frodshamfella
Established Member
As.mentioned the most logical thing is for the Merseyrail service to end and terminate at Helsby.
There are some very key, local differences between the 1980s and today though.
In employment pull terms, both the office area around Liverpool John Lennon and the employment scenes in Warrington and Manchester are far more likely to attract commuters.
Additionally, the services to connect to at Helsby are now much improved and more frequent.
Along with the benefits to Ellesmere Port and other south Wirral locations, the level of connections are such that a half hourly Merseyrail service may even trigger commercial interest in Ellesmere Port itself. The level of services would be such that I expect a parkway development off the M56 at Helsby would be very popular, if it was physically feasible to build it.
A link in the 80s would have been serving only the residual remaining market, whereas a link today will be building economic value in a number of ways.
I think the plan was to fit batteries on the new Merseyrail trains and extend the Ellesmere Port services to start at Helsby but I believe they haven’t managed to engineer that solution unfortunately.The problem with Ellesmere Port - Helsby is as much down to its length as lack of demand.
I'm sure an hourly shuttle with a cheap & cheerful Vivarail-type unit would be ideal in theory and adequately serve currently suppressed demand. However, it takes less than 15 minutes to traverse the line, meaning the single unit and crew would spend most of the working hour sitting at one of the termini. It wouldn't justify the operational costs. You could double the frequency but there's no way demand would justify 2tph and there would still be pretty long layovers each end.
An Ellesmere Port - Lime Street service could probably work, now that the Halton Curve is fully operational, for an hourly service run with two units. Not sure the demand is there for that though.
The problem with Ellesmere Port - Helsby is as much down to its length as lack of demand.
I'm sure an hourly shuttle with a cheap & cheerful Vivarail-type unit would be ideal in theory and adequately serve currently suppressed demand. However, it takes less than 15 minutes to traverse the line, meaning the single unit and crew would spend most of the working hour sitting at one of the termini. It wouldn't justify the operational costs. You could double the frequency but there's no way demand would justify 2tph and there would still be pretty long layovers each end.
An Ellesmere Port - Lime Street service could probably work, now that the Halton Curve is fully operational, for an hourly service run with two units. Not sure the demand is there for that though.
One unit providing an every 40 minutes / 3tp2h service would surely work?
The problem with Ellesmere Port - Helsby is as much down to its length as lack of demand.
An Ellesmere Port - Lime Street service could probably work, now that the Halton Curve is fully operational, for an hourly service run with two units. Not sure the demand is there for that though.
One unit providing an every 40 minutes / 3tp2h service would surely work?
If the morning train's cancelled, you can ask what to do in the ticket office in Ellesmere Port. There are other buses and trains around, even if they can't arrange a taxi to Warrington at that time of the morning.I’ve never heard them mention one whenever it’s been cancelled. Just expect you to get a TfW or Chester Northern and then walk from Helsby I guess.
It's a nice idea, but it could be a lot of money for not that much benefit. While the poor service drives down patronage, the fact that there's only an hourly bus between Ellesmere Port and Helsby suggests that there may not be a huge amount of suppressed demand for a more frequent rail service to tap into.It would be much better for Ellesmere Port to get that Merseyrail extension to Helsby.
Free bus between the two?I don't know where the funding or units are coming from for this idea.
Never mind the influx of passengers. The best thing that could be done is somehow Ellesmere port to get a link to Cheshire oaks.
Otherwise I don't think the numbers are there to make this even close to viable.
The best thing that could be done is somehow Ellesmere port to get a link to Cheshire oaks.
I've always puzzled why the Calder Valley stoppers extend beyond Man vic rather than the express.
As for non stop Bradford to Hebden Bridge the catchment area of Sowerby bridge exceeds both Hebden Bridge and Todmordon combined but from December has significant service cuts.
K
An hourly all-stations Ellesmere Port to Liverpool Lime Street via Warrington Bank Quay service could be provided by 3x769, with a very comfortable quarter-hour turnaround at each end. This compares with the present hourly (most of the day) Warrington Bank Quay to
Liverpool Lime Street service operated by 2x319/323. Whatever service is proposed for Ellesmere Port - Helsby, whether it's a standalone or an extension of some other service, it's always going to need at least one additional unit.
The above would, I think, be far more satisfactory than, say, a half-hourly Ellesmere Port to Helsby shuttle. I mean, look at the links which would be created, not least to/from Warrington Bank Quay, from where you can get trains to half the country.
Yes it did, once the Earlestown curve reopened (can't find a date quickly) - that's how the the unit for the E P shuttle was provided once the third rail was extended.I vaguely remember a Liverpool Lime St-Ellesmere Port (or Hooton) service running in the early 90s before privatisation via Warrington BQ and Earlestown.
I vaguely remember a Liverpool Lime St-Ellesmere Port (or Hooton) service running in the early 90s before privatisation via Warrington BQ and Earlestown.
That was now 25 years ago... I hope this message doesn't cause any age-realisation anxiety!!!The line from Hooton to Ellesmere Port was electrified as recently as 1994,
I vaguely remember a Liverpool Lime St-Ellesmere Port (or Hooton) service running in the early 90s before privatisation via Warrington BQ and Earlestown.
It’s cancelled so often I’m surprised anyone uses it west of Helsby. How could you make it your commute when it may be cancelled, you have to wait the best part of an hour for the next train to Helsby (since there’s no time to get to Piccadilly for the 17:15) then find some way to get to Ellesmere Port from there? I’m not even sure if via Liverpool Lime Street is a permitted route from Ellesmere Port but that would take ages anyway.Yes I have an idea there was such a service. However to my mind the best thing for this section of the line is for Merseyrail to have it, terminating at Helsby, thereby allowing onward connections. I noticed yesterday evenings Northern service to Ellesmere Port was cancelled saying due to lake of crews.
Ooh, that'll be much nicer than my last trip on this route: a triple 153.Class 195s taking over from Monday.