Pink Readers

[zinger549]

I have been traveling from Leytonstone to Hibury and Islington. This means changing at Stratford and getting the Overground. Using oyster it has been costing £3.20.On my way home tonight I touched the pink reader at Stratford and it only cost me £1.60. Can someone explain how the pink readers work as I am a bit confused. Thanks

 

[Chapeltom]

I think they validate your route, meaning they prove you avoid Zone 1 so you pay less.

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tickets/14871.aspx

 

[maniacmartin]

Pink readers are used to prove you went on a certain route. You should touch them midway through your journey if you are changing trains and pass one.

If you don't touch the pink reader, you are assumed to go on the most expensive reasonable route that does not involve going through other intermediate gatelines which could be used to work out where you went.

Not touching the pink reader at Stratford means you're assumed to have gone via Zone 1 (e.g. changing from Victoria to Central line at Oxford Circus), and you are charged the Zone 1 fare accordingly

 

[yorkie]

Welcome to the forum

I have been travelling from Leytonstone to Hibury and Islington. This means changing at Stratford and getting the Overground. Using oyster it has been costing £3.20.On my way home tonight I touched the pink reader at Stratford and it only cost me £1.60.

That is correct.

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/tickets/faresandtickets/farefinder/current/default.aspx?mode=alternate&on=Leytonstone&dn=Highbury+%26+Islington&ft=Adult

Leytonstone to Highbury & Islington
Single Fare
Oyster: £3.20 M-F 0630 to 0930 & 1600 to 1900

Alternative Oyster single fares:
Route 1: Avoiding Zone 1 via Stratford
Oyster: £1.60 M-F 0630 to 0930 & 1600 to 1900

To ensure you are charged the appropriate fare you must touch on the pink card reader on the Oyster route validator if interchanging at Stratford

Can someone explain how the pink readers work as I am a bit confused. Thanks

See RailUK Fares & Ticketing Guide - Section 2 - Smart Cards (inc. Oyster) : 2.2.1 Alternative routes.

Enjoy!

Any questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

 

[Clip]

It still amazes me how htey have set up the routings for journeys like this especially when their own journey planner tells you to do the route that the OP does. You would have to be very odd to go via zone 1

 

[MikeWh]

It still amazes me how htey have set up the routings for journeys like this especially when their own journey planner tells you to do the route that the OP does. You would have to be very odd to go via zone 1

More likely is via Liverpool Street and Moorgate. The problem is that if there is a halfway reasonable no-touch option via zone 1 then they have to charge that because a significant number of people will go that way.

 

[Clip]

More likely is via Liverpool Street and Moorgate. The problem is that if there is a halfway reasonable no-touch option via zone 1 then they have to charge that because a significant number of people will go that way.

But that would sitll take longer though so I do still struggle to see why anyone would go that way unless there were engineering works or something.

 

[Paul Kelly]

I was going to say that if going via Zone 1 always involves passing through barriers (and thus can be easily identified), and there is a cheaper route that avoids Zone 1 and doesn't pass through any barriers, should the non-barrier route not be made the default (and I thought this happened with other journeys)?

But then I looked at the map, and I think there is a Zone 1 route that avoids barriers - changing from the Central to the Hammersmith & City Line at Mile End (cross-platform interchange IIRC) and then then from H&C to Northern City Line (First Capital Connect) at Moorgate (not sure if this is a barrier-free interchange; I'm just guessing).

Can anybody confirm? I am going to be moving to London in the next couple of months so will probably start to become interested in this sort of thing...

 

[paddington]

I was going to say that if going via Zone 1 always involves passing through barriers (and thus can be easily identified), and there is a cheaper route that avoids Zone 1 and doesn't pass through any barriers, should the non-barrier route not be made the default (and I thought this happened with other journeys)?

But then I looked at the map, and I think there is a Zone 1 route that avoids barriers - changing from the Central to the Hammersmith & City Line at Mile End (cross-platform interchange IIRC) and then then from H&C to Northern City Line (First Capital Connect) at Moorgate (not sure if this is a barrier-free interchange; I'm just guessing).

Can anybody confirm? I am going to be moving to London in the next couple of months so will probably start to become interested in this sort of thing...

