Railcard Prices

[redreni]

With the shift towards leisure traffic post pandemic and leveling up if i was Mr Dft Id be looking at phasing out railcards, maybe 20% discount next year, 0% year after.

If I were a policy official working at DfT I would not relish having to do an Equality Impact Assessment on that proposal.

 

[The Quincunx]

ENCTS cards, and the Welsh and Scottish equivalents, should double as railcards.

A very unsuccessful trial allowing this was carried out about 10-12 years ago. Some Railcards (including the Senior) would extract revenue if it was not for the cost of the Railcard itself.

 

[m00036]

Tesco does some kind of offer if you purchase with club card points - of which I have none.

Unfortunately I already hold a student bank account with another provider, so would need to close this before taking advantage of the Santander offer.

It's not a rail-related answer but there is a misconception that a person cannot have multiple student bank accounts. That's not true, albeit a number of banks do say you can't have a student account with another bank. It's worth checking the small print!

 

[800Travel]

It's not a rail-related answer but there is a misconception that a person cannot have multiple student bank accounts. That's not true, albeit a number of banks do say you can't have a student account with another bank. It's worth checking the small print!

The provider I have mine with have that small print unfortunately

 

[Watershed]

The provider I have mine with have that small print unfortunately

There's no way they can really enforce that, short of a periodic pay-in requirement which can be circumvented by circular transfers between accounts! The Santander account also offers a more generous 0% overdraft than most other student accounts, so even if for whatever your old account were to be closed it would hardly be much of a hardship.

 

[CyrusWuff]

A very unsuccessful trial allowing this was carried out about 10-12 years ago. Some Railcards (including the Senior) would extract revenue if it was not for the cost of the Railcard itself.

Someone should tell GWR then, as they're still offering the discount.

That said, it hasn't been expanded beyond the original two routes, namely between Weymouth and Westbury and all stations inclusive (including Dorchester South); and between Swindon and Worcester Foregate Street via Stroud and all stations inclusive.

Relevant pseudo-Railcard code is ENC.

 

[sprunt]

With the shift towards leisure traffic post pandemic and leveling up if i was Mr Dft Id be looking at phasing out railcards, maybe 20% discount next year, 0% year after.

That sounds more like levelling down than levelling up.

 

[A S Leib]

That sounds more like levelling down than levelling up.

I'm not advocating scrapping railcards, but when the greater southeast has one available to anybody and outside that they're limited to residents living in certain areas (e.g. the Dales one for the Bentham / Settle and Carlisle lines, which I think is only purchasable with some North Yorkshire, Cumbria and Lancashire postcodes) the current situation doesn't really promote levelling up either.

(Converseley, fares are sometimes cheaper on rural areas; the price for a day return from Pwllheli to Shrewsbury isn't enough to get from Paddington to Didcot and back.)

 

[Wolfie]

If I were a policy official working at DfT I would not relish having to do an Equality Impact Assessment on that proposal.

As a current (not for much longer though!) policy official, albeit in a different Government department, l absolutely agree.

How could abolishing the Disabled Railcard not adversely impact on that protected group for example....

 

[Sonic1234]

Three of the Railcards (aka "discount fare schemes") are mandated in s28 of the Railways Act 1993 - enabling '... persons who are young (i.e. Young Persons), elderly (i.e. Senior) or disabled to travel by railway at discounted fares'.

Does this specify what the discount level has to be?

I get the impression the railway wants people to have railcards. They're advertised online, every other poster at stations is a railcard one, there's an app, online ordering, offered by 3rd party retailers, partnerships with Tesco, on cashback sites etc. Although the railway has to offer railcards, if it didn't provide any advantage in terms of getting people on trains it would have been relegated to a hard-to-find page on NRE and a postal application form (printer required, to make it extra hard).

 

[Benjwri]

With the shift towards leisure traffic post pandemic and leveling up if i was Mr Dft Id be looking at phasing out railcards, maybe 20% discount next year, 0% year after.

Why? Railcards help millions of people afford train travel, in groups which might typically struggle to afford it otherwise, and promote loyalty to the railway. As a student my railcard goes a huge way in allowing me to afford travel by train, when I otherwise might not travel, I know it is the same for many people I know. Having a car for personal reasons, it is also what makes it more economical to take the train home than drive.

