Permit to Travel Machines

[47513 Severn]

The South Ruislip machine appears to be permanently not in service now. Certainly since Chiltern installed a full TVM in the subway. I would be intrigued to know how much use that TVM gets, it is inside the gateline and only really of use to people interchanging between Chiltern and the Cental Line. I suspect 99% of people making that move already have tickets. While it is a very 'bare basics' machine (card only despite the home screen saying you can pay by card or cash and no oyster reader despite the home screen having a "Buy oyster products" button) it must still have been expensive to install for so little potential revenue.

Back on the PTT machines, nearby Northolt Park has one which was in service when I found myself there during one of the summer tube strikes. I inserted 10p to see what it would produce but it jammed inside the coin slot! Northolt Park also has full cash/card/oyster TVM's and a peak hours ticket office.

47513

 

[PermitToTravel]

The South Ruislip TVM is bizarre. It was only installed in 2013; I've no idea why. Northolt Park got its at the same time - that obviously sees a lot more use.

 

[greatkingrat]

Presumably staff on the gateline will let people through if they need to buy a ticket not sold from the LUL machines?

 

[47513 Severn]

True and the manual gate at South Ruislip seems to be permanently unlocked anyway. You would still need to know the TVM is there though, it isn't visible from the ticket hall.

Going off topic a bit but, speaking of bizarrely placed TVM's, I've always wondered about the machine at the top of the Jubilee Line escalators at London Bridge. It is also within the gateline and while it is certainly possible to get there without passing through a barrier (eg. via the DLR to join the Jubilee at Stratford) I don't think you could do it legitimately without a ticket.

47513

 

[centraltrains]

Does anyone know who is in charge of the South Ruislip machine? It was located on the National Rail side of the subway; but when I emailed Chiltern it wasn't one they listed to be on of theirs. Is likely that London Underground are in charge of it?

 

[PermitToTravel]

It might be abandoned. It wouldn't surprise me if NSE mothballed it when LT gated the station but never got round to actually removing it.

 

[fishquinn]

I noticed that Widney Manor had one when I was there yesterday.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Are the PERTIS machines with lights more predominant in the Midlands and North? I can't say I've encountered a PERTIS machine with the controllable light very often down here in the South East or London.

 

[davetheguard]

There' still one at Didcot Parkway, outside the main building, and next to the night entrance (which is a sensible position for it).

There's also one at Oxford, on the main up platform, to the left as you enter the platform from the concourse. This is less well positioned, and if there's ever a time when the ticket office closes, but the fairly new ticket barriers are still staffed, it will be inaccessible anyway.

Unfortunately, although they are still in position, it is not possible to find out whether they are still in service, without travelling late at night or very early in the morning; the whole point is they were only ever in use when the ticket office itself was not open.

 

[centraltrains]

There' still one at Didcot Parkway, outside the main building, and next to the night entrance (which is a sensible position for it).

There's also one at Oxford, on the main up platform, to the left as you enter the platform from the concourse. This is less well positioned, and if there's ever a time when the ticket office closes, but the fairly new ticket barriers are still staffed, it will be inaccessible anyway.

Unfortunately, although they are still in position, it is not possible to find out whether they are still in service, without travelling late at night or very early in the morning; the whole point is they were only ever in use when the ticket office itself was not open.

It's brilliant in the West Midlands for using them! London Midland ticket office reduced hours (introduced a few years ago) are brilliant for getting PTT Tickets

You can usually tell if their in service if the ticket office is open. Their only not in service if A) The Not in Use light is on B) All Lights are off. If it is just the Pay at Office light on then you know it'll be working later (as long a the ticket office staff remember... Which they seem to be good at forgetting.)

It might be abandoned. It wouldn't surprise me if NSE mothballed it when LT gated the station but never got round to actually removing it.

Time to email TfL then!

"The Help and Contact facility is currently unavailable due to essential maintenance work." :roll:


I have been asking TOCs for locations of PERTIS Machines and some have been quite helpful and some haven't. But some TOCs (which I don't think have them) told me something along the lines of "Permits to Travel can only be issued by staff but their has to be a good reason to need one" Does anyone know what these are?

 

[BurtonM]

If the TOCs are being awkward just do an FoI request, they'll have to tell you then. PERTIS locations is a prefectly reasonable thing to ask.

Isn't the whole point of Permit To Travel that there aren't any staff around to sell tickets?! Any member of staff with authority to issue a PTT would surely have the means to sell tickets by extension...

 

[Mojo]

If the TOCs are being awkward just do an FoI request, they'll have to tell you then. PERTIS locations is a prefectly reasonable thing to ask.

No Train Operating Companies are currently subject to the Freedom of Information Act, although you may get limited information for the Overground and TfL Rail by sending a FoI request to TfL.

 

[jonty14]

Anyone else think of time travel when you read the topic title?

 

[PermitToTravel]

But some TOCs (which I don't think have them) told me something along the lines of "Permits to Travel can only be issued by staff but their has to be a good reason to need one" Does anyone know what these are?

Isn't the whole point of Permit To Travel that there aren't any staff around to sell tickets?! Any member of staff with authority to issue a PTT would surely have the means to sell tickets by extension...