Yes I think the NR platforms at Moorgate are within in the tube barriers. But anyone looking at only a tube map would probably travel via Oxford Circus, or maybe Bank and Kings Cross.

No offence to the OP but this post shows that many people don't even know how much their regular journey should cost, so it's quite possible that people may not know the Overground is faster and take the tube through Z1. Actually it may be faster to go via Whitechapel at certain times of the day, but I can't be bothered to check.

I think that the default route should be the fastest regardless of whether passing through Z1 involves barriers. But then you have things like West Brompton to H&I which is a Z2 fare even if you take the District and Victoria lines.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The Northern City Line at Moorgate is within the tube barriers; the platforms are directly above the Northern Line platforms, and one exit route takes you past them to get out of the station from the Northern Line.

Highbury and Islington to the West London Line throws up some interesting anomalies because the system will assume you took the direct train. You can get from most of the stations on the WLL to H&I going through zone 1 and without going through a gateline, but because you can't touch a pink reader on a direct train it'll assume you didn't go via zone 1.

I guess this shows why using the pink readers is generally a good idea.

 

[bicbasher]

Clapham Junction to H&I is another one which is a Z2 fare assuming travel is via the WLL, where as it's possible to use the SLL/ELL via Shoreditch High Street which is in Zone 1.

Forest Hill to Willesden Junction is a z2-3 NR fare assuming the passenger is using the Outer SLL and WLL rather than the ELL, Jubilee and Bakerloo, touch the pink reader at Canada Water and you'll be charged the Zone 1-3 TfL fare.

 

[MikeWh]

Forest Hill to Willesden Junction is a z2-3 NR fare assuming the passenger is using the Outer SLL and WLL rather than the ELL, Jubilee and Bakerloo, touch the pink reader at Canada Water and you'll be charged the Zone 1-3 TfL fare.

It's not the touch at Canada Water that triggers the zone 1 fare, it's changing to Overground at Euston or West Hampstead. If you did Jubilee followed by Bakerloo changing at either Waterloo or Baker Street then it would still be a z2-3 fare.

 

[duncanp]

There are other anomalies

I once went from Fenchurch Street (Zone 1) to Blackhorse Road (Zone 3), changing from C2C to the Overground at Barking . (Zone 4)

I had a Zones 1 - 3 travelcard loaded on to Oyster, as well as a non zero PAYG balance, and touched in at Fenchurch Street and out at Blackhorse Road as normal.

Yet nothing was deducted from the PAYG balance despite the fact that I travelled outside the zones on my travelcard.

Does the system assume a different route for this journey and if so what route?

Are there pink readers at Barking that you should touch in order to pay the additional fare, and if not what would happen if your ticket was checked

 

[Be3G]

I once went from Fenchurch Street (Zone 1) to Blackhorse Road (Zone 3), changing from C2C to the Overground at Barking . (Zone 4)

I had a Zones 1 - 3 travelcard loaded on to Oyster, as well as a non zero PAYG balance, and touched in at Fenchurch Street and out at Blackhorse Road as normal.

Yet nothing was deducted from the PAYG balance despite the fact that I travelled outside the zones on my travelcard.

Now that is interesting, because there is no fare defined from Fenchurch Street to Blackhorse Road – I've often wondered what the Oyster would do in such situations. So it seems that in your case, because both the origin and the destination were within your season ticket's zones, it decided to do nothing. I wonder what it would have charged had you not had the travelcard, though.

 

[yorkie]

There are other anomalies

I once went from Fenchurch Street (Zone 1) to Blackhorse Road (Zone 3), changing from C2C to the Overground at Barking . (Zone 4)

I had a Zones 1 - 3 travelcard loaded on to Oyster, as well as a non zero PAYG balance, and touched in at Fenchurch Street and out at Blackhorse Road as normal.

Yet nothing was deducted from the PAYG balance despite the fact that I travelled outside the zones on my travelcard.

Does the system assume a different route for this journey and if so what route?

Are there pink readers at Barking that you should touch in order to pay the additional fare, and if not what would happen if your ticket was checked

See Single Fare Finder. It says 'No fares were found for that journey'.

