed effort to get SNH-SHJ relaid and operational again but share everyone's doubts / cynicism. I realise that while I would personally benefit, there are more beneficial schemes in the Merseytravel PTE area.
Rubber tyred St Helens to Warrington or Widnes public transport is pretty poor so I guess demand is correspondingly low. Whether that's suppressed demand and where it lies on the chicken/egg spectrum, I've no idea

 

[175001]

A few pics from the 2nd phase, and towards Prescot from the weekend.

Roby

And near Prescot.

Plenty of stanchions up and foundations set.