Regular Double Headers

Discussion in 'Railway History & Nostalgia' started by curlcurlimp, 20 Sep 2019.

  1. JohnMcL7

    JohnMcL7 Member

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    It's a single 67 at the moment but will return to double heading with a pair of 73's when the mk5's are deployed to the Highlander. I'm not sure about the Aberdeen/Fort William portions which are currently using 73's and although the plan is just one 73 for these routes I've seen quite a few pictures of them double heading.
     
  2. curlcurlimp

    curlcurlimp Member

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    I always assumed that the 'master and slave' were one loco.
     
  3. BRX

    BRX Established Member

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    If push pulls count, we're going to have to include HSTs!
     
  4. vidal

    vidal Member

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    Regular workings of 2 (usually Cricklewood) 25's on the Fletliner to ?Allerton.

    James
     
  5. 33017

    33017 Member

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    Off the top of my head 803/804/807/808/819/822-829/831/832 & 866-870 were the loco’s involved.
     
  6. Czesziafan

    Czesziafan Member

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    In 1975/6 1M10 06.45 Paddington - Birmingham New St and 10.25 return was a regular 2 x 31 working. I seem to remember the WR 31's had a high failure rate and Control rostered a pair for this working in case one of them failed en route.
     
  7. Scotrail84

    Scotrail84 Established Member

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    That might not actually be the case. The 67 might be retained doubled with a 73 that will provide ETH only, 2 x 73's may not be able to haul a load 8 up the gradients, especially if one fails en route.
     
  8. xotGD

    xotGD Established Member

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    A few more...

    The southbound Scottish internal overnight used to be double headed between Perth and Stirling. Northbound the Glasgow and Edinburgh portions joined at Perth but southbound they split at Stirling, so this avoided a light engine move. I once had a 40 + 47 combo on this.

    The Euston - Stranraer overnight used to get a 20 attached to the front of the 47 at Ayr to assist over the hills. The 20 then headed the 47 on the first morning Glasgow service to get it back to Ayr.

    Similarly, when the Bristol - Glasgow overnight was diverted via Worcester on a Saturday night, a 37 would pair up with the train engine from Worcester to New St.

    Steel trains from Teesside to Workington used to be hauled by pairs of 37s.

    The Cardiff - Edinburgh 'Principality' was booked for a pair of 50s to New St on Saturdays for a time in the late 80s. Sometimes turned up with just one on the front however.
     
  9. Lucan

    Lucan Member

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    So, dumb question, did these double headers have a crew in each cab, or was the second loco remote controlled?
     
  10. Cowley

    Cowley Established Member

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    It would depend on whether they had multiple working equipment. For instance on the 33 here it shows that the loco is fitted with blue star multiple working equipment:
    0BD88241-8C39-4B17-ADE8-24069F568FD4.jpeg
    Which means in theory it could work in multiple (with just one driver controlling them) any other class that was so fitted - so at least classes 20,24,25,26,27,31,33,37 etc.
    Blue star was the most common, but there were others as well. For instance class 50s had orange square MW, but could only work with each other.
    Generally in the past classes 45 and 47 couldn’t work in multiple so would require two sets of crew.
     
  11. Ken H

    Ken H Established Member

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    Locos could operate in multiple with locos with the same multiple code.
    In this image of a Cl31 you can see the blue star on the yellow bit
    [​IMG]
    So that Cl 31 could operate with any other loco with blue star. (Some Cl31's were not blue star - the 'toffee apples were not)
    Obviously, consideration had to be made about whether the locos and train were vacuum or air braked, and whether the loco nearest the train had ETH provision.

    If there is no multiple provision, then you need a driver in each loco. That is operating in tandem.

    More here on Wiki
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiple_working

    Cl47 and Cl55 were not multiple equipped as new, But some Cl47's did receive MU later

    Some data in the linky about EMU and DMUs too.
     