Not to mention removing them would be political suicide. Can you imagine the absolute field day the newspapers would have with what would be effectively a 50% fare increase for those who are typically the poorest groups in the country (Young, disabled etc). A headline like that would be on the front page of every news site in the country by the end of the day.

 

[scrapy]

I think the most likely change to the senior railcard would be introducing minimum fare restrictions outside the south east, in line with other age dependent railcards. As retirement ages get higher they will be used more and more for commuting.

 

[800Travel]

I think the most likely change to the senior railcard would be introducing minimum fare restrictions outside the south east, in line with other age dependent railcards. As retirement ages get higher they will be used more and more for commuting.

The 16-25 min fare is a right faff - I’d hope they removed it for everyone rather than burdening seniors with it too - but I get this is unlikely.

 

[Benjwri]

The 16-25 min fare is a right faff - I’d hope they removed it for everyone rather than burdening seniors with it too - but I get this is unlikely.

Even if they just tidied up the rules it would be better, right now it is a confusing mess, I know a concerning amount of people who haven't understood the restriction, and have bought a ticket which seems to be able to be used before 10, and then got fined. ORR should really force all retailers to display a warning that a ticket someone is buying can't be used then, or similar.

 

[800Travel]

Even if they just tidied up the rules it would be better, right now it is a confusing mess, I know a concerning amount of people who haven't understood the restriction, and have bought a ticket which seems to be able to be used before 10, and then got fined. ORR should really force all retailers to display a warning that a ticket someone is buying can't be used then, or similar.

Something I'm not clear on too, the minimum fare before 10:00 Mon-Fri etc. is £12. Is this the price prior to discount, or the price after discount? I.e. If the ticket cost £12, could the card holder get a £4 discount to bring it to £8 or would it need to remain at £12? I know that if it cost £30 for example, you could get £10 off and have it at £20.

 

[Benjwri]

Something I'm not clear on too, the minimum fare before 10:00 Mon-Fri etc. is £12. Is this the price prior to discount, or the price after discount? I.e. If the ticket cost £12, could the card holder get a £4 discount to bring it to £8 or would it need to remain at £12? I know that if it cost £30 for example, you could get £10 off and have it at £20.

Minimum fare is £12 after discount. If a fare would be above £12 after discount, you get it for £12 (Anything above £18 undiscounted will have a normal discount), if it would be less then £12 discounted, but costs more than £12 undiscounted, the discounted price will be £12 (Any ticket costing between £12 and £18 will cost £12 before 10am), if the ticket is less than £12 undiscounted, you get the undiscounted price. (Anything costing less than £12 costs its undiscounted price before 10am)

 

[bakerstreet]

Some Railcards have already suffered significant diminution.

Of course the minimum fare for the Network Card is one.

In the early days of the senior Railcard, certain discounts were 50%.
50%!
That would be nice.

 

[Haywain]

In the early days of the senior Railcard, certain discounts were 50%.

As was the case in the early days of the (then) Student Railcard.

 

[JonathanH]

The 16-25 min fare is a right faff - I’d hope they removed it for everyone rather than burdening seniors with it too - but I get this is unlikely.

The £12 minimum fare is a brilliant piece of design. It prevents the railcard from being used for short distance commuting, such as to college, where the railway has a revenue stream to protect, but allows people in the age group to make discounted journeys over a longer distance, where those people may otherwise not choose to use the railway.

 

[Joe Paxton]

Some Railcards have already suffered significant diminution.

Of course the minimum fare for the Network Card is one.
[...]

Though the Network Railcard's minimum fare has stayed set at £13 since 2009 (beforehand it was £10), which isn't bad.

 

[800Travel]

The £12 minimum fare is a brilliant piece of design. It prevents the railcard from being used for short distance commuting, such as to college, where the railway has a revenue stream to protect, but allows people in the age group to make discounted journeys over a longer distance, where those people may otherwise not choose to use the railway.

Problem is I don’t really go anywhere by train other than my short distance commute

 

[Watershed]

The £12 minimum fare is a brilliant piece of design. It prevents the railcard from being used for short distance commuting, such as to college, where the railway has a revenue stream to protect, but allows people in the age group to make discounted journeys over a longer distance, where those people may otherwise not choose to use the railway.

It's effective at the intended purpose but I wouldn't in any way call it a brilliant piece of design - it deprives a lot of young people of any discount for their commute. Having cheaper season tickets for young people is commonplace in a lot of countries.

