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May 2021 Timetable Change

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jfollows

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The morning path between Manchester & Birmingham is taken by Avanti (and before them Virgin and before them British Rail) with the train continuing onward to London Euston. The via Crewe journey is to keep the XC timetable but avoiding conflict at Stoke. (Obviously, both trains have a few minutes difference to the clock face.) I can't see there being many Manchester-Wilmslow commuters in the morning.
I've been surprised by the number of people who get off trains from Manchester at Wilmslow in the mornings, there are quite a few commuters to Wilmslow.
However I don't understand your post, I'm referring to the morning down XC Crewe-Wilmslow-Stockport-Manchester and the afternoon up XC Manchester-Stockport-Wilmslow-Crewe in my post whereas you seem to be referring to other times and services.
Or maybe I'm missing the point, sorry if so!
 
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Alfie1014

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That’s good. I’ve never known it any more than a 20min frequency.
I think the plan always was to replace a 20 minute service with 5 car 378s with a 15 minute service with 4 car 710s to free up the 5 cars for the ELL.
 

Deafdoggie

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I've been surprised by the number of people who get off trains from Manchester at Wilmslow in the mornings, there are quite a few commuters to Wilmslow.
However I don't understand your post, I'm referring to the morning down XC Crewe-Wilmslow-Stockport-Manchester and the afternoon up XC Manchester-Stockport-Wilmslow-Crewe in my post whereas you seem to be referring to other times and services.
Or maybe I'm missing the point, sorry if so!
Oops! My error, wrong service
 

DDB

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Banners have appeared in Nottingham station advertising the May timetable change but the new timetables aren't on the website yet.

View attachment 94401
(Image shows EMR branded banner with headline "Make a note our new timetable is live from 16 may")
These posters were put up too early in Nottingham as the webpage they advertised wasn't ready and so were taken down again. However the webpage has now been up for a while and it is less than a week to go and the posters still haven't been put back up.

Quite a waste of money if they don't reappear soon!
 

JRT

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I've noticed the 3 trains per day between Huddersfield and Castleford are temporarily removed from the timetable, which I think is likely to be connected to the 195 issues to free the unit up for something else. Northern don't seem interested in this route at all though, and is one I suspect won't return to it pre-Covid timetable
UPDATE

The 3 trips on the Huddersfield – Castleford route are to be run by rail replacement bus from 17 May ufn.
 

87015

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I think the plan always was to replace a 20 minute service with 5 car 378s with a 15 minute service with 4 car 710s to free up the 5 cars for the ELL.
The DC has been 4tph for two years already, the 378s displaced were for 10tph NLL peaks.
 

cle

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The DC has been 4tph for two years already, the 378s displaced were for 10tph NLL peaks.
I've not been in that part of the world in a while. Pandemic-aside, has the uplift to 4tph been successful? More ridership?
 

Class 170101

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Also odd is that the 06:48 ex-Norwich gains a Colchester call but no longer stops at Manningtree!! It has always been fast from there to Liverpool St. Also the return of the 05:30 leaves London at 08:00 whereas it’s been 07:55 for many years (SX). Still confusing as to why neither appear in printed timetables.

Manningtree has a better spraed of services and doesn't need the call during covid. However by stopping the 06:48 at Colchester removes a 20+ minute gap that would otherwise exist for a busier station.

Or perhaps Sheffield - Lincoln could transfer to EMR, as it's virtually all outside Northern's area and there are no late trains to Lincoln as the stock has to return to Sheffield.
But if it was handed over to EMR you would have the opposite problem of no late trains to Sheffield as EMR has no train crew depot at Sheffield as far as I am aware but late trains to Lincoln instead. A weakness of privatisation where the train crew / train depot is at one end of the route for any given operator.
 

Llandudno

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Manningtree has a better spraed of services and doesn't need the call during covid. However by stopping the 06:48 at Colchester removes a 20+ minute gap that would otherwise exist for a busier station.


But if it was handed over to EMR you would have the opposite problem of no late trains to Sheffield as EMR has no train crew depot at Sheffield as far as I am aware but late trains to Lincoln instead. A weakness of privatisation where the train crew / train depot is at one end of the route for any given operator.
If EMR operated the service any positional journeys to/from Nottingham depot could run directly from Sheffield via the Midland Mainline taking approx 45 minutes?
 

Class 170101

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If EMR operated the service any positional journeys to/from Nottingham depot could run directly from Sheffield via the Midland Mainline taking approx 45 minutes?
Depending how late on the other routes. Engineering Access also impacts why Northern can run later services to Sheffield but finish earlier towards Lincoln. If the railway wasn't privatised you could suggest that Lincoln depot (run by EMR) should run a later service from Sheffield to Lincoln but in the other direction covered by Sheffield Depot (Northern) from Lincoln to Sheffield.
 

swt_passenger

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I've not been in that part of the world in a while. Pandemic-aside, has the uplift to 4tph been successful? More ridership?
I don’t think they were expecting much more ridership, just 4 tph better fits their usual definition of a normal service. In terms of carriages, as implied earlier it’s now 16 per hour rather than 15, I think if they were expecting significant extra demand they’d have carried on with 5 car trains…
 

Mugby

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A couple of things I spotted whilst having a quick flick through the published timetables;

Cross Country saying they will be operating fewer, longer trains "for the foreseeable future" No holiday trains to West Country resorts this year.
So much for the Government encouraging 'Staycation' holidays then!

EMR still offering a very poor service from London on Sundays, no more York or Scarboroughs.
Crewe services now extended through to Nottingham and Newark with, in many cases, a one minute turnaround in Derby - is this realistic?
 

sufian123

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A couple of things I spotted whilst having a quick flick through the published timetables;

Cross Country saying they will be operating fewer, longer trains "for the foreseeable future" No holiday trains to West Country resorts this year.
So much for the Government encouraging 'Staycation' holidays then!

