Northern staff at Deansgate refused to allow me to break journey on off-peak day return - had to buy ticket to leave

[LOL The Irony]

Hello all,

Today at around 16:10, I left the Blackpool - Airport train on the return leg of a Knutsford - Bolton off peak day return, something this ticket allows. However, when I got to the street level gateline, my ticket was rejected. The guy I had at the barrier said that I had to continue onwards to Piccadilly despite the ticket being listed as valid via Manchester. After a little back and forth, since I had business in Manchester, I had the idea of purchasing a Salford Crescent - Deansgate (well Manchester stations) ticket at a cost £3.10 to leave the station. So, how should I go about reclaiming the additional cost?

(for clarification, this was an m-ticket via Northern's app. Yes, yes, I know.)

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello all,

Today at around 16:10, I left the Blackpool - Airport train on the return leg of a Knutsford - Bolton off peak day return, something this ticket allows. However, when I got to the street level gateline, my ticket was rejected. The guy I had at the barrier said that I had to continue onwards to Piccadilly despite the ticket being listed as valid via Manchester. After a little back and forth, since I had business in Manchester, I had the idea of purchasing a Salford Crescent - Deansgate (well Manchester stations) ticket at a cost £3.10 to leave the station. So, how should I go about reclaiming the additional cost?

(for clarification, this was an m-ticket via Northern's app. Yes, yes, I know.)

Is this going to have to be a case of writing to complain to customer services and asking them to refund it? Assume it was not possible for you to insist that the gateline staff member checked with a more experienced / senior colleague / manager?

 

[LOL The Irony]

Assume it was not possible for you to insist that the gateline staff member checked with a more experienced / senior colleague / manager?

If I had more time, I would've probably wound up doing that. The problem is they looked like carlyle lot and I'd rather avoid wasting my breath and energy on them.

Is this going to have to be a case of writing to complain to customer services and asking them to refund it?

I'll go do that tomorrow.

 

[WesternLancer]

If I had more time, I would've probably wound up doing that. The problem is they looked like carlyle lot and I'd rather avoid wasting my breath and energy on them.

I can appreciate your course of action / reasons. I guess best to stress you had to leave the station without delay for work related reasons or some such.
What's the betting it will take more than one request to them to get this sorted.
Keep us posted

 

[Mcr Warrior]

So what's going on?

Lack of knowledge on Break of Journey terms and conditions?

Automatically assuming that Off Peak tickets can't be used at Deansgate between 1601 and 1829?

How else do you get back from Bolton to Knutsford without travelling via Deansgate?

 

[gray1404]

This needs to be a formal complaint to Northern. I would suggest that you posted a draught copy of your complaint on here for us to have a look at it before you send it to them. You need to seek the following assurances from them...
A full investigation of what happened, refund of additional further that you were forced to purchase, compensation and reassurances from northern that relevant steps have been taken and written confirmation that this will not happen again.

 

[LOL The Irony]

Keep us posted

Will do.

Lack of knowledge on Break of Journey terms and conditions?

Automatically assuming that Off Peak tickets can't be used at Deansgate between 1601 and 1829?

3rd option; computer said no and the computer is infallible and always right.

How else do you get back from Bolton to Knutsford without travelling via Deansgate?

You don't without a really convoluted way via Wigan and Crewe, which wasn't even valid in the first place.

What's the betting it will take more than one request to them to get this sorted.

Who knows, probably quite high.

I guess best to stress you had to leave the station without delay for work related reasons or some such.

I'd reserved an item at HMV since I was going to be in town, would this be adequate to tug at their heartstrings (even though you don't need any reason to break journey)?

I would suggest that you posted a draught copy of your complaint on here for us to have a look at it before you send it to them.

I'll draft something up over the course of tomorrow.

 

[gray1404]

You need to give a thorough and detailed description of the member of staff that you spoke to so they can be identified.

 

[WesternLancer]

I'd reserved an item at HMV since I was going to be in town, would this be adequate to tug at their heartstrings (even though you don't need any reason to break journey)?

Don't give the detail of the reason why you needed to break the jny - just say you had to do it and were entitled to do so

 

[danielcanning]

Are Northern still using rent-a-cops to man barriers?

 

[LOL The Irony]

Here's my draft for those in the know to read over, thanks in advance

To whom it may concern,

At approximately 16:10 on the the 4/5/2022, I got off the Manchester Airport train on the return leg of a Knutsford to Bolton off peak return at Deansgate to break my journey, something this ticket allows me to do. Upon reaching the barrier, the gentleman who I came across made me scan my ticket, which was rejected. He suggested I take the next available train to Piccadilly, which was about 10 minutes later. Since I had business to partake in, I needed to leave the station, so I couldn’t take another service or spend time arguing over the validity of my ticket, so I took the decision to purchase a Salford Crescent to Deansgate single at the cost of £3.10 to enable me to go about my activities.

Since I was unable to go about my business without being made to pay an additional cost on top of my return that allowed me to do so, I would like to seek a refund on the ticket I had to buy to leave the station. I would also like to request additional training for your staff, since the man who stopped me and his fellow staff didn’t pick on the fact that my ticket was perfectly valid. The staff member who I came across was a black gentleman, around 6ft in height and a slim build. I would like it if this could be resolved swiftly and the staff involved receive additional training, instead of putting all of their faith in what the computer says.

 

[30907]

Here's my draft for those in the know to read over, thanks in advance

My suggestion of a simpler version (I have removed the personal description as you note that none of the staff knew the rules):

At approximately 16:10 on the the 4/5/2022, I got off the Manchester Airport train on the return leg of a Knutsford to Bolton off peak return at Deansgate to break my journey, something this ticket allows me to do. Upon reaching the barrier, the gentleman who I came across made me scan my ticket, which was rejected. He suggested I take the next available train to Piccadilly, which was about 10 minutes later. As I needed to leave the station, and didn't have time to argue over the validity of my ticket, I took the decision to purchase a Salford Crescent to Deansgate single at the cost of £3.10 to enable me to leave.

