SouthEastern train passing through Clapham Junction

Socanxdis

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Saw a SE train today passing through Clapham Junction around 1055hrs today, probably non passenger. I didn't think they operated through the station. Any idea what it might be.
 
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4-SUB 4732

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Saw a SE train today passing through Clapham Junction around 1055hrs today, probably non passenger. I didn't think they operated through the station. Any idea what it might be.
ECS to/from Victoria to/from Selhurst if a blue 377.
 

4-SUB 4732

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NSE

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The 377/5’s (and the two or three /1’s) the are subleased top SE are still maintained at Selhurst. If it was blue it was the /5’s and if it was SN liveried but SE branded then it was a /1.
 

185143

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Off topic, but I was on a bus to Purley earlier and a Southern liveried loco (a 73?) Passed as speed, seemed to be London bound. What was that doing and why? Probably around 09:20.
 

_toommm_

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They do have one (is it named ‘Dave Berry’?). I have it in my mind that it lived in Stewart’s Lane most of the time. I believe it’s a thunderbird of sorts. Though I don’t recall it doing much rescuing. With the number of Electrostars on the rails, it’s probably easier to just use the one behind/in front to push/pull out the way.
 

03_179

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73202 is named Graham Stenning after a trainer.
It's allocated to BSL but is also allocated the St. Leonards


377/5s and the 2x /2 are maintained at Selhurst.
 

physics34

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They do have one (is it named ‘Dave Berry’?). I have it in my mind that it lived in Stewart’s Lane most of the time. I believe it’s a thunderbird of sorts. Though I don’t recall it doing much rescuing. With the number of Electrostars on the rails, it’s probably easier to just use the one behind/in front to push/pull out the way.
Yeh used to be Dave Berry but its changed
 

Sm5

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There were two sets of SE Electrostars at Selhurst on Tuesday 11 am, that I passed, one arriving on depot from Norwood Junction, and another in the depot itself.

presumably this is the one you saw..


Note Monday is showing 4 other such moves as STP Mon 30th Aug only..
 

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It would be very convenient if Southeastern ran through and stopped at Clapham Junction regularly. They already pass through Clapham High Street.

Surely the services from Dover Priory which run via Denmark Hill could very easily head to Clapham Junction on their way to Victoria

I have made this suggestion in the past but there was a lot of backlash about how they was no capacity. Thameslink and Southern have dramatically reduced their services, so I can’t see why it would be an issue now pathing wise.
 
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You may want to look at a map of the area. A south eastern train calling at Denmark Hill and Clapham Junction would need to reverse at Clapham Junction to get back to Victoria.
 

BluePenguin

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You may want to look at a map of the area. A south eastern train calling at Denmark Hill and Clapham Junction would need to reverse at Clapham Junction to get back to Victoria.
I understand, in that case travelling via Birkbeck instead. Although similarly Cross Country reverse at Reading and that does not seem to annoy anyone that much.

I doubt the reversal would bother too many people considering anyone who specifically wanted Victoria would have travelled on the fast services from Bromley South. The only passengers who would stay on would be those who wanted Clapham Junction.

Anyone else who boards there for Victoria would be none the wiser about the reversal.
 

zwk500

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I understand, in that case travelling via Birkbeck instead. Although similarly Cross Country reverse at Reading and that does not seem to annoy anyone that much.

I doubt the reversal would bother too many people considering anyone who specifically wanted Victoria would have travelled on the fast services from Bromley South. The only passengers who would stay on would be those who wanted Clapham Junction.

Anyone else who boards there for Victoria would be none the wiser about the reversal.
Which platforms are you expecting these trains to reverse in at Clapham Junction? And how do you expect passengers on the Beckenham Junction branch to feel as their local trains are cancelled to allow SE services over the single line?

EDIT: Reading has 2 platforms per line plus the bays, Clapham Junction has 1 platform per line. It's a world of difference.
 

BluePenguin

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Fair enough, but surely not all of these platforms at Reading can be used to travel in every single direction

I am not in the know so unfortunately cannot answer those questions. My point is somehow overcoming those issues to allow Southeastern to call at Clapham Junction would be very beneficial. It has fantastic connections to a variety of different places. Much more useful than Victoria. Nobody else’s trains should be cancelled to facilitate this though
 

pdeaves

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Reading has 2 platforms per line plus the bays, Clapham Junction has 1 platform per line. It's a world of difference.
Also, Reading layout was designed to accommodate the required service (including reversals). Clapham Junction's layout was designed for the amount of through services it receives.
 

