Slowing to a crawl when approaching Crewe station (northbound)

[All Line Rover]

Why, in this video, around the 37 minute mark, does the locomotive slow to a crawl a short distance south of Crewe station, only to speed up again quite considerably, and then slow down again when arriving at the station? And why, 15 years later, does this continue to happen? The majority of VTWC trains that run on time, or early, as far as Basford, slow down and arrive into Crewe a minute or two late.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

He's running under restrictive signalling.

 

[The Planner]

As Cherry Picker says, he gets restrictive aspects back at Basford Hall as it is approach control into Platform 6. You can see the feather on the approach signal.

 

[Senex]

There are a number of regular movements in the Crewe station area that were actually made significantly slower by the 1980s works, and down fast to the principal down platform (now 6) is one of them. The turnout is 50, so the iron on the ground would allow a fast run in, but the signalling involves severe approach control out at Basford Wood. IIRC this is because the turnout down fast to up fast at 60 has flashing yellows, so the turnout to platform 6 at 50 can't. (I can't recall hearing of any modification since.)

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I'm pretty sure it applies southbound into the station too, from all directions.
On the Warrington line you always find yourself crawling along on the far outskirts of Crewe, only to eventually speed up into P5.
I think the through lines (mostly Glasgows now) can get a clear run, but not sure, haven't done it very often.
The way the Down Slow merges with the Up Slow at Crewe South is also restrictive. There is no clear run into P11, say.
Never mind, all going to be sorted for HS2...

 

[The Planner]

No need to wink, something will get done at Crewe regardless as it is approaching life expired.

 

[Senex]

No need to wink, something will get done at Crewe regardless as it is approaching life expired.

Dare one hope that someone will dust off the early plans for the 1980s work (before it was descoped) and deliver the better and faster connections to the Manchester line that were originally conceived (before they settled for a layout that for Manchester is very much worse than the previous one)?

 

[Oxfordblues]

It wouldn't be a problem if the schedules accounted for it, but most Euston-Birmingham-Scotland trains lose a couple of minutes arriving at Platform 11 and the advertised xx09 departure times are hardly ever achieved.

Similarly southbound from Preston trains get only 4 mins to passing Euxton Jn but with the mandatory moving brake test this is always extended to at least 5 mins and departures from Wigan NW are always late.

Both represent an unfortunate lack of attention to detail by the timers.

 

[craigybagel]

It wouldn't be a problem if the schedules accounted for it, but most Euston-Birmingham-Scotland trains lose a couple of minutes arriving at Platform 11 and the advertised xx09 departure times are hardly ever achieved.

This also regularly delays the xx08 ATW South Wales service from Platform 6. The Virgin is due to arrive first but is almost invariably late,and in common with most signal boxes in the Northwest ,if Virgin runs late, everything else stops to keep out of the way

 

[The Planner]

Similarly southbound from Preston trains get only 4 mins to passing Euxton Jn but with the mandatory moving brake test this is always extended to at least 5 mins and departures from Wigan NW are always late.

Both represent an unfortunate lack of attention to detail by the timers.

Virgin could always bid for it.....

 

[kieron]

If attention to detail is something Virgin would have to bid for separately, I imagine it could be quite expensive.

 

[AndrewE]

This also regularly delays the xx08 ATW South Wales service from Platform 6. The Virgin is due to arrive first but is almost invariably late,and in common with most signal boxes in the Northwest ,if Virgin runs late, everything else stops to keep out of the way

You are right, the northbound "class 9"(!) Virgin is invariably late at Crewe, and it also affects the following Euston - Manchester off platform 5 too. It is usually down to a Bham N St to Wolves local, which delays the EUS - BHM - CRE - Scotland train, which in turn knocks the Manchester at Stafford.
I have given up on catching the Crewe to Manchester Pendolinos because I keep missing the start of things, now get the local before!

 

[craigybagel]

You are right, the northbound "class 9"(!) Virgin is invariably late at Crewe, and it also affects the following Euston - Manchester off platform 5 too. It is usually down to a Bham N St to Wolves local, which delays the EUS - BHM - CRE - Scotland train, which in turn knocks the Manchester at Stafford.
I have given up on catching the Crewe to Manchester Pendolinos because I keep missing the start of things, now get the local before!

Indeed - I'd be very interested to see what the reliability of the Manchester via Crewe's are and how they compare to the via Stoke's.

 

[All Line Rover]

Indeed - I'd be very interested to see what the reliability of the Manchester via Crewe's are and how they compare to the via Stoke's.

They generally manage to catch up the time by Piccadilly. Therefore the PPM statistics are unaffected, which might explain why VT does not appear to care about the problem (which is fair enough - Manchester is the most important destination). But it's still a nuisance for passengers with connections at Crewe, Wilmslow or Stockport.