I would like to seek a refund on the ticket I had to buy to leave the station. I would also like to request additional training for your staff, since the man who stopped me and his fellow staff didn’t pick on the fact that my ticket was perfectly valid. I trust that both parts of this request can be resolved swiftly.

 

[yorkie]

My suggestion of a simpler version (I have removed the personal description as you note that none of the staff knew the rules):

At approximately 16:10 on the the 4/5/2022, I got off the Manchester Airport train on the return leg of a Knutsford to Bolton off peak return at Deansgate to break my journey, something this ticket allows me to do. Upon reaching the barrier, the gentleman who I came across made me scan my ticket, which was rejected. He suggested I take the next available train to Piccadilly, which was about 10 minutes later. As I needed to leave the station, and didn't have time to argue over the validity of my ticket, I took the decision to purchase a Salford Crescent to Deansgate single at the cost of £3.10 to enable me to leave.

I would like to seek a refund on the ticket I had to buy to leave the station. I would also like to request additional training for your staff, since the man who stopped me and his fellow staff didn’t pick on the fact that my ticket was perfectly valid. I trust that both parts of this request can be resolved swiftly.

That sounds good to me

@LOL The Irony - let us know how you get on.

 

[LOL The Irony]

I have submitted the complaint and will await their response. Thanks all for your advice.

 

[Kite159]

Is it bad to think that the first response you will get from Northern will completely ignore the points raised and will falsely claim that a break of journey isn't allowed on the ticket you were using?

 

[LOL The Irony]

Is it bad to think that the first response you will get from Northern will completely ignore the points raised and will falsely claim that a break of journey isn't allowed on the ticket you were using?

I don't think it's bad since they appear to have a reputation for it. If they do so, my reply will include words such as "Ombudsman" and "chargeback".

 

[py_megapixel]

Is it bad to think that the first response you will get from Northern will completely ignore the points raised and will falsely claim that a break of journey isn't allowed on the ticket you were using?

Fingers crossed, but I have generally found Northern email support do a better job than average for TOCs. (I appreciate that isn't saying much).

In particular, whenever I've emailed them they've responded the next day, which makes misunderstandings a bit less annoying as you don't send off a response and then have to wait days/weeks.

 

[LOL The Irony]

Update;

Within the last 20 minutes, Northern have gotten back to me and are going to be refunding the Salford to Deansgate ticket.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Update;

Within the last 20 minutes, Northern have gotten back to me and are going to be refunding the Salford to Deansgate ticket.

Result: LOL The Irony 1 Deansgate Barrier Staff 0 (after extra time but didn't go to penalties).

 

[Hadders]

That’s a decent result.

 

[lyndhurst25]

That’s a decent result.

Decent? It is the bare minimum that that can get away with. No extra compensation for the delay, stress and time spent having to complain? No promise that they will arrange training to stop such “mistakes” happening to other passengers in the future?

 

[LOL The Irony]

Result: LOL The Irony 1 Deansgate Barrier Staff 0 (after extra time but didn't go to penalties).

yeah

That’s a decent result.

Indeed.

Decent? It is the bare minimum that that can get away with. No extra compensation for the delay, stress and time spent having to complain? No promise that they will arrange training to stop such “mistakes” happening to other passengers in the future?

Well they could've rejected it, so it's better than nothing. However, this has cost them £3.10 out of their pocket, so if they don't train their staff, that's their problem now. Although retraining would prevent people not in the know of their rights from being fleeced by idiots who don't know their own rules.

 

[pemma]

Result: LOL The Irony 1 Deansgate Barrier Staff 0 (after extra time but didn't go to penalties).

No red card from the referee through?

 

[Hadders]

Decent in the contact of Northern’s last performance.

They’ve replied promptly with the correct answer. They could’ve gone further, and perhaps should’ve done, but previously we might well have waited weeks for a reply and been told the staff were correct.

 

[LOL The Irony]

Decent in the contact of Northern’s last performance.

They’ve replied promptly with the correct answer. They could’ve gone further, and perhaps should’ve done, but previously we might well have waited weeks for a reply and been told the staff were correct.

Indeed. They replied within 1 working day of my complaint and I've gotten my £3.10 back.

 

[greyman42]

Decent? It is the bare minimum that that can get away with. No extra compensation for the delay, stress and time spent having to complain? No promise that they will arrange training to stop such “mistakes” happening to other passengers in the future?

They have no intention of arranging any training so at least they are being honest.

 

[Trackman]

Are these barrier staff at Northern stations hired goons with 10 minutes training or ‘proper’ Northern staff?

 

[SteveM70]

However, this has cost them £3.10 out of their pocket

£3.10 they should never have had in their pocket. They haven’t been cost anything

 

[gray1404]

They need to offer assurances they will take the necessary action to ensure this does not happen again. Otherwise I would not consider the complaint fully resolved.

Perhaps you could post a copy of Northern' reply?

 

[LOL The Irony]

£3.10 they should never have had in their pocket. They haven’t been cost anything

They only got a percentage of that £3.10, so they're down and I'm even.

Perhaps you could post a copy of Northern' reply?

No point as it they didn't even bring it up. Once they text me the bank details, I'll reply and ask about an update on the staff.

Are these barrier staff at Northern stations hired goons with 10 minutes training or ‘proper’ Northern staff?

I didn't notice since my mind was on getting to HMV. However, since the ticket was billed to Piccadilly and the staff there can be the Carlyle lot, I'm going with the former.