Short faring on Thameslink. Small amount. Told I would just pay the difference. Am I okay ?

[Daniel111]

Hi All
Other day I was stopped and admitted to short faring. Only saving a small amount but stupid nonetheless. I admitted I had done so more than once.

. I’m extremely scared about this and should not have made such careless decisions that ultimately could lead to prosecution. Should I get a lawyer to make sure I receive an out of court settlement. They said to expect a letter home but given they said I will not even be paying much. Would this mean that I likely won’t get prosecuted?

 

[furlong]

You should always be able to rely on what you were told at the time as long as you didn't mishear what they said. What they said is indeed normal for Thameslink - if you accept what you did was wrong and pay them back what they are owed together with some money to cover their costs, they won't prosecute. There's little point paying for a lawyer if you've only done what you described. Sometimes the first letter contains an offer saying how much you need to pay and they are suggesting this is what they'll do for you - but other times, you have to write back apologetically and ask. Just wait for the letter then come back here if you need any more help.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi All
Other day I was stopped. And fraud police inspector scanned my ticket claimed I was essentially short faring.

Inspectors said I would pay the difference between the two journeys at first. The difference is only £5 roughly. It was stupid to do. Haven’t been doing for long. But I wanted to cooperate and said I would pay full ticket. And mentioned every time I’ve done it. Like couple times a week in last 2 or 3 mos. They said I would just be charged for each time and they will check the cameras. But now that I think about it, word prosecution was mentioned but it sounded only would occur if I didn’t pay.

I need to ensure I don’t get prosecuted. I’m extremely scared about this. Should I get a lawyer to make sure I receive an out of court settlement. They said to expect a letter home but given they said I will not even be paying much. Would this mean that I likely won’t get prosecuted?

If they do offer this it sounds like he forgot to mention the 'admin charge' they also request - in the region of £100 to £150.

I very much doubt you are going to be looking at paying them £5 in total....

But if you have done this on other occasions - you told them you have (and they can check your on line ticket buying records) they will want money for those trips too and if you do this persistently they are more likely to consider prosecuting, as you have been persistently stealing from them.

 

[John R]

Which train company were you using at the time you were checked? It would be useful to know as some have different attitudes to the amount they ask for.

 

[Daniel111]

I have just read and checked the forum. I did however receive the GTREM ticket/receipt. Stating it may go to prosecutions. So I am extremely worried and stressed now. I cannot afford for this to be any type of record.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Feb 2024 ==

was using city thameslink service.

 

[John R]

I have just read and checked the forum. I did however receive the GTREM ticket/receipt. Stating it may go to prosecutions. So I am extremely worried and stressed now. I cannot afford for this to be any type of record.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Feb 2024 ==

was using city thameslink service.

Ok, the good news is that GTR tends to be fairly pragmatic if you cooperate, and are open and honest with them. So unless there are any other circumstances aggravating the crime then it is likely that you will get an out of court settlement in due course.

If you cannot afford any type of criminal record (either for employment or residency reasons) then I strongly advise you to ensure you buy the correct ticket in future, check if you are unsure, and always have any railcard with you. You may be lucky this time, but coming to any train company’s attention a second time is likely to result in prosecution.

 

[Daniel111]

I initially suggested I came from where was on the ticket. But after seeing a fraud police badge from there I tried to be honest. They noted down what I looked like and said they would check the cctv cameras.

I have done this multiple times on the way to work and admitted that ie three times a week for two months. Could this work against me

 

[John R]

I initially suggested I came from where was on the ticket. But after seeing a fraud police badge from there I tried to be honest. They noted down what I looked like and said they would check the cctv cameras.

I have done this multiple times on the way to work and admitted that ie three times a week for two months. Could this work against me

Probably not if it’s the sort of number you are talking about, but if you buy these short fare tickets online you might want to review your account and work out the exact number. It’s highly likely you’ll either be asked to state how many times or confirm it when the investigation sees the activity in your account.

 

[6Gman]

Hi All
Other day I was stopped. And fraud police inspector scanned my ticket claimed I was essentially short faring.

Inspectors said I would pay the difference between the two journeys at first. The difference is only £5 roughly. It was stupid to do. Haven’t been doing for long. But I wanted to cooperate and said I would pay full ticket. And mentioned every time I’ve done it. Like couple times a week in last 2 or 3 mos. They said I would just be charged for each time and they will check the cameras. But now that I think about it, word prosecution was mentioned but it sounded only would occur if I didn’t pay.

I need to ensure I don’t get prosecuted. I’m extremely scared about this. Should I get a lawyer to make sure I receive an out of court settlement. They said to expect a letter home but given they said I will not even be paying much. Would this mean that I likely won’t get prosecuted?

No lawyer can ensure you would receive an out of court settlement. That is entirely up to the railway company.

But, as others have pointed out, the operator involved tends to accept settlements.

Wait until you hear from them and then come back for further advice.

