Newton Abbot - Sheffield

[bryheruk]

I travel regularly from Newton Abbot to Sheffield and back. I need to be here on Monday morning. Whilst the first train gets me here by 10.15 (which is OK) it is very expensive. I used to travel on last train Sunday evening staying overnight in Bristol/Birmingham. In first class this used to be valid and cost £227.60 (FIRST CLASS OFF-PEAK RETURN). These days these fares do not appear to be available on any web site. Can anyone enlighten me with what the rules are on breaking a journey with an overnight stay on either outward/return leg? and whether these rules have changed recently?. Thanks

 

[John @ home]

I travel regularly from Newton Abbot to Sheffield and back. I need to be here on Monday morning. Whilst the first train gets me here by 10.15 (which is OK) it is very expensive. I used to travel on last train Sunday evening staying overnight in Bristol/Birmingham. In first class this used to be valid and cost £227.60 (FIRST CLASS OFF-PEAK RETURN). These days these fares do not appear to be available on any web site. Can anyone enlighten me with what the rules are on breaking a journey with an overnight stay on either outward/return leg? and whether these rules have changed recently?. Thanks

From the NFM 02 disk:

From NEWTON ABBOT
To SHEFFIELD
Route NOT LONDON
FSR First Class Off Peak Return £227.60
Restriction 2V
Restriction applies to Outward and Return travel, Monday to Friday only. No travel restrictions on other days.

OUTWARD & RETURN JOURNEYS
By any train except those scheduled to depart before 0930.

Outward/Single/Return Travel: AVAILABLE ANY DAY

Ticket Code: FSR/SFR/BFR
Ticket Class: FIRST
Ticket Name: OFF-PEAK
Single/Return: RETURN
Out Validity:-
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
Return Validity:-
Day - ONE CALENDAR MONTH
Time - SEE BELOW
Break of Jrny: (OUT) YES
(RTN) YES (SEE NOTES BELOW)
Pre-Booking Requirement: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Child Discount: YES
Railcard Discount: YES
Group Discount: YES
Refunds: SEE 'REFUNDS' SECTION

NOTES:
1) Time restrictions are indicated by a restriction shown against the ticket's validity code.
2) Holders of 16-25, Senior, Disabled Persons, HM Forces and Family & Friends Railcards, New Deal Photocards and Inter-Rail (Code 70) Cards travelling with Off-Peak tickets may use ANY Virgin train service, as long as the journey being made is priced by Virgin Trains. If the journey is not priced by Virgin Trains then the stated Off-Peak restrictions apply.
3) Only Senior, Disabled persons and HM Forces Railcards discounts are
offered with First Class Off-Peak Tickets.

BREAK OF JOURNEY
Break of journey is allowed on Off-Peak tickets unless otherwise indicated by a restriction shown against the ticket's validity code.

Off-Peak Singles and the outward portion of Off-Peak Returns are valid for travel on the date shown on the ticket. Where a journey can't be completed within one day, break of journey for an overnight stay is allowed. Where a journey continues into the next day, travel must resume before 1200 and any relevant time restrictions apply. No further break of journey is allowed except for the purposes of changing trains.

Return portions of Off-Peak Return tickets are valid for travel until 0230 on the day following the last day of validity (i.e. one calendar month from the outward journey). If a passenger is still travelling at 0230, they may stay on the train to complete that part of the journey but no further break of journey is allowed and all travel must be completed by 1200.

Note: Cross London transfers will only be accepted by London Underground on the date shown on the ticket (or last day of validity for Off-Peak Returns) and until 0429 the following day.

TICKET INFORMATION:
Off-Peak tickets are not valid when the journey is affected by a restriction shown against the ticket's validity code.

Tickets with a 'Maltese Cross' shown in the route description allow transfer across London on London Underground, Docklands Light Railway or First Capital Connect (Thameslink route) services appropriate to the route of the through journey being made.

Any local validity easements can be found in the Easements section EASEMENTS.

Travel restrictions do not apply on Public Holidays.

SELLING AN OFF-PEAK TICKET
Customers should be told of any restriction which may affect any part of their journey. Where available, an information card giving ticket validity details should be given out with each Off-Peak ticket.