I am unsure what would happen to a PAYG user who did that - possibly 2x maximum fares.

But for a Z1-3 Travelcard holder, there is no charge.

Providing you touch in/out at your origin & destination, and providing you have sufficient PAYG balance to cover any charges, you are travelling legitmately.

There are many journeys where you will not be charged and providing you are demonstrating a willingness to pay any charges, you are doing nothing wrong. It's up to the system to charge you when appropriate.
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Now that is interesting, because there is no fare defined from Fenchurch Street to Blackhorse Road – I've often wondered what the Oyster would do in such situations. So it seems that in your case, because both the origin and the destination were within your season ticket's zones, it decided to do nothing. I wonder what it would have charged had you not had the travelcard, though.

I see you had the same thoughts as me

 

[duncanp]

Ssssshhhhh!!!!!

Don't tell anyone then, as Fenchurch Street to Blackhorse Road via Barking is a convenient route for me to get home after an evening spent in the pubs in that part of the City. Much easier than staggering back to Liverpool Street.

 

[bicbasher]

It's not the touch at Canada Water that triggers the zone 1 fare, it's changing to Overground at Euston or West Hampstead. If you did Jubilee followed by Bakerloo changing at either Waterloo or Baker Street then it would still be a z2-3 fare.

Thanks for the clarification Mike. The non Zone 1 fare also works for all stations on the DC line to Watford Junction north of Willesden Junction.

 

[MikeWh]

Are there pink readers at Barking that you should touch in order to pay the additional fare, and if not what would happen if your ticket was checked

No. Pink Readers only reduce the fare, otherwise people would ignore them. As long as you had some PAYG balance you would be fine if checked in zone 4.

 

[bb21]

Oyster does "join" up journeys depending on the touches en route, but I am in no way offering assurances that this happens all the time.

Looking at my journey history, I have one which involved Victoria [NR] - Lewisham [NR] - OSI - Lewisham [DLR] - Fenchurch Street [NR]. Now this journey in its entirety returns no fares according to the Single Fare Finder, however the component parts to and from Lewisham both have fares, so the system joined them together and charged me one Zones 1-2 single fare.

 

[MikeWh]

Oyster does "join" up journeys depending on the touches en route, but I am in no way offering assurances that this happens all the time.

Looking at my journey history, I have one which involved Victoria [NR] - Lewisham [NR] - OSI - Lewisham [DLR] - Fenchurch Street [NR]. Now this journey in its entirety returns no fares according to the Single Fare Finder, however the component parts to and from Lewisham both have fares, so the system joined them together and charged me one Zones 1-2 single fare.

Interesting. Was it TfL (£2.80/£2.10), NR (£2.40/£1.90) or Mixed (£3.90/£3.30).

 

[zinger549]

Thanks for your help.

 

[bb21]

Interesting. Was it TfL (£2.80/£2.10), NR (£2.40/£1.90) or Mixed (£3.90/£3.30).

I will double-check when I get back home later. It was from last year, and iirc it was mixed mode.

 

[duncanp]

Now that is interesting, because there is no fare defined from Fenchurch Street to Blackhorse Road – I've often wondered what the Oyster would do in such situations. So it seems that in your case, because both the origin and the destination were within your season ticket's zones, it decided to do nothing. I wonder what it would have charged had you not had the travelcard, though.

Had a look on one of the train booking sites, and there is a cash fare of £5.50 for Fenchurch Street to Blackhorse Road via Barking. (

Also there is an Oyster single of £1.60/£1.50 peak/off peak for the section of the journey which is in Zone 4 (East Ham to Woodgrange Park)

But then if there is no Oyster single fare from Fenchurch Street to Blackhorse Road, then the system can't be configured to assume which route you have taken. Or maybe it assumes you go Fenchurch Street - West Ham - Stratford - Tottenham Hale - Blackhorse Road, although why anyone would go via that route is beyond me.

Are there any other examples of where a cash fare exists for a journey, but no Oyster fare?

 

[greatkingrat]

Had a look on one of the train booking sites, and there is a cash fare of £5.50 for Fenchurch Street to Blackhorse Road via Barking. (

I believe that ticket would actually be a London Terminals - Zone U1234 ticket and is not specific to that journey.