Riding Non Passenger Trains

[Carbean]

Part of the fabric and romance of American Railways is the hobo/drifter who rode freight trains to travel around the US (Tom Jones sang of "Riding a Freight Train North to Detroit City"). I know distances in the USA are much greater than here and many lines there do not have a passenger service to speak of compared with this country. Has there ever been a tradition in this country of riding non-passenger trains to get around?

 

[weepingwillowb]

Early morning newspaper trains.

 

[Dr_Paul]

An interesting question! I've read many books and articles of railways in Britain over several decades and have also listened to quite a bit of English folk music, but I've not yet come across any references to people using goods trains to travel around the country.

 

[QJ]

Up until the demise of the brake van on freight trains in the 1980s it was possible to pay a fee to travel on those trains (though sometimes a friendly train crew invitation bypassed the official permissions). I enjoyed travelling to various places around the country by brake van (or loco cab when the BV was not available). I managed to get to Ayr Harbour, Waterside, Killoch Colliery, Barony Colliery, Burn Naze, Padiham, Preston Docks, Cwmmawr, Wenford Bridge to name but a few places.

On one occasion I travelled from Newton on Ayr to Townhill in a BV attached to an MGR bound for Longannet. Pair of Ayr based class 20s (hence the BV) to Cadder where they were swapped for a Haymarket pair of 20s for the journey over the Forth Bridge.

 

[Gloster]

Casual travel by non-passenger trains was rare, although when it did happen it was most likely to be on a parcels or newspaper train; travel on postal services was much less common to avoid the possibility of someone stopping it where a group of men armed with staves were waiting. Staff and families of staff, particularly in remote areas, could use non-passenger services, although the latter often on a specific day to go shopping. In some cases when camping coaches were located on goods only lines, the campers could use the goods to reach it. And there were always cases on BR where somebody was put on a loco or in a van because they had missed their connection: officially not permitted, but blind eyes were turned all the way up if the reason was good enough.

 

[Rescars]

David Smith, in his Tales of the GSWR, recounts the story of a driver going "outside" after dark one evening to check over his engine and finding a tramp IIRC lurking on the front buffer beam. He returned to the cab with this unexpected visitor, much to the surprise and alarm of his fireman! I do not have ready access to my copy just now to check the details, but even in the relaxed world of the GSWR this seems to have been a one-off event.

 

[QJ]

---

A selection of tickets I obtained for riding freight trains.

 

[yorksrob]

I had no idea people could do this !

 

[RT4038]

I had no idea people could do this !

In the book 'The Nostalgia of Steam' by John Spencer Gilkes, Chapter 9, gives some details of this and his exploits. Not sure how widespread this was?

 

[yorksrob]

In the book 'The Nostalgia of Steam' by John Spencer Gilkes, Chapter 9, gives some details of this and his exploits. Not sure how widespread this was?

Shame some sort of a similar system isn't available today. Elf'n'Safety would have palpitations

 

[08221]

Back in the early 80’s, my friend and I were heading from Bletchley to Crewe for a days spotting.
A class 304 came into Bletchley from the north (that was quite rare at those times!). My mate knew the driver and we got a ride back to Rugby on the ECS, bouncing up the Northampton avoider has always stuck in my memory!

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Illegal reading often results in severe injuries or worse - but I recall a very frozen gentleman who climbed onto the Newcastle - Cardiff freightliner at Gloucester and was removed (to hospital) on arrival , (he boarded a keg "beer" loaded S&N open container) , plus a reported pair of thieves who got onto a Dagenham - Wakefield car traffic at Finsbury Park was were again removed at Doncaster.

A particularly ill advised one who got onto a Motherwell - Cardiff loaded steel ingot train , the cargo of which was loaded onto solid metal trestle wagons , straight out of the blast furnace. The melted snow should have been a giveaway.

 

[ian1944]

Not quite in the spirit of the original question, but I did some riding around on MGR coal trains in the 60s. Working for the CEGB, I was studying the operation of power station coal plants and thought it a good idea to see the whole process. Completely unknown to BR management, some drivers were quite happy to have a passenger interested in what happened at the colliery and en route to/from the power station. I wasn't aboard at the time, but knew the driver who interpreted the signed 1/2 mph through the tipplers as 1 to 2 mph, so went through at four times the rated speed and wrote off a lot of equipment.

 

[Gloster]

Going back to what I presume is the intention of the original question. One of the differences in this country is that we did not have the long hauls that were common in America: anyone hitching a ride was likely to only get a short distance before being found, after which there was a far greater risk of coming into the hands of the local constabulary. There is also the limited number of suitable wagons about: you can’t shut a van door from the inside (or it will be locked with the hitcher inside), 7- or 8-planks aren’t so easy to climb in and out of, while occupying anything with lower sides is likely to be noticed by signalmen and other staff. The hitcher also has to be able to find out where the wagon is going, otherwise they risk ending up miles from wherever they were heading for.