John

 

[glynn80]

I travel regularly from Newton Abbot to Sheffield and back. I need to be here on Monday morning. Whilst the first train gets me here by 10.15 (which is OK) it is very expensive. I used to travel on last train Sunday evening staying overnight in Bristol/Birmingham. In first class this used to be valid and cost £227.60 (FIRST CLASS OFF-PEAK RETURN). These days these fares do not appear to be available on any web site. Can anyone enlighten me with what the rules are on breaking a journey with an overnight stay on either outward/return leg? and whether these rules have changed recently?. Thanks

The fare you quote at £227.60 definitely still exists in the fares database, Mondays-Fridays it has the restriction code 2V which restricts travel on the Outward and Return to any scheduled to depart after 09:30.

Looking on the National Express site, I can find the fair pretty easily by clicking the "More Expensive" fare link under the list of fares at the top.

 

[bryheruk]

Thanks for your replies -
Regarding the following extract from the NFM 02 disk:-
"Off-Peak Singles and the outward portion of Off-Peak Returns are valid for travel on the date shown on the ticket. Where a journey can't be completed within one day, break of journey for an overnight stay is allowed. Where a journey continues into the next day, travel must resume before 1200 and any relevant time restrictions apply. No further break of journey is allowed except for the purposes of changing trains. "
.
Does the phrase - any relevant time restrictions apply - prevent me from taking a train from BHM to SHF departing at 06:00 on a Monday or am I allowed to do that?

 

[John @ home]

Does the phrase - any relevant time restrictions apply - prevent me from taking a train from BHM to SHF departing at 06:00 on a Monday or am I allowed to do that?

You are not allowed to do that with this ticket.

The restriction By any train except those scheduled to depart before 0930 (Monday - Friday) applies to both outward and return legs and bars any train at that time.

For advice on how to do this journey in First Class without paying the First Anytime Return of £388.50, firstly consider whether your weekly journeys are predictable enough to use a combination of Advance tickets and Standard tickets with First Weekend upgrade.

If not, buy:
First Anytime Return Sheffield - Birmingham Stations £139.80
plus First Off Peak Return Birmingham Stations - Newton Abbot £154.30
Total £294.10, saving £94.40.

This cost can be reduced further by buying:
First Anytime Return Sheffield - Derby £48.00
First Anytime Day Single Sheffield - Birmingham Stations £25.50
First Anytime Day Single Birmingham Stations - Sheffield £25.50
First Off Peak Return Birmingham Stations - Cheltenham Spa £40.60
First Anytime Return Cheltenham Spa - Bristol Temple Meads £34.00
First Off Peak Return Bristol Temple Meads - Taunton £28.00
First Off Peak Return Taunton - Newton Abbot £47.00
Total £248.60, saving another £45.50.

Using a combination of tickets in this way requires trains which stop at the changeover points, but from a quick glance at the current CrossCountry timetable I think all yours do.

John

 

[bryheruk]

John

Thanks very much for clarifying this. Next time I need to do this journey I will take advantage of your suggestion of buying multiple tickets. Nice to see that ticket buying can be so straightforward!
Regards Chris

 

[yorkie]

First Anytime Day Single Sheffield - Birmingham Stations £25.50
First Anytime Day Single Birmingham Stations - Sheffield £25.50

Typo - should read Derby instead of Sheffield.

But excellent advice there John!

 

[John @ home]

Typo - should read Derby instead of Sheffield.

Well spotted! What I meant to say was:

First Anytime Return Sheffield - Derby £48.00
First Anytime Day Single Derby - Birmingham Stations £25.50
First Anytime Day Single Birmingham Stations - Derby £25.50
First Off Peak Return Birmingham Stations - Cheltenham Spa £40.60
First Anytime Return Cheltenham Spa - Bristol Temple Meads £34.00
First Off Peak Return Bristol Temple Meads - Taunton £28.00
First Off Peak Return Taunton - Newton Abbot £47.00
Total £248.60, saving another £45.50.

John

 

[glynn80]

You are not allowed to do that with this ticket.

The restriction By any train except those scheduled to depart before 0930 (Monday - Friday) applies to both outward and return legs and bars any train at that time.
John

This is interesting as you are correct the FRPP states:

Off-Peak Singles and the outward portion of Off-Peak Returns are valid for travel on the date shown on the ticket. Where a journey can’t be completed within one day, break of journey for an overnight stay is allowed. Where a journey continues into the next day, travel must resume before 1200 and any relevant time restrictions apply. No further break of journey is allowed except for the purposes of changing trains.

But the NXEC site does allow you to purchase tickets on the 0600 service from BHM to SHF if you specify the last service from Newton Abbot to Birmingham on that First Off Peak return ticket!