My day out on HS1 - and ticket checks

[jon0844]

With the other threads about the effectiveness of gatelines and onboard checks, me and the wife went Hatfield to Canterbury today and here's what happened.

Hatfield to King's Cross; I arrive at King's Cross and, having two tickets (Season plus my new ticket which was cheaper to buy from Hatfield than London) got out from platform 11 with my Oyster. Wife uses her ticket (with Gold Card discount) which opens the gate but says 'Seek Assistance'. She didn't bother!

Over to St Pancras and up to platform 13 for the train. Both tickets work the gates fine.

Then walk along one carriage and I get on the train.. only to then have staff shouting up that it wasn't the right train, so the wife tells me to get off. I'd boarded the rear set, but it wasn't locked out of use! First time I've ever seen that - surely it's standard practice to lock the doors of a train that isn't joined to the one in front??

Anyway, on the right train and on we go. Ticket is checked on board and all is fine. A nice smooth journey and out at Canterbury West where gates are open.

On the way back, wife must have managed to erase the magstrip with her phone or something as her ticket didn't work the gates that were now in operation. I'd gone through and she went to seek assistance.. gateline staff said 'no problem' and opened the gate manually. Now, given the fact that TOCs get funny about people using discounted tickets without a railcard - I thought it was odd that he didn't ask to see the Gold Card.

On the train, another ticket check before Ashford International. All fine, but this time I hid the Gold Card and nothing was said!

Between Ebbsfleet and Stratford International, in the tunnel, I nearly felt sick as the train wobbled from side to side at a horrible rate for a few minutes. I thought they'd fixed the suspension problem? Clearly not on whatever train I was on (1625 from Canterbury West to STP)

Back at STP, my ticket worked fine - and wife got seek assistance (forgot to check error code) and, for the third time, was not asked to show the Gold Card. King's Cross gates were open (1730) and back at Hatfield she was let through again without asking. She either has a very trustworthy look, or the staff were all in a rather lazy mood!

I can therefore conclude that if you want to get a discounted ticket without any bother, don't get a YPRC ticket - get an Annual Gold Card ticket!

 

[WestCoast]

On the way back, wife must have managed to erase the magstrip with her phone or something as her ticket didn't work the gates that were now in operation. I'd gone through and she went to seek assistance.. gateline staff said 'no problem' and opened the gate manually. Now, given the fact that TOCs get funny about people using discounted tickets without a railcard - I thought it was odd that he didn't ask to see the Gold Card.

I always order my tickets from London Midland and they print them on what seems like a different type of stock to the usual kind - the mag strip never seems to work. NEVER been asked for my railcard at a gateline.

On the train, another ticket check before Ashford International. All fine, but this time I hid the Gold Card and nothing was said!

Depends on the guard/RPI but generally they ask to present railcards. I am not a commuter in the South East so I don't know what the situation is with Gold Card inspections.

 

[junglejames]

Railcards frequently are not asked for. Its the minority of times that im asked for the railcard. Either back in the young persons days, or now with the Network Railcard.
Usually the place to get asked was with EC or its predecessors. But even some of their guards dont ask.

 

[WestCoast]

Railcards frequently are not asked for. Its the minority of times that im asked for the railcard.

That's not really my experience, If I forget to present then the guard will ask me. Although it depends on what TOC your on, intercity-type (Virgin, XC, East Coast e.t.c) is a certainty in my experience.

 

[junglejames]

That's not really my experience, If I forget to present then the guard will ask me. Although it depends on what TOC your on, intercity-type (Virgin, XC, East Coast e.t.c) is a certainty in my experience.

You must find the strict guards!! Unless they have become stricter since I failed to qualify for my young persons.

 

[lm321412]

NEVER been asked for my railcard at a gateline.

If Virgin have barrier staff checking tickets, pre-departure at London Euston. They will often ask to see your railcard.

In my experience, anyway.

 

[WestCoast]

You must find the strict guards!! Unless they have become stricter since I failed to qualify for my young persons.

I think it's more to do with the fact that more often than not I've got my railcard in the wallet open. On the subject of strict and not-so-strict guards I saw two polar opposites today. One guard today looked at my ticket from an unreadable distance and moved on, after an unstaffed station he literally ran down the train asking for tickets - people had to chase after him! On the other hand the other guard scrutinized every ticket and railcard carefully checking everyone had the right ticket. She told off some kids who had boarded with a solo card (fully expecting to be let off) and wasn't selling any off-peaks or giving railcard discounts from staffed stations - and people who asked why got put in their place.

