New Virgin Trains route map

[thenorthern]

I haven't seen a thread on this yet but has anyone seen the new Virgin Trains route map that combines both the West Coast Main Line and the East Coast Main Line?

Like all other Virgin Trains maps its wildly not to scale but its good that they incorporate both the WCML and ECML into a single map. I still don't understand why the two franchises are only partially merged into a single brand and why the West Coast services are still known as Virgin Trains and not Virgin Trains West Coast.

I have only seen it on the train and by the looks of it its not available online so I don't have a copy to show i'm afraid.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

It's been doing the rounds for ages: the vestibules on some Pendolinos have had them for months. I note that Wellington and Telford Central are the wrong way around on the older version, with the newer version on the back of the new fares leaflet displaying them correctly.

 

[All Line Rover]

Yes, been around for months. Never thought of commenting on it because the Virgin Trains branding situation is a bit of a mess.

 

[higthomas]

I saw it on Friday. The main thing I was wondering was why they haven't really differentiated between service groups on the East Coast route. Only Leeds and Scotland routes. I would have thought a route for the Newark/York? stoppers, and maybe one for the slower trains to Edinburgh/Newcastle.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

The new TV advert is "route neutral", though I think the only bit with a train (with the fish dozing!) is on a Pendolino.
There's then a list of destinations which includes Newcastle and Liverpool.
I expect they are leaving the WC branding until the next franchise is decided.
It could be that the DfT prevented any rebranding in the interim franchise deals.

 

[dk1]

The new TV advert is "route neutral", though I think the only bit with a train (with the fish dozing!) is on a Pendolino.
There's then a list of destinations which includes Newcastle and Liverpool.
I expect they are leaving the WC branding until the next franchise is decided.
It could be that the DfT prevented any rebranding in the interim franchise deals.

This will be interesting. Abellio Greater Anglia is to be known as simply Greater Anglia again as that name was preferred by Joe Public & we have been informed that DfT didn't want the company name involved. That would be tricky for Virgin who very much use the brand.

 

[thenorthern]

With Virgin Cross Country to the passenger it was as if the company was in effect the same as Virgin Trains West Coast although legally I am aware they aren't. I wondered if Virgin Trains East Coast would do the same but it didn't.

Both VTWC and VTXC used the single VT TOC code but VTEC currently uses GR which derives from GNER.

Did Virgin Trains announce the two were to merge a bit ago or am I thinking of something else? I suppose the ownership status of the two companies would be a barrier to this.

Just looking at the old route maps from Virgin Trains and the good old ones before Operation Princess where many great things happened as it appeared there were 4 VTXC services per hour at Liverpool Lime Street, trains from Stoke-on-Trent went further north than Manchester and some even went to Aberdeen via the WCML, many trains went to Cardiff Central and everyone's favorite there were CrossCountry trains to Brighton.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

With Virgin Cross Country to the passenger it was as if the company was in effect the same as Virgin Trains West Coast although legally I am aware they aren't. I wondered if Virgin Trains East Coast would do the same but it didn't.
Both VTWC and VTXC used the single VT TOC code but VTEC currently uses GR which derives from GNER.

The DfT doesn't like blurring the boundaries between franchises, in the way VT did with WC and XC in the early days. It distorts the DfT's "brand value" for the two franchises.
Things changed when Chiltern was caught cross subsidising WSMR and were told to keep the books strictly separate.
These days there have to be formal commercial relations between franchises, whatever the ownership.

I think the best they can do is share the marketing and customer service budgets (web sites, call centres etc).
The franchise contracts are also very different, with VT only having 2 years left and being of an interim nature, compared to the long VTEC contract.

 

[sjoh]

Is there an online version of it? Had a quick google but no joy...

 

[IanXC]

Here's a picture of said map I took earlier

 

[IanXC]

I saw it on Friday. The main thing I was wondering was why they haven't really differentiated between service groups on the East Coast route. Only Leeds and Scotland routes. I would have thought a route for the Newark/York? stoppers, and maybe one for the slower trains to Edinburgh/Newcastle.

I've wondered that too. I saw an older version which did have a similar number of 'routes' on the East Coast as the West Coast. From memory there were 2 Scottish routes, northern of the central belt/non stop south of York, and the rest.

 

[thenorthern]

Lockerbie is missing off the map.

 

[All Line Rover]

As is Northampton.

 

[najaB]

Lockerbie is missing off the map.

Is it because the provide such limited service?

 

[dk1]

Trivial really but I wonder why they chose to overlap the Shrewsbury service (brown) with the West Mids/Scotland (blue) after Wolverhampton when no need.