(I know nothing about US railroads except what I have read in Clive Cussler’s thrillers. I presume that his knowledge of US railroads is slightly better than that of European ones, including the East Coast Main Line.)

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Going back to what I presume is the intention of the original question. One of the differences in this country is that we did not have the long hauls that were common in America: anyone hitching a ride was likely to only get a short distance before being found, after which there was a far greater risk of coming into the hands of the local constabulary. There is also the limited number of suitable wagons about: you can’t shut a van door from the inside (or it will be locked with the hitcher inside), 7- or 8-planks aren’t so easy to climb in and out of, while occupying anything with lower sides is likely to be noticed by signalmen and other staff. The hitcher also has to be able to find out where the wagon is going, otherwise they risk ending up miles from wherever they were heading for.

(I know nothing about US railroads except what I have read in Clive Cussler’s thrillers. I presume that his knowledge of US railroads is slightly better than that of European ones, including the East Coast Main Line.)

Lots of interesting potentials to this thread - talking about 1944 (as found in the local paper archive) - Mr X had an enjoyable evening in Llandeilo and missed the last passenger train - local cops told him where to go so he staggered to the station where he found a slow sheeted freight easing onto the Central Wales line towards Ammanford - his home - so he nipped on board in the blackout.

In those days , staff and signalmen "closely observed" passing trains so "stop and examine" was sent and said freight was stopped and he was taken off at gunpoint , and charged with both treason and sabotage. (it was a load of very special armed vehicles for export to France for the Invasion on something like day"2 + ) - after an uncomfortable time in various non civilian jails he was let go with mere trespass and no ticket charges. He probably came close to execution.........

On a light hearted note - late night at Earle's Court heading home to SW19 - so a posse of drunks on the other platform nipped onto a typical LT engineering train , which had a couple of wagons of sand in the consist. Cue to some LT distress signal on the whistle and a team of "no messing around" gangers come out of the rear battery loco and put them right.

 

[yorksrob]

Lots of interesting potentials to this thread - talking about 1944 (as found in the local paper archive) - Mr X had an enjoyable evening in Llandeilo and missed the last passenger train - local cops told him where to go so he staggered to the station where he found a slow sheeted freight easing onto the Central Wales line towards Ammanford - his home - so he nipped on board in the blackout.

In those days , staff and signalmen "closely observed" passing trains so "stop and examine" was sent and said freight was stopped and he was taken off at gunpoint , and charged with both treason and sabotage. (it was a load of very special armed vehicles for export to France for the Invasion on something like day"2 + ) - after an uncomfortable time in various non civilian jails he was let go with mere trespass and no ticket charges. He probably came close to execution.........

On a light hearted note - late night at Earle's Court heading home to SW19 - so a posse of drunks on the other platform nipped onto a typical LT engineering train , which had a couple of wagons of sand in the consist. Cue to some LT distress signal on the whistle and a team of "no messing around" gangers come out of the rear battery loco and put them right.

That's a bad night out. Hop on a freight train, risk the noose for treason !

 

[ChiefPlanner]

That's a bad night out. Hop on a freight train, risk the noose for treason !

Serious times , serious consequences..........( I dare say the local plod would have put a word into his cause) -

 

[yorksrob]

Serious times , serious consequences..........( I dare say the local plod would have put a word into his cause) -

Indeed. I bet he sobered up pretty sharpish as well !

 

[xotGD]

Arriving back at Newcastle Central after a few pints and seeing a 37 on the vans to Carlisle I was almost tempted into boarding. Maybe a couple more pints and I would have?

 

[WesternLancer]

---

A selection of tickets I obtained for riding freight trains.

superb momentos of a lost facility! Thanks for posting.

 

[robert thomas]

superb momentos of a lost facility! Thanks for posting.

The Highland line from Aviemore to Forres used to have pre printed tickets for passengers to travel by freight train. When I was in university in Manchester 1965-68 the Railway Society used to have a monthly brake van trip.It was organised through the Hunts Bank offices at Victoria and the fare charged was based on mileage at first class rates.We normally had an additional brake van added to the train for our exclusive use.

 

[yorksrob]

And people say that BR wasn't enterprising !

 

[LowLevel]

Not quite the same as the thread but just to show old enterprising ways aren't always lost on two fairly recent occasions I've seen both the police and railway come to the rescue of stranded people.

One was when I was the guard of a train stranded by a fatality. An old dear was at the station with her shopping and was getting a bit distressed as she'd got a load of frozen stuff. The local bobby had been asked to swing by the station in his 4x4 to see that all was well with us, which it was. On being told Doris's plight he piled her and her shopping in to his motor and ran her home

The second was working a working a steam charter we came across someone who had missed the last train due to an amended timetable and couldn't get in to work. We piled her into the brake coach and gave her a hot chocolate too as it was December and rather cold!