If Virgin have barrier staff checking tickets, pre-departure at London Euston. They will often ask to see your railcard.

In my experience, anyway.

Was thinking about auto barriers if you have to go through the manual gate. For some reason I forgot about Euston, other on-station RPIs haven't asked to see railcard. Euston check everything: ticket, reservation, railcard..

 

[jon0844]

I have the Gold Card. My wife doesn't have one - she's with me.

I presented it with the tickets on the train going out, but didn't on the way back (it was in my hand, folded in the ticket wallet) and obviously would have done if asked.

 

[junglejames]

I think it's more to do with the fact that more often than not I've got my railcard in the wallet open. On the subject of strict and not-so-strict guards I saw two polar opposites today. One guard today looked at my ticket from an unreadable distance and moved on, after an unstaffed station he literally ran down the train asking for tickets - people had to chase after him! On the other hand the other guard scrutinized every ticket and railcard carefully checking everyone had the right ticket. She told off some kids who had boarded with a solo card (fully expecting to be let off) and wasn't selling any off-peaks or giving railcard discounts from staffed stations - and people who asked why got put in their place

Is it just me, or do others find female guards on the whole stricter than men? Or is it becuase there are fewer of them that it seems like this?
This thing about not selling tickets on trains though. Thats really one of my bugbears.
Your penalising last min travellers who find themselves running late.
You should be able to easily buy a ticket on the train if needed.
This is just one of the things that have moved the railways away from the public service/ convenience they once were. At times it really does seem like an airline on wheels, without the security checks.

Hold on, I hadnt thought about this when I said 'MOST' ticket barriers should be scrapped. Actually every single ticket barrier should be scrapped.

 

[WestCoast]

Is it just me, or do others find female guards on the whole stricter than men?

Strangely enough, yes, absolutely no idea why!

This thing about not selling tickets on trains though. Thats really one of my bugbears.
Your penalising last min travellers who find themselves running late.
You should be able to easily buy a ticket on the train if needed.
This is just one of the things that have moved the railways away from the public service/ convenience they once were.

Fine, but where do you draw the line? If you say you can buy onboard at the same price I bet many people would stop using the ticket offices - which would close. The guard wouldn't be able to get down the train between stops and check tickets - people would think "Oh he/she might not get to me" I'll take the chance.

On my regular commutes there are no penalty fares and on one route only anytime singles/return fares are sold - so quite a few people I know will just walk past the ticket office, get on and chance it, more often than not they don't pay. If you get rid of compulsory ticket buying (strictness depends on the TOC) then the railways will lose a great deal of revenue, as the guards last priority is revenue.

 

[Daniel]

Hatfield to King's Cross; I arrive at King's Cross and, having two tickets (Season plus my new ticket which was cheaper to buy from Hatfield than London) got out from platform 11 with my Oyster. Wife uses her ticket (with Gold Card discount) which opens the gate but says 'Seek Assistance'. She didn't bother!

To add another element of pointlessness to the already useless gates at Kings Cross, they are set to accept all tickets. Tested them recently with some forum members, my LUL staff pass was rejected with a code 57 (period ticket not valid at this station), but with a green light and the gate opened.

On the way back, wife must have managed to erase the magstrip with her phone or something as her ticket didn't work the gates that were now in operation. I'd gone through and she went to seek assistance.. gateline staff said 'no problem' and opened the gate manually. Now, given the fact that TOCs get funny about people using discounted tickets without a railcard - I thought it was odd that he didn't ask to see the Gold Card.

I rarely ask for railcards on the gateline, (although I am on LU), as with the amount of people coming through there generally isn't the time. At point of sale it's a different story.

On the train, another ticket check before Ashford International. All fine, but this time I hid the Gold Card and nothing was said!

Obviously something should have been requested there.

 

[bus man]

Strange in the North it is normal tht they ask for rail cards indeed , announcements usualy say all tickets and rail cards please.

 

[jon0844]

Is it just me, or do others find female guards on the whole stricter than men? Or is it becuase there are fewer of them that it seems like this?

In my experience of male and female police officers, I have always found - myself - that the women are stricter and seem to have something to prove.

Now that's me, and so I agree. It doesn't necessarily represent all females in positions of power in ANY way, but it does reflect my personal experiences.