 

[A S Leib]

It's effective at the intended purpose but I wouldn't in any way call it a brilliant piece of design - it deprives a lot of young people of any discount for their commute. Having cheaper season tickets for young people is commonplace in a lot of countries.

I know that London Northwestern (and presumably West Midlands Railway) has student-specific term-length season tickets: do any other TOCs?

 

[Hadders]

I think the most likely change to the senior railcard would be introducing minimum fare restrictions outside the south east, in line with other age dependent railcards. As retirement ages get higher they will be used more and more for commuting.

The Senior Railcard doesn't have any minimum fare requirement. For journeys wholly outside the Network Railcard area discount can be obtained anytime.

 

[Mark J]

I know that rail fares are going up in March. I’ve not seen anything about the cost of railcards increasing, but is this something that may happen too please? I think as they’ve been at £30 for so long, this is a possibility but have nothing to support my theory so was wondering if anyone was aware of any upcoming changes please. Thank you

I still think it is a bit unfair that the Network Railcard is priced the same as other Railcards - that offer Nationwide travel and other perks, such as 1st Class tickets.

If anything, it should be priced slightly lower.

Not everyone in the 30 - 60 bracket is well off!

A well paid graduate can get a 26-30 railcard, yet a 30-60 year old on minimum wage can only get a Network Railcard.

I still remember when there was no minimum fare on the Network Railcard!

 

[800Travel]

I still think it is a bit unfair that the Network Railcard is priced the same as other Railcards - that offer Nationwide travel and other perks, such as 1st Class tickets.

If anything, it should be priced slightly lower.

Not everyone in the 30 - 60 bracket is well off!

A well paid graduate can get a 26-30 railcard, yet a 30-60 year old on minimum wage can only get a Network Railcard.

Re 1st class tickets - seems 16-25 can only get discount on advance first class.

This seems incorrect to me as it isn't in line with the National Rail site which states 16-25 are eligible for discount on both anytime and off-peak first class tickets.

Anyone got any ideas as to why this is please?

(The screenshots are of an example journey put into the LNER booking site to demonstrate flexible first class tickets cost the same with or without 16-25 railcard)

 

[CyrusWuff]

Re 1st class tickets - seems 16-25 can only get discount on advance first class.

Correct, and that's been the case for as long as I can remember.

This seems incorrect to me as it isn't in line with the National Rail site which states 16-25 are eligible for discount on both anytime and off-peak first class tickets.

Not sure where you're seeing that as the Railcards page on NRE just links to the relevant Railcard site.

The Using your Railcard page on the 16-25 Railcard site makes it clear that it's only valid for Advances in First Class.

 

[Joe Paxton]

Re 1st class tickets - seems 16-25 can only get discount on advance first class.

This seems incorrect to me as it isn't in line with the National Rail site which states 16-25 are eligible for discount on both anytime and off-peak first class tickets.

Where are you seeing that on the National Rail site?

Because 16-25 Railcards do not offer a discount for First Class fares, except for Advance tickets.

 

[800Travel]

Correct, and that's been the case for as long as I can remember.


Not sure where you're seeing that as the Railcards page on NRE just links to the relevant Railcard site.

The Using your Railcard page on the 16-25 Railcard site makes it clear that it's only valid for Advances in First Class.

Where are you seeing that on the National Rail site?

Because 16-25 Railcards do not offer a discount for First Class fares, except for Advance tickets.

@CyrusWuff @Joe Paxton

Anytime Tickets | National Rail

Buy your train ticket at any time and travel whenever you want with an Anytime ticket – they are fully flexible, with no time restrictions on when you can travel

www.nationalrail.co.uk

• If you have a 16-25, Senior, Two Together, HM Forces, Veterans or Disabled Persons Railcard, you can also get 1/3 off First Class Anytime fares

Off-Peak and Super Off-Peak Tickets | National Rail

Buy your train ticket at any time and travel in off-peak hours with an Off-Peak or Super Off-Peak ticket

www.nationalrail.co.uk

• If you have a 16-25, Senior, Two Together, HM Forces, Veterans or Disabled Persons Railcard, you can also get 1/3 off First Class Off-Peak and Super Off-Peak fares

(Both links are to ticket type information on the national rail website)

 

[CyrusWuff]

They've made a right dogs dinner of that! If you click through to the Terms and Conditions pages for each it correctly states that a discount is only available in Standard with a 16-25 Railcard.

Anytime Tickets
Off-Peak and Super Off-Peak Tickets