 

[WesternLancer]

Not quite the same as the thread but just to show old enterprising ways aren't always lost on two fairly recent occasions I've seen both the police and railway come to the rescue of stranded people.

One was when I was the guard of a train stranded by a fatality. An old dear was at the station with her shopping and was getting a bit distressed as she'd got a load of frozen stuff. The local bobby had been asked to swing by the station in his 4x4 to see that all was well with us, which it was. On being told Doris's plight he piled her and her shopping in to his motor and ran her home

The second was working a working a steam charter we came across someone who had missed the last train due to an amended timetable and couldn't get in to work. We piled her into the brake coach and gave her a hot chocolate too as it was December and rather cold!

Great to read these!

The Highland line from Aviemore to Forres used to have pre printed tickets for passengers to travel by freight train. When I was in university in Manchester 1965-68 the Railway Society used to have a monthly brake van trip.It was organised through the Hunts Bank offices at Victoria and the fare charged was based on mileage at first class rates.We normally had an additional brake van added to the train for our exclusive use.

Thanks, a really interesting bit of info ref those tickets and also the University society trips.

 

[43096]

The first test run of an EMT HST to Skegness operated as a class 5 ECS train, but had five cranks on board, invited by EMT. A full cooked breakfast was provided from the kitchen as well!

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Not quite the same as the thread but just to show old enterprising ways aren't always lost on two fairly recent occasions I've seen both the police and railway come to the rescue of stranded people.

One was when I was the guard of a train stranded by a fatality. An old dear was at the station with her shopping and was getting a bit distressed as she'd got a load of frozen stuff. The local bobby had been asked to swing by the station in his 4x4 to see that all was well with us, which it was. On being told Doris's plight he piled her and her shopping in to his motor and ran her home

The second was working a working a steam charter we came across someone who had missed the last train due to an amended timetable and couldn't get in to work. We piled her into the brake coach and gave her a hot chocolate too as it was December and rather cold!

I wish I had kept a diary - but probably that nasty cold snap in early 1987 so on the request of the SM Wimbledon I was keeping an eye on the latter station (being able to walk home for a massive warm up and extra clothing between the am and pm shift helped ) , things were pretty bad but most urgent passengers got there who needed to.

Anyway - we had a bit of a gap with not much around for a bit - when a lady and her son turned up looking to get to London - the radio had advised them there was a service operating and he had a fairly important exam at the Royal College of Music , so we kept them warm in the office and I stopped the de-icer which had just been topped up at Wimbledon Dept and reversing - and having spoken to the crew (who , as ever were helpful) , got them a lift to Waterloo where there was a much better chance of getting some onwards road transport to the RCM. It was a 73 front and rear - so sort of counts as a freight train.

 

[yorksrob]

I wish I had kept a diary - but probably that nasty cold snap in early 1987 so on the request of the SM Wimbledon I was keeping an eye on the latter station (being able to walk home for a massive warm up and extra clothing between the am and pm shift helped ) , things were pretty bad but most urgent passengers got there who needed to.

Anyway - we had a bit of a gap with not much around for a bit - when a lady and her son turned up looking to get to London - the radio had advised them there was a service operating and he had a fairly important exam at the Royal College of Music , so we kept them warm in the office and I stopped the de-icer which had just been topped up at Wimbledon Dept and reversing - and having spoken to the crew (who , as ever were helpful) , got them a lift to Waterloo where there was a much better chance of getting some onwards road transport to the RCM. It was a 73 front and rear - so sort of counts as a freight train.

I'm quite jealous of that. Always fancied a trip on one of those de-icers.

 

[Cricketer8for9]

Illegal reading often results in severe injuries or worse - but I recall a very frozen gentleman who climbed onto the Newcastle - Cardiff freightliner at Gloucester and was removed (to hospital) on arrival , (he boarded a keg "beer" loaded S&N open container) , plus a reported pair of thieves who got onto a Dagenham - Wakefield car traffic at Finsbury Park was were again removed at Doncaster.

A particularly ill advised one who got onto a Motherwell - Cardiff loaded steel ingot train , the cargo of which was loaded onto solid metal trestle wagons , straight out of the blast furnace. The melted snow should have been a giveaway.

Illegal reading has me in mind of Fahrenheit 451 by Kurt Vonnegut.

 

[Falcon1200]

When Virgin were introducing the Voyagers, Network Rail Scotland Control staff were invited on their crew training runs between Edinburgh and Preston, which made a great day out. However the date of my trip is remembered for a very different reason, being the 11th September 2001....

 

[racyrich]

Illegal reading has me in mind of Fahrenheit 451 by Kurt Vonnegut.

Ray Bradbury