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Qualified Drivers Southeastern - All Depots
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SlimJim1694
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You can transfer internally but makes it harder to get a job at another TOC. It only seems to be the freight that don't seem to care too much about incidents. Sought after TOCs will use safety records to whittle down the applicants. They don't clear... They stay forever and follow you around!
Yes newly qualified drivers sign Vic-Canterbury West/Vic-Faversham.
You would think so. Not sure if I'm suppose to put exact figures but the difference in pay between SE and ARL is about £175. Is that worth the extra intensity? I don't know that's a different argument lol.
SE ain't that bad and as 43066 mentioned if you're wedded to that part of town then it's a decent choice.
I must be missing something here.
SE pay including London weighting is circa. £55k. ARL is circa. £63k?
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Should be more like £450 more every four weeks according to the above (which tends to be accurate to within a few pence in my experience).
Might be worth checking your tax code, or do you have student loan repayments?
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If you only count the base salary
ARL
£ 64,435 Per year
£ 4,956.54 4 Weekly
£ 3,539.42 Take home (after tax and NI)
SE
£ 54,575 Per year
£ 4,198.08 4 Weekly
£ 3,099.51 Take home (after tax and NI)
Which puts ARL +£439.91
If you include SE's London Allowance (Not sure how this is done at ARL) of £2070 per annum
£ 56,645 Per year
£ 4,357.31 4 Weekly
£ 3,191.86 Take home (after tax and NI)
Which puts ARL +£347.56
Southeastern's London Allowance is tiered. They have 'Inner' 'Outer' and 'none' You also need to factor in pension contributions too. As already highlighted, you also factor in other benefits too. SE seem to scrim on that front too. Side by side both ARL and GTR offer better travel facilities too.
ARL
£ 64,435 Per year
£ 4,956.54 4 Weekly
£ 3,539.42 Take home (after tax and NI)
SE
£ 54,575 Per year
£ 4,198.08 4 Weekly
£ 3,099.51 Take home (after tax and NI)
Which puts ARL +£439.91
If you include SE's London Allowance (Not sure how this is done at ARL) of £2070 per annum
£ 56,645 Per year
£ 4,357.31 4 Weekly
£ 3,191.86 Take home (after tax and NI)
Which puts ARL +£347.56
Southeastern's London Allowance is tiered. They have 'Inner' 'Outer' and 'none' You also need to factor in pension contributions too. As already highlighted, you also factor in other benefits too. SE seem to scrim on that front too. Side by side both ARL and GTR offer better travel facilities too.
Looks like ASLEF Company Info needs updating. I wonder why it's usually behind, are they worried that the s*n is going to have a slow news day and do another article about driver salaries?
I know of one fellow who had pretty much one of everything and was fairly new, he got an interview with TPE but not an offer.
I know of one fellow who had pretty much one of everything and was fairly new, he got an interview with TPE but not an offer.
Isn't that Orpington to Charing X job one of the weird fast services in the peak? Or even worse, via Lewisham?
AL unless its a booked RD I believe.
SE pension contribution is Circa £232.08. For both you need to take off pension contributions and add in some of the more technical stuff but essentially ARL base salary vs base salary and ARL comes out on top by a significant margin. Pension contributions are also based on a % so typically the more you earn, the more you pay.
Not sure what the rest day payments are or any details of Pension AVCs or share schemes, vouchers etc. SE pay deal is due (LOL) but no clue on ARL but I know a couple of guys at New Cross depot who recently come across from SE.
SlimJim1694
Member
Its this one. Class 3 empties.
Realtime Trains - 3F92 1657 Orpington Down Sdgs to London Charing Cross
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Its this one. Class 3 empties.
Realtime Trains - 3F92 1657 Orpington Down Sdgs to London Charing Cross
Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.
Ah thought it was the service that sits on P1 all day, that might be later.
Memories.
Isn't that an Orpington turn ? You're ex Orpy ?
The 376 that sits there most of the day and is then fast to LBG?
Memories
That's the one, can't remember what it forms up at CHX
P4 then Ch+ - Dartford skipping Lewisham?
Nope. I just like trains.
Friend of a friend works at Orpy. He doesn’t like it and he’s digging a tunnel
.Jimbo12345
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Is it final salary pension?
peakNed
Member
You like trains? That’s not what you told me...Nope. I just like trains.
Friend of a friend works at Orpy. He doesn’t like it and he’s digging a tunnel
JammyJames08
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What is the new establishment at Orpington these days after everything was sorted out? the advert is still there!
So if the salary and work aren't particularly desirable in comparision to other TOCs in the region and Southeastern aren't prepared to change their payscales, is there anything they can do work/life balance wise to compensate and encourage drivers to move. More part time driver roles possibly, or a choice of shift patterns ie permanent earlies/lates, the more traditional week of earlies, week of lates, continental shift pattern where your 1st shift is an early and as the week progresses your shift start time gets later. Any other suggestions?
Edited to add removing rostered leave and implementing a computer system to book annual leave.
Edited to add removing rostered leave and implementing a computer system to book annual leave.
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Orpington is now just metro work with all their mainline work taken away I believe.
The advert will be up for a while, there’s no closing date.
Those are all good suggestions, to be fair, although rostered leave can be a blessing as much as it is a curse: ad hoc leave is also available.
My mate who works there quite likes the Orpington rostering. It can be described as “little and often”: no single rest days, no more than four days working in a row.
Then again there’s no regular five day “long weekend” which wouldn’t suit some people.
Permanent earlier/lates can be accommodated through mutual swaps. It would be difficult to hire drivers on the basis of permanent earlies/lates because earlies are always more popular.
The last true mainline work they had was Tunbridge Wells and they lost that a few years back. IIRC Orpington don’t sign 375/377s, and those started being used on Tunbridge Wells services interchangeably with Networkers, so that work was divvied out between Tonbridge and Ch+ who sign all the traction. Orpington were given more metro Networker work in its place.
The Thameslink work they had was all-shacks, mostly death by Catford Loop! It was still a lot better than the SE metro work, with longer breaks etc.
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I think it’s a good idea in principle, but doesn’t seem to have been adopted by many TOCs (or, perhaps more relevantly, by ASLEF who draw up the rosters to cover the required work).
I suspect the reason is that it’s simply too difficult to accommodate: at a commuter TOC like SE you’ll always need *a lot* of drivers starting at stupid o’clock to cover the AM peak, and *a lot* of drivers booking on in the afternoon to cover the PM peak and late evening. The service is intense from 0500ish until 2400, and trains need to be taken out and put away earlier/later than these times.
You’re left with relatively few all day “office hours” shifts which tend not to be popular. Lates are by far the least popular shifts. If you had large contingents of drivers who would only work earlies/lates etc. it would become impossible to manage.
At the end of the day people coming onto the job need to accept it’s a 24 hour railway these days and you need to be prepared to do your share if you can’t make other arrangements. Unfortunately that’s just the nature of the job (as I type this, I just got home from work
). The other issue at SE is that it’s fairly stuck in its ways. Places like Crossrail seemed to promote flexible working/job shares etc. - although how true any of that was I’m not sure.
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Issue with that is the other nearby TOCs do all have some schemes like that. Most people - rightly or wrongly - go for the money followed by the roster, routes and commute. The first is poor under SE, 2nd depends on your depot, the 3rd is not great either (although the competitors are also all DOO metro-style services), and lastly most depots are within spitting distance for comparable TOCs.
Not saying that more can't be done and the ideas are sensible but for qualified drivers, I can't imagine many will be incentivised enough to switch for the reasons you mention.
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