"Nice" and "Not so nice" units working in multiple

[Class172]

The WMT 170+153 combos have some of the worse discrepancy between the quality of the two units.

That may be so but often I will choose the 153 simply because I am more likely to get a seat (unlikely I know on many Hereford services), even if the legroom is slightly restricted.

 

[Mordac]

That may be so but often I will choose the 153 simply because I am more likely to get a seat (unlikely I know on many Hereford services), even if the legroom is slightly restricted.

Understandable. Not sure what I'd choose on a very hot day though, I think I'd prefer standing in an air conditioned 170 tbh.

 

[Roast Veg]

It can also be more subtle than class - on SE I definitely favour 375s with comfy 2+2 seating in 8/12 car formations. On EMR, a 5 car 222 is preferable if a 4 car is attached, since you're more likely to get a seat.

 

[ijmad]

The Class 456 interiors seem to be in better shape than the Class 455 sets they're being used to extend on SWR. I'd pick the 456 because not only is it plusher, less people will pass through the unit looking for seats as it doesn't have a connection to the rest of the train. Wonder if any regular SWR commuters have picked up on this?

 

[yorksrob]

I'm not sure if anyone has ever brought this up before, but I'm intrigued...
If two units are working in multiple, and one is clearly much better than the other, will passengers who know nothing about trains tend to get on the nicer one?
It came to mind after seeing 2 class 153s working with a 170 for WMR. If there was plenty of room on both units, why would anyone get on the far tattier 153?
An extreme example (and I'm pretty sure it isn't possible) but if a pacer was joined with a 195, would you find anyone on the pacer?
I'd be interested to hear your observations/opinions on these kind of situations

In the example quoted, I would probably choose the 153 because it's nice to go at speed with all the windows open in this weather.

 

[Metal_gee_man]

It can also be more subtle than class - on SE I definitely favour 375s with comfy 2+2 seating in 8/12 car formations. On EMR, a 5 car 222 is preferable if a 4 car is attached, since you're more likely to get a seat.

I see a SE 375 turn up and immediately make sure I don't have to sit in the 375/9s because 3 + 2 seating should be banned.

 

[bassmike]

Not in my experience. I took a pacer coupled to a 150 last year, and the spread was about even from my observations (I started on the pacer and moved quickly to the 150, simply because I was standing on the wrong end of the first platform.)

One thing I have noticed though is in Scotland 318’s are much preferred over the 320’s they often work in multiple with, interesting because they’re very similar.

most of them wouldn't know the difference between a 158 and a pacer.

 

[alangla]

To dodge the guard...

I remember working the Chase line and two Canadian lads got on the 153 at Rugeley Trent Valley. They were very impressed with the comfort and amazed at how old the unit was.
Suggested the get into the 170 at Walsall and they were blown away with the difference. It was far superior to anything they had back home.

Obviously they’ve never traveled on a Nightstar. Miles more comfortable in Standard than any UK stock.

 

[StephenHunter]

The Nightstar is UK stock...

 

[Doomotron]

Miles more comfortable in Standard than any UK stock.

I wonder why...

 

[vlad]

I've seen 153s coupled to most 14x and 15x units. It makes it easy to choose which bit to travel on, unless the other bit is a 150.

 

[alangla]

The Nightstar is UK stock...

But never operated in the UK.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

On mixed CIG and VEP formations many people would avoid the VEP

 

[yoyothehobo]

Remember seeing an Arriva Trains Wales service at Man Picc consisting of a 175 and 150....

 

[Mikey C]

On mixed CIG and VEP formations many people would avoid the VEP

In a funny way many 377s recreate this within the same carriage, with comfy 4 abreast seating at the ends and narrow 5 abreast seating in the middle! I've made the "novice" mistake of sitting in the wrong seats and only noticing the better ones when I got off

 

[computerSaysNo]

In a funny way many 377s recreate this within the same carriage, with comfy 4 abreast seating at the ends and narrow 5 abreast seating in the middle! I've made the "novice" mistake of sitting in the wrong seats and only noticing the better ones when I got off

This sounds similar to the 334s in Scotland, there's 3+2 seating in the centre carriage and 2+2 with armrests in the outer two coaches. There are only eight airline seats per 3 car set (four in each end carriage), I always sit in one of those with the armrests. I don't use the train often enough to see whether the public prefer the 2+2 or 3+2 carriages unfortunately.