It would make sense for TOCs that didn't use Permits to Travel (in the normal sense) to use that term instead to refer to staff-issued authorities to travel without a valid ticket

 

[fstrange]

There is a Permit to Travel machine at Hartford (Cheshire). Outside the ticket office. I used it on Saturday, although the ticket it gave me was almost illegible. The main ticket machine was not booting up and I needed a train before the ticket office opened. No one else there seemed to use it and the London Midland conductor was clearly expecting and ready to issue tickets on board (or check them if people already had them). He was very professional at announcements, ticket issue and platform working and the train ran to time throughout the journey.

 

[A1]

Noticed tonight that the one at Romford (before plat 3&4) is still soliciting donations. Seems to be working, but I had no small coins to test.

 

[Calamity James]

Maidstone Barracks has one - not sure if it works though

Just to confirm that it does work. I use it whenever I'm heading into work and not driving. Quite picky about which 5p coins it takes, and the last time I used it the ink was very low.



I think Aylesford still has one too, there certainly was (and it worked) when I lived there back in 2012.

Edit: In fact I think most of the stations on the Medway Valley Line (except Strood, Maidstone West and Paddock Wood) have PERTIS machines.

 

[centraltrains]

I was travelling the stations between Wolverhampton and Shrewsbury yesterday on the hunt for PERTIS machines and was surprised to find that most of the stations had them and not one was out of use.

Oakengate by far was the best machine I had ever seen. It looked brand new, the green button was intact, no scratches on any of the screens. Even the out of use lights were un-touched. Only problem was the light strip wasn't working.

It was strange that all the stations on the line bar Okengate had really short machines!

 

[GarethW]

There are no SWT stations with both TVM and Pertis, the Pertis machines were systematically removed as the S&B machines were rolled out.

There are minor stations with Pertis, (Hillbrook, Redbridge, Beaulieu Rd near here for examples) but they are not the old red BR type, but a newer model more like a car parking machine.

Was at Beaulieu Road the other day and took a snap of the PERTIS machine.

 

[Bishopstone]

Down here in Southern land, there's an old red PERTIS at Bishopstone (Station Road entrance) which appeared after Google Streetview last visited in 2009. Why they bothered to install it I don't know, as we're not in a PF zone; all passing trains have conductors and the machine was clearly 'pre-loved' and unreliable from day one.

I'm 90% sure there are PERTIS at Newhaven Harbour, Newhaven Town and Southease: all on or adjacent to the Down platforms, if I recall correctly. (Newhaven Marine doesn't have one, before anyone asks!)

Cooksbridge had a PERTIS, but this may have disappeared with the recent installation of a ticket machine.

I can't confirm specifics, but the halts between Bexhill and Hampden Park (Eastbourne) might be a fruitful hunting ground. I seem to recall Pevensey Bay had one when I last passed through, several years ago.

 

[tsr]

It appears that the PERTIS at Ashurst only works on the forty-second Thursday evening of the year. Nearly fell over when I last got a PERTIS handed to me from that one...

Other stations with PERTIS machines include Salfords, which is a bit odd considering it has a TVM and a part-time ticket office. Also a few on the Portsmouth Lines around the Dorking area (but not including, IIRC, any of the three Dorking stations).

 

[BurtonM]

Quite picky about which 5p coins it takes.

The Royal Mint changed the metal composition of 5p coins a few years ago (did it coincide with the stupid shield puzzle thing?), and the newer coins feel lighter and almost plasticky to me. When they were introduced, vending machines in general would almost always reject them (had a lot of trouble with £2.05 fares into Manchester using the TVM at Stalybridge!), presumably as they were weighing in wrong or something.
With PERTIS machines being so old they probably only accept the older, heavier(?) 5p coins.

 

[Kite159]

There was a few PERTIS machines on the stations between Letchworth & Cambridge, although all seemed to be out of use. Similar to the one at Acton Bridge (which doesn't have a TVM)

 

[Ianno87]

Apologies if it's been mentioned upthread, but I spotted one on the down platform at Angel Road the other week.

 

[centraltrains]

Started making a dedicated website to the PERTIS machines now!

http://pertis.bibfun.com/search.php (Link to search area isn't links in navigation menu yet as I haven't finished enough data entry yet)

Only done Snow Hill lines so far, lots of data entry to go ._.

Will search by Station Name, Machine printer name or NRE Abbreviation!

 

[1D53]

Walton on the Naze is still going strong!

 

[Kite159]

The one at White Notley doesn't seem to like my 5p. Didn't check the one at Kirby Cross.
The one at Cressing was out of use. Although both shacks were quite rural so I doubt there is much lost revenue

 

[MrPIC]

There's one on the down platform at Angel Road, looks to be still working!

 

[wra_relay]

A newly refurbished machine has been reinstated at Smethwick Rolfe Street

 

[Bungaroosh]

For nostalgia/posterity I bought one at Balcombe in the summer when I beheld the rare sight of a Permit to Travel machine (years since I'd seen one). I used to buy these a lot at Herne Hill when the ticket office was shut and they only had those old Swiss red ticket machines with a very limited selection of destinations (one button for each).

PS I believe the machine was a bit screwy and I only put something like 20p in but it said £0.60 on it ...