  12. xotGD

    xotGD Established Member

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    Just to add that the 31/0 'Toffee Apples' were so nicknamed because of their red circle multiple working code.
     
  13. Cowley

    Cowley Established Member

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    I thought it was something to do with the control key that had to be inserted in either end upon changing direction?
    I can’t find a picture of one now though.
     
  14. randyrippley

    randyrippley Established Member

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    As built, the Peaks and 40s were Blue Star as well
    As far as I can remember the 47s were the first not to have multiple jumpers of some kind
     
  15. randyrippley

    randyrippley Established Member

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    thats certainly the story reported online
     
  16. billio

    billio Member

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    I am not exactly sure of the date, but probably in the mid to late 80's, but the 8-00am-ish Oxford- Paddington, ex-Hereford was sometimes hauled by a pair of 31s. One day I remember they were even triple-heading the train. And on another day, the trailing engine entered the station on fire !.
     
  17. Cowley

    Cowley Established Member

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    I was thinking this too. I’ve seen class 40/25 pairings in pictures before (I think at least one such pair made it to Exeter Riverside on oil tanks in the eighties). But the Peaks must have had their equipment removed quite early on. Why was that then I wonder?
     
  18. randyrippley

    randyrippley Established Member

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    for the same reason as the Westerns and 47s never had MU fitted - no-one could envisage trains heavy enough to need two 2500+bhp locos. The parts were better used as spares elsewhere
     
  19. Cowley

    Cowley Established Member

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    I guess so. When the more powerful 56s came along in the seventies they had MU equipment fitted from new, but then it’s understandable with them because of what they were designed to do.
    I don’t think I’ve ever seen a picture of any variety of Peak actually working in multiple apart from possibly 97403 being paired up with the class 24 - 97201, although I seem to remember that 45s were rostered as a tandem pair on a Midland mainline turn at some point back in those days.
     
  20. 33017

    33017 Member

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    Not quite. Westerns were the first production mainline diesels without multiple working, D1000 entering traffic 9 months before D1500.

    EDIT: forgot about Deltics - into traffic 10 months earlier than D1000.
     
    Last edited: 30 Sep 2019
  21. xotGD

    xotGD Established Member

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    Looks like I've been spreading fake news!
     
  22. d9009alycidon

    d9009alycidon Member

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    The original diesel iron ore trains were 2 x 20 from General Terminus Quay to Ravenscraig but the introducation of the big Bogie tipplers brought about a change to 2 x 37 with a class 20 banker added at Rosehall junction in Coatbridge, this changed after a derailment on the curve from Mossend North to Mossend East where (I am told) there was a lack of communication between the lead locos and thee banker and the 37s slowed and the 20 kept pushing causing the tipplers to get spread out all over the curve. The 20 was then added to the front at Mossend and this was then changed to 3 x 37 from Mossend until the 60s arrived and they managed the run single handed
     
  23. Ken H

    Ken H Established Member

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    Thought it was the power handle with a big round knob on the end. Like a toffee-apple
     
  24. alistairlees

    alistairlees Established Member

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    I think that’s correct.
     
  25. Altfish

    Altfish Member

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    Most (all?) class 86 freight workings seem to be double headed
     
  26. Ken H

    Ken H Established Member

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    is that a power thing or an adhesion thing?
     
  27. delt1c

    delt1c Established Member

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    Read somewhere it is a reliability thing
     
  28. curlcurlimp

    curlcurlimp Member

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    I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the double headed MetroVick 'Condor' express freight services between Hendon and Glasgow. Cricklewood had a fleet of seven of the above to run the service.
     
  29. Bevan Price

    Bevan Price Established Member

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    There are a few occasional single 86 liner workings, but excluding any trains going over Shap or Beattock unless the train load is unusually light.
     
  30. Mavira_John

    Mavira_John New Member

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    Despite requiring time-consuming shunting operations each time an engine had to be added or removed to a train this arrangement remained in place on parts of the GWR until nationalisation in 1948.
     

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