 

[D6975]

A few years ago, travelling from Middlesbrough to Newcastle, my train was formed (rather unusually) of 158+153. Nearly all the passengers opted for the ‘nicer’ 158, including me. The aircon was struggling though, so I moved before even reaching Thornaby and travelled in an almost empty and much cooler 153.

ps This route is I believe due to get 158s in the not too distant future.

 

[43096]

Remember seeing an Arriva Trains Wales service at Man Picc consisting of a 175 and 150....

In your dreams. Different couplers so they can’t work together.

 

[NoMorePacers]

A few years ago, travelling from Middlesbrough to Newcastle, my train was formed (rather unusually) of 158+153. Nearly all the passengers opted for the ‘nicer’ 158, including me. The aircon was struggling though, so I moved before even reaching Thornaby and travelled in an almost empty and much cooler 153.

ps This route is I believe due to get 158s in the not too distant future.

Middlesbrough-Newcastle via the coast already has got its 158s now, so non-existent air con can be enjoyed on that route once again.

 

[Deepgreen]

On mixed CIG and VEP formations many people would avoid the VEP

The Waterloo to Guildford (via Cobham and via Woking) routes in the 1970s had eight car trains comprising 4EPB+4VEP, and often the VEP was replaced by a 4CIG. That was a contrast that affected peoples' choices.

 

[Rick1984]

To dodge the guard...

I remember working the Chase line and two Canadian lads got on the 153 at Rugeley Trent Valley. They were very impressed with the comfort and amazed at how old the unit was.
Suggested the get into the 170 at Walsall and they were blown away with the difference. It was far superior to anything they had back home.

Wow Canadian trains must be bad!

 

[xotGD]

The Waterloo to Guildford (via Cobham and via Woking) routes in the 1970s had eight car trains comprising 4EPB+4VEP, and often the VEP was replaced by a 4CIG. That was a contrast that affected peoples' choices.

Give us northerners a clue - which one is the comfy unit?

 

[6Gman]

The WMT 170+153 combos have some of the worse discrepancy between the quality of the two units.

Which way round?

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

In your dreams. Different couplers so they can’t work together.

Maybe they were sharing the platform and the OP didn’t notice that they weren’t coupled.

 

[Mikey C]

Give us northerners a clue - which one is the comfy unit?

4EPB (Class 415) - Commuter cattle truck
4CIG (Class 411) - express unit (4 across)
4VEP (Class 423) - in between!

 

[xotGD]

4EPB (Class 415) - Commuter cattle truck
4CIG (Class 411) - express unit (4 across)
4VEP (Class 423) - in between!

Thanks. But didn't EPBs have those seats that run the full width of the train where you can lie down for a nap?

 

[Deepgreen]

Thanks. But didn't EPBs have those seats that run the full width of the train where you can lie down for a nap?

Only the full compartment vehicles. They were withdrawn before the rest owing the increasing security concerns after the number of rapes and assaults increased. Unlike the other two, the CIGs didn't have doors at every seat, which was a big improvement in comfort.

 

[Rick1984]

The concept of sitting in a bay of seats and somone opening a door and getting in is quite odd these days.
Got to go on a slam door once in a holiday to New Forest. Think it was a 4VEP

 

[London Trains]

In a funny way many 377s recreate this within the same carriage, with comfy 4 abreast seating at the ends and narrow 5 abreast seating in the middle! I've made the "novice" mistake of sitting in the wrong seats and only noticing the better ones when I got off

Also in 10 car 377 formations that include a 377/3, lots of people are drawn to it. It has 2+2 seating throughout, has half tables for easy exit from window seats, has comfy seats that arent table seats (the comfy seats in a 377/1 or 4 are all table seats) for more privacy etc.

 

[norbitonflyer]

There are a number of services on SWR operated by 444/450 combinations. The different liveries applied by SWT to the two classes make it very easy for passengers to identify the "better" unit - and thanks to the high profile campaign by the Portsmouth line users' group against use of the "suburban" 450s on long distance services, many passengers are aware of the difference. The new franchisee SWR are gradually applying a new livery to both classes, which will make the difference harder to spot.