Really wish they would somehow combine the confusing Twitter feed. As railway minded folk we all find it simple but most passengers do not with the Virgin Trains brand as is obvious with the constant throwing of Tweets between East & West operations. Each operator must stand alone I know but its all a bit messy at the moment.

 

[Starmill]

I saw it on Friday. The main thing I was wondering was why they haven't really differentiated between service groups on the East Coast route. Only Leeds and Scotland routes. I would have thought a route for the Newark/York? stoppers, and maybe one for the slower trains to Edinburgh/Newcastle.

That's what the 'Virgin Trains East Coast' route map showed...

 

[thenorthern]

Is it because the provide such limited service?

It has more trains than Telford Central and Blackpool North but they are both on the map.

 

[najaB]

It has more trains than Telford Central and Blackpool North but they are both on the map.

Don't know about Telford, but they have committed to increasing service to Blackpool have they not?

 

[Starmill]

Don't know about Telford, but they have committed to increasing service to Blackpool have they not?

I don't think this is related. What has happened is, I think, all of the parts of the Virgin Trains map have been kept, and a simplified East Coast map has been added to it to create something new. The Virgin Trains East Coast route map had 4 different service groups rather than just two. The results are very poor, the trains to and from Hull, for example, cannot possibly be part of the Edinburgh service pattern. The standard pattern has no stations in common but Kings Cross.

 

[JaJaWa]

This will be interesting. Abellio Greater Anglia is to be known as simply Greater Anglia again as that name was preferred by Joe Public & we have been informed that DfT didn't want the company name involved. That would be tricky for Virgin who very much use the brand.

Abellio Greater Anglia are rebranding to Abellio East Anglia actually. The new logo is visible on their renderings of new trains.

 

[dk1]

Abellio Greater Anglia are rebranding to Abellio East Anglia actually. The new logo is visible on their renderings of new trains.

Not what we have been told. That may be the trading name but branding much to my dismay is Greater Anglia again!!

 

[ainsworth74]

I believe we have a discussion on the future branding of the Greater Anglia franchise on the relevant thread. So could we avoid repeating it here?

 

[Tetchytyke]

The new TV advert is "route neutral", though I think the only bit with a train (with the fish dozing!) is on a Pendolino.

The adverts are now, but they were originally done as VTEC adverts. The only difference is they've spliced a shot or two of a Pendolino into the rest of the advert which was on a MkIV.

Unless they've done a new new one which I've not seen yet, anyway.

The branding situation is a complete mess.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Lockerbie is missing off the map.

As is Northampton.

I'm presuming IanXC's photo is from a VTEC service - the ones on VTWC do definitely display the two aforementioned stations. I know they will use different versions as the contact details will change, but I would have at least thought they'd keep a consecutive map (for the West Coast side anyway).

 

[BurtonM]

I've seen it on VTEC, and I thought it was a bit redundant considering that most of the map is dedicated to VTWC. It sort of makes sense - but I don't get why the trains don't only have maps of the lines they serve on them like on the Tube.

After all, Northern aren't putting maps of ATW on Heaton Pacers, and TPE aren't putting maps of Cornwall on 350s and 185s...

 

[IanXC]

I'm presuming IanXC's photo is from a VTEC service - the ones on VTWC do definitely display the two aforementioned stations. I know they will use different versions as the contact details will change, but I would have at least thought they'd keep a consecutive map (for the West Coast side anyway).

It is indeed on a VTEC set.

 

[thenorthern]

Had a look at the Virgin Trains West Coast timetable map today and it seems very incorrect as it marks the London-Birmingham-Scotland trains as not calling at Sandwell and Dudley + Wolverhampton when they do also that the London - Birmingham/Shrewsbury trains regularly stopping at Milton Keynes Central when they don't.

Also the map on the Virgin Trains WIFI is even more out of date as its the map from before the Blackpool and Shrewsbury trains were introduced. Maybe Virgin Trains should update things.

 

[MonsooN]

I see Sunderland on there. Are Virgin East Coast going there yet? I don't recall seeing a VTEC train on the Durham Coast line?

 

[Bungle965]

I see Sunderland on there. Are Virgin East Coast going there yet? I don't recall seeing a VTEC train on the Durham Coast line?

Yes one service to London and one service from London.
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/sea...-2359?stp=WVS&show=passenger&order=wtt&toc=GR
Sam

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I see Sunderland on there. Are Virgin East Coast going there yet? I don't recall seeing a VTEC train on the Durham Coast line?

They run as extensions from Newcastle, not via the Coast.