EMR still offering a very poor service from London on Sundays, no more York or Scarboroughs.
Crewe services now extended through to Nottingham and Newark with, in many cases, a one minute turnaround in Derby - is this realistic?

emr York services suspended till further notice
 

Starmill

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EMR still offering a very poor service from London on Sundays, no more York or Scarboroughs.
In what way is one service to Scarborough no longer running "poor", for Sunday, offset against the significantly better journey times and extended day? Also it has been pointed out that the York service is not necessarily gone forever.

a one minute turnaround in Derby - is this realistic?
Where are you seeing this?
 

JonathanH

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Crewe services now extended through to Nottingham and Newark with, in many cases, a one minute turnaround in Derby - is this realistic?

Where are you seeing this?

The 1821 reversal at Derby shows both arrival and departure at that time. However, the data feed to RTT says 1819 / 1821 and the working timetable 1818½ / 1821½.
 

Ianno87

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Cross Country saying they will be operating fewer, longer trains "for the foreseeable future" No holiday trains to West Country resorts this year.
So much for the Government encouraging 'Staycation' holidays then!

What's wrong with changing at Plymouth? Which you have to do on all bar about 3 trains per day normally anyway.

(Waiting for the "but what about my granny with heavy luggage?" reaction)
 

Jamesrob637

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What's wrong with changing at Plymouth? Which you have to do on all bar about 3 trains per day normally anyway.

(Waiting for the "but what about my granny with heavy luggage?" reaction)

I've looked at Plymouth on Real Time Trains next Monday and there are atill gaps in the hourly service. Maybe that's what the poster was referring to.
 

irish_rail

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What's wrong with changing at Plymouth? Which you have to do on all bar about 3 trains per day normally anyway.

(Waiting for the "but what about my granny with heavy luggage?" reaction)
Plymouth really isnt a great place to change at the moment.
Building work beginning to take over the station, not to mention the fact there hasn't been anywhere to buy a cup of tea or coffee for over a year now. Added to the fact the station platforms are amongst the draftiest in the UK and waiting room capacity is minimal, id say a few through trains would have been better but hey ho.
 

Goldfish62

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What's wrong with changing at Plymouth? Which you have to do on all bar about 3 trains per day normally anyway.
I assume you meant 30, not 3, because that's more like the actual number. You didn't really think there are only three through trains a day, did you?
 

Ianno87

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I assume you meant 30, not 3, because that's more like the actual number. You didn't really think there are only three through trains a day, did you?

We're talking specifically about CrossCountry through trains, of which there have never been many (basically start and end of service, plus the Newquay service).
 

Starmill

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The 1821 reversal at Derby shows both arrival and departure at that time. However, the data feed to RTT says 1819 / 1821 and the working timetable 1818½ / 1821½.
I see, how interesting. As you point out, I suspect that the reality is that the working timetable offers the necessary provision so there should be no need to worry.
 

43055

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A couple of things I spotted whilst having a quick flick through the published timetables;

EMR still offering a very poor service from London on Sundays, no more York or Scarboroughs.
How is the Sunday timetable very poor? I'm sure the morning service is restricted by the two track railway south of Bedford so have to run in-between the GTR services until lunchtime which by mid afternoon the service level is the same as a weekday. As for Scarborough it has been dropped for a second York working but they have temporarily been dropped in this timetable. Hopefully they will run from December.
Crewe services now extended through to Nottingham and Newark with, in many cases, a one minute turnaround in Derby - is this realistic?


The 1821 reversal at Derby shows both arrival and departure at that time. However, the data feed to RTT says 1819 / 1821 and the working timetable 1818½ / 1821½.
One minute won't be realistic but three I think is possible but tight. RTT has most arrivals from Crewe at xx19 but the EMR timetable has them at xx21. It has always been the case that a few extra mins has been added for arriving in Derby from Crewe.

The latest Modern Railways magazine has an article on the new EMR timetable. One part states that the changes to the Matlock services will help speed up the Cross Country Newcastle services.
 

Mike99

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Plymouth really isnt a great place to change at the moment.
Building work beginning to take over the station, not to mention the fact there hasn't been anywhere to buy a cup of tea or coffee for over a year now. Added to the fact the station platforms are amongst the draftiest in the UK and waiting room capacity is minimal, id say a few through trains would have been better but hey ho.
I need to change at Plymouth later this month from a terminating Cross Country service onto a Penzance service with about 20 minutes so enough time to get from Platform 7 to 4 but I might change at Totnes (same platform) which would just be simpler!!
 

Jamesrob637

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XC on the Plymouth services still has gaps which is disappointing. Even if they don't reinstate through Penzance services, it would be good to see hourly to Plymouth (with a few doubles).
 

southern442

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I need to change at Plymouth later this month from a terminating Cross Country service onto a Penzance service with about 20 minutes so enough time to get from Platform 7 to 4 but I might change at Totnes (same platform) which would just be simpler!!
Thinking about it, in some situations it might be wiser for them to advertise changing at Totnes or somewhere similar rather than Plymouth for this reason.
 

berneyarms

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I see, how interesting. As you point out, I suspect that the reality is that the working timetable offers the necessary provision so there should be no need to worry.
The working timetable is what matters here.

All of the Crewe-Newark services have a minimum wait at Derby of four minutes except the 11:08 departure from Crewe which has a 3.5 minute wait and the 16:08 which has a 3 minute wait.

In the opposite direction 4 minutes is the minimum time at Derby.
 
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