 

[fandroid]

I can't remember what GTR (the train company) normally does, but most rail companies do not just ask for the difference in fares to be paid. They work on the principle that your tickets weren't valid and ask you to pay again for every journey, at the Anytime Single fare. So work out how much that that is likely to be, and be prepared to have to pay that plus admin costs. GTR have been known to be not too grasping about the latter, but many companies ask for £100-£150.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

GTR will write to you in the next few weeks saying they have received a report, and are considering prosecuting you. When this letter arrives pop back here and post up a copy of it (with personal details redacted) along with your draft reply and we will proof read it for you.

GTR are one of the more reasonable companies to deal with when it comes to this sort of thing, but you do need to be aware that this is a criminal offence and GTR are within their rights to prosecute you in the Magistrates Court, although if you co-operate with them I'd expect you to be offered an out of court settlement but this will probably cost around £150 plus the fares avoided at Anytime rate.

 

[Daniel111]

Hi All
Its been over a few weeks and still have not received anything from GTR. Please can you advise if there is a way of checking whether the plan to ever send a letter.

I am worried that the letter may have got lost but I also am thinking perhaps they have decided not to proceed. Has this ever happened?

 

[JBuchananGB]

It's early days yet. They have up to 6 months before the cut-off prevents them from prosecuting you. It will take them a while to call in all your fare buying history and work out what exactly you have avoided paying. Remember they are processing thousands of cases.

 

[Class93]

Hi All
Its been over a few weeks and still have not received anything from GTR. Please can you advise if there is a way of checking whether the plan to ever send a letter.

I am worried that the letter may have got lost but I also am thinking perhaps they have decided not to proceed. Has this ever happened?

Did you pay the difference (for the episode stopped for, and the other two times you freely admitted to) at the time? It’s a little confusing in your post.

 

[Daniel111]

Okay so just received the protection letter. I was told on the day that I would only be paying the difference and they will check the CCTV for everytime I have done this. I replied I am happy to pay the full price, I thought it was a one off payment originally when saying this.

They noted down that I had been doing this twice a week for the last two months.
Perhaps more so twice a week for last 3/4 months. I initially said twice a week for last 2/3 mos but I believe only 2 mos was noted down.

I’m wondering in my response do I check every single time this has happened and write this to them.

 

[John R]

Could you please post a copy of the letter you've received, with any identifying details (including any reference number) redacted, to avoid you being identified.

Interesting it came the day after you posted that you hadn't received it yet. Given we know some investigators review these pages, I wonder whether they dug your case out and sent it out immediately!

 

[Daniel111]

My parents have told me the letter has arrived. I’m extremely worried and think perhaps I should get a lawyer.

I am young professional and something like this will likely cause me to lose my job. I’m not sure whether mentioning this may suggest I’m less remorseful.


I feel terrible for doing this, it’s especially stupid from my behalf based on the little amount I am saving.

I believe they have access to my Trainline so can see how many times I have done this. I’m sad to admit that I did so regularly as times are tough and I’m living at home trying to save up to afford to move out. I’m incredibly stupid and really hope I can come to an out of court settlement. I would never do anything like this again and since have been paying full price.

 

[ikcdab]

Ok, but you do need to post the letter on here, suitably redacted, so that we can offer advice.

 

[Snow1964]

My parents have told me the letter has arrived. I’m extremely worried and think perhaps I should get a lawyer.

If you are not at home, and won't be for more than few days, then don't ignore it, get them to scan it and send it to you.

You might only have 2 or 3 weeks to reply (and if your postal deliveries are poor, a few days might have already gone).

At this stage it might be request for your side of the story, or it might make an offer (their choice, and amount is not negotiable, more of a take it or leave it basis), or could say would action they are pursuing. Until you explain what it is, or show everyone (with references and names and locations hidden), no point in getting a lawyer.

 

[Daniel111]

Is there a chance that I won’t be prosecuted even though I have done so more than once. I’ve reflected on this situation and am praying that it does not lead to Prosecution. I have since been purchasing full price tickets obviously. And will never even think about not purchasing a full ticket.

 

[WesternLancer]

Is there a chance that I won’t be prosecuted even though I have done so more than once. I’ve reflected on this situation and am praying that it does not lead to Prosecution. I have since been purchasing full price tickets obviously. And will never even think about not purchasing a full ticket.

if it's Thameslink a very big chance you will not be prosecuted, but you can maximize that chance by following advice here on how to respond - but that does start with sharing a copy fo the letter sent to you so ppl can advise accordingly. That is the best way to get it sorted without having to pay a lot of legal fees for a lawyer to help you.

 

[Daniel111]

Hi all
I responded to a letter to intent to prosecute from GTR.

I was wondering how long it takes to receive a response back.

I am still extremely concerned and also disappointed by this situation. I’m really hoping they will not prosecute. Since then I have of course been paying full price fares.

 

[Titfield]

Did you send the response by "tracked" means?

Can you check and see if they have received it?

Responses by the "passenger" can take a while to be processed and considered by the TOC however we do see responses from the TOC within the 3 week time frame.

Did the letter from the TOC - which we asked you to upload here - give any clues as to how advanced their investigations were?

It could well be that they are investigating your ticket purchasing history and that can take time especially if they are awaiting responses from third parties.