Thanks everyone!Pretty much what CW2 has said in post 2. There were a good number of different permutations of Mk1 carriages so the number of seats per coach could vary, but 64 would be about the maximum number.
Thanks,Don't forget the non-corridor commuter coaches. You could really cram people in on those sitting 6 on each side.
That echoes my thinking, Mk1s from new in the 50's would have been predominantly introduced onto higher profile services whilst local trains in Lancashire almost certainly soldiered on with older stock (LMS second class stock had 7 bays of seating - 56 seats in an open second and the compartment version would have had 42) and quite possibly non-corridor stock (6 a side as noted above). I imagine some of the published photographic books covering that era will cover similar trains if not that particular one.in 1955 it is quite possible that LMS design vehicles were still in use on the service. Possibly even pre-grouping ones.
The train could probably cope but the station platform might have been pretty much rammed! Not forgetting that some stations were served by trains longer than the platforms. nSo really, you are all telling me a station that could accommodate 5 carriages could have easily coped with an extra 200 passengers on top of the usual 100?
The train could probably cope but the station platform might have been pretty much rammed! Not forgetting that some stations were served by trains longer than the platforms. n
Almost certainly, and non corridor.in 1955 it is quite possible that LMS design vehicles were still in use on the service. Possibly even pre-grouping ones.
1st class had 7bays asp seated 42, 2nd class TSO seated 64, SO 42 , SK ( 4 aside) 64 , 3 aside 48. Then as others have said there were many other variationsPretty much what CW2 has said in post 2. There were a good number of different permutations of Mk1 carriages so the number of seats per coach could vary, but 64 would be about the maximum number.
Minor point - the company name was 'Mullard' and it was primarily an electronics component manufacturing company (and a subsidiary of Philips since 1929). Simonstone specialised in TV display tube (CRT) manufacture, eventually closing when the TV market moved to LCD displays in the early 2000's.In 1955 Mullards (a large electrical company) opened a factory in Simonstone (Lancashire).
I remember Dad buying Mullard valves for his steam radio. As a kid, loved looking in the back at the red glow.Minor point - the company name was 'Mullard' and it was primarily an electronics component manufacturing company (and a subsidiary of Philips since 1929). Simonstone specialised in TV display tube (CRT) manufacture, eventually closing when the TV market moved to LCD displays in the early 2000's.
It's accepted local wisdom that BR didn't want the business as it would have affected closure plans. The line was being deliberately run downThanks everyone!
And I guess you could squeeze a few more standing?
My reason for asking is this:
In 1955 Mullards (a large electrical company) opened a factory in Simonstone (Lancashire). They asked BR if the 6:32 from Blackburn could be run 10 minutes earlier so a possible 400 staff could get to work on time.
Working on the assumption that say half would have used the train to get there I am guessing around 200 people would need to be moved.
BR said that it was impossible, but I know the station there could have easily accommodated 5 carriages.
BR by the way, withdrew the stop at the station the day the factory opened!
I don’t think the Diagram books on the Barrowmore Site include pre-BR stock.There’s a load of BR rolling stock drawing books on this modelling group website:
As an aside, by the 1970s and possibly earlier, the TSOs had a table missing from a bay at each end (to accomodate wheelchairs perhaps?). When used as dining saloons the capacity wás thus reduced from 64 to 56. The consist for a full dining special on race days etc of 11 carriages comprised two TSOs each side of an RK kitchen van and this was duplicated, plus a BG for the guard. So 448 diners in total - and the trains known in the trade as 448s in consequence.1st class had 7bays asp seated 42, 2nd class TSO seated 64, SO 42 , SK ( 4 aside) 64 , 3 aside 48. Then as others have said there were many other variations
Yes, originally one N.S. in First and Third (later Second) - the two innermost adjoining compartments in each class.) Were all Smoking / Non-Smoking permutation provided? i.e. was one of the 1st compartments Smoking, the other labelled Non-Smoking, and similar in 2nd?
Identical, both 3.5 ft wide and mirror images of each other. The compartments themselves were 7ft 2in in First and 6ft 3in wide in Third (Second)2) Based on the bodyside profiles of BCKs I've seen in photos, were there two toilets provided in the one coach?
I assume there would be zero difference between the toilet facilities located at the First Class and Second Class ends of the coach - just a case of The Major not needing to mix with the riff-raff when he went to spend a penny.
Thanks for all the replies.From a bit of a trawl of the net it seems probable that when the factory at Simonstone was opened in 1955 some of the staff were transferred or promoted from the factory at Blackburn. One can understand British Railways’ lack of enthusiasm about a new traffic that might delay closure proposals, but could well tail off as people transferred back to Blackburn, moved to the area or bought cars.
Thanks for that.Just looking at some features of this service around 1955 gives good reasons why patronage had fallen away.
The new Mullard factory was built on a large out-of-town site, not far from the station, which had also in Victorian ways been built nowhere near the settlement of Simonstone itself, being in open country.
The road to the station had (and still has in parts) no pavements, so for those without cars from Simonstone village would be pretty useless - and of course for those with cars, now likewise. The no pavements sections include the walk from the station to the factory entrance.
The factory entrance is built on the south side of the big site, opposite side to, and a considerable walk from, the station. It's obviously been built to face the main Blackburn to Burnley road.
The main road has a bus service every 20 minutes or so from Blackburn and from Burnley, stopping on the main road at the factory gate. It would also stop all the way out from Blackburn where more convenient to passengers' houses, instead of just the central station. I read an account of just this route a while back from someone who long ago went to school on it. Apparently in the morning as many vehicles as required were provided, so although timetabled still every 20 minutes, 3 or 4 vehicles might be operating a peak time run. That's the sort of flexibility rail operators seemed unable to provide.
Morning trains from Blackburn stop at Simonstone at 0551, 0802, and then 1228. The bus is every 20 minutes. The train under discussion, the 0632 from Blackburn, is actually nonstop at Simonstone.
Road from station to factory today. Even now, no pavement : Simonstone Ln - Google Maps
Train timetable 1955 :
Bus timetable 1965, including specific "Mullard factory" stop
The stop is certainly shown in 1947.Thanks for that.
The revised timetable you have posted is the one after they removed the stop at Simonstone.
1. It's the only one on the timetable that does not stop at Simonstone.
2. The L & Y society state it stopped there at this time until the day the factory opened.