I have no idea why. Maybe they're used to men trying it on with them (and so they become conditioned to treat all men with contempt) so they take no prisoners. I wonder how they deal with other women, especially those who try and act vulnerable or start crying when 'caught' doing something wrong (police and guards alike).

To add another element of pointlessness to the already useless gates at Kings Cross, they are set to accept all tickets. Tested them recently with some forum members, my LUL staff pass was rejected with a code 57 (period ticket not valid at this station), but with a green light and the gate opened.

I wonder if that's why my wife managed to open the gate with her 'seek assistance' ticket by platform 11? I figured the 'any ticket will do' policy was only for 0-5, but maybe it has the same software running (Cubic were working on it at the start of the year) for the suburban platforms too. Would be rather stupid if it was the case.

 

[j0hn0]

Nice disclaimer Jon

I personally have found no difference between gender of train guards. I

Female conductors in holland are lovely, the men over there are well harsh

 

[WestCoast]

Female conductors in holland are lovely, the men over there are well harsh

Many times when I have got checked in Holland there is two people?

On one German ICE train heading towards Berlin I remember these two female conductors who went around together like some form of duo, they didn't miss a trick!

 

[DavidBusDriver]

No pun intended I guess Jon - female police officers tend to 'take no prisoners', by the sounds of things maybe they take too many lol!!!

 

[Southern]

SET staff, especially the inspectors, always seem to me to be either lazy or rude. I was using an old ticket as a bookmark recently, left it sitting face down on the table. The guard comes along, glances down at it and just moves on. It wasn't the first time, either.

 

[notadriver]

The East Coast service I boarded a while back had a young attractive female guard and she had a sexy Geordie accent. She can stamp my ticket any time!

 

[Mike395]

SET staff, especially the inspectors, always seem to me to be either lazy or rude. I was using an old ticket as a bookmark recently, left it sitting face down on the table. The guard comes along, glances down at it and just moves on. It wasn't the first time, either.

I agree with regards to the 'classic' lines - although I find the high speed guards much more polite in the main, in fact I'd say the HS train managers are some of the best Ive encountered

 

[jon0844]

The staff were all friendly enough.. but maybe a little too trusting!

 

[junglejames]

Strangely enough, yes, absolutely no idea why!



Fine, but where do you draw the line? If you say you can buy onboard at the same price I bet many people would stop using the ticket offices - which would close. The guard wouldn't be able to get down the train between stops and check tickets - people would think "Oh he/she might not get to me" I'll take the chance.

On my regular commutes there are no penalty fares and on one route only anytime singles/return fares are sold - so quite a few people I know will just walk past the ticket office, get on and chance it, more often than not they don't pay. If you get rid of compulsory ticket buying (strictness depends on the TOC) then the railways will lose a great deal of revenue, as the guards last priority is revenue.

Not quite im afraid. BR managed it with no problem. Still most people brought tickets before they boarded. It didnt leave ticket offices empty. It was the minority buying tickets onboard. Guards came down and issued tickets. No problem. In actual fact, it gives the guards an incentive to come through the train, so he is more likely to catch fare dodgers.
Obviously a guard is there for safety, but they are also there for revenue protection. They always have been. Guards issue tickets now anyway. Its just in certain areas its more unlikely they will have to. I think it would be good to give them an incentive to walk through the train. If guards can come through checking and issuing tickets after every stop on some routes, then there is no reason why they cant issue tickets to what will be a minority of people, on other routes.

This makes life a lot easier for passengers, esp if running late. They know they are not going to get a guard having a go at them (yes it happens) and breaking their bank.

Oh, and I am not getting rid of compulsory ticket buying. That means railways get zero income. Choice of words may be slightly out there are they?!!

This may increase fare dodging ever so slightly on some routes, but if will be by very little. Anyway, its nearly always on short journeys that cost very little, where people get away with it. Not sure of many getting away with London to Edinburgh before.

I realise this may cause a lot of people to turn their nose up, and have a go, saying im all wrong etc etc. But this is just my view. I liked the days when the railways were there for the passenger. This is getting less and less. Everytime i hear a guard sounding threatening down the tannoy about restrictions and only selling £100+ tickets for a 5 mile journey (ok a slight exageration), it makes me worry. This isnt what railways were for.
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The East Coast service I boarded a while back had a young attractive female guard and she had a sexy Geordie accent. She can stamp my ticket any time!

East Coast have some lovely female crew all over the place!!