Horizon22

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Fair enough, but surely not all of these platforms at Reading can be used to travel in every single direction

I am not in the know so unfortunately cannot answer those questions. My point is somehow overcoming those issues to allow Southeastern to call at Clapham Junction would be very beneficial. It has fantastic connections to a variety of different places. Much more useful than Victoria. Nobody else’s trains should be cancelled to facilitate this though

What exactly is the need though? They haven't called there before so why the sudden need? You can change at Denmark Hill for an Overground service to Clapham Junction which is much simpler.
 

43066

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I doubt the reversal would bother too many people considering anyone who specifically wanted Victoria would have travelled on the fast services from Bromley South. The only passengers who would stay on would be those who wanted Clapham Junction.

The ex Dover Priory services still are “fast” Victoria services, albeit with the additional call at Denmark Hill. This would add a lot of time for the journey Denmark Hill - Victoria and as others have said it would also be an incredibly difficult and inefficient routing infrastructure wise.

There are plenty of trains for Victoria already passing through Clapham Junction, so the only passengers who would really benefit would be those going from Denmark Hill direct Clapham Junction. And they have a regular direct London Overground service already!
 

zwk500

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Fair enough, but surely not all of these platforms at Reading can be used to travel in every single direction

I am not in the know so unfortunately cannot answer those questions. My point is somehow overcoming those issues to allow Southeastern to call at Clapham Junction would be very beneficial. It has fantastic connections to a variety of different places. Much more useful than Victoria. Nobody else’s trains should be cancelled to facilitate this though
Reading is set up such that whilst a train is reversing in the inner platforms, the next train can pass through to/from Paddington in the outer platform. The connectivity problem (such as it is) for SE could largely be solved by putting platforms in for the overground at Brixton, tbh.
 

BluePenguin

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What exactly is the need though? They haven't called there before so why the sudden need? You can change at Denmark Hill for an Overground service to Clapham Junction which is much simpler.
There is a need because I need to go to Clapham Junction as do many other people who live here. There used to be a service from Tonbride to London Victoria via Redhill. You are also incorrect, before the route via Sevenoaks was built, ALL Network South East trains ran this way.

It is simply not convenient and is slooow for people living in the leafy environs to travel all the way to Denmark Hill, change to overground and then change again to Clapham Junction

Irrelevant!!!
 

DPQ

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On the same lines, why can't the Portsmouth to Victoria services go via Guildford and Leatherhead?

Answer, because not every direct journey can be catered for.
 

Horizon22

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There is a need because I need to go to Clapham Junction as do many other people who live here. There used to be a service from Tonbride to London Victoria via Redhill. You are also incorrect, before the route via Sevenoaks was built, ALL Network South East trains ran this way.

It is simply not convenient and is slooow for people living in the leafy environs to travel all the way to Denmark Hill, change to overground and then change again to Clapham Junction


Irrelevant!!!

Yes I too used to live in the area and it is just one of those things. Or you continue into Victoria and catch one of the many Southern trains. There are lots of aspects of railway geography that are historically awkward but we aren't exactly going to be digging up track and doing extensive and disruptive engineering works to be adding loads of new connections (plus there's literally no solution to the reversing problem).
 

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SE trains where going via East Croydon a few weeks ago because of engineering works. Unfortunately too late for a photo. I was tempted to jump on to go to Charing Cross!
 

Bald Rick

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It has fantastic connections to a variety of different places. Much more useful than Victoria.

Not for the vast majority of passengers on Southeastern services to Victoria, who want to go to Central London.
 

4-SUB 4732

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What exactly is the need though? They haven't called there before so why the sudden need? You can change at Denmark Hill for an Overground service to Clapham Junction which is much simpler.
And admittedly it would be nice for a few more services to run along the Catford Loop (where practical) to allow Denmark Hill to be used as a connecting point.
 

BluePenguin

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Not for the vast majority of passengers on Southeastern services to Victoria, who want to go to Central London.
Understood. Although some of them don’t have a choice to go anywhere but Victoria as it is their only London Terminal. What about those heading to Woking, Southampton, Watford, Gatwick, Brighton, Croydon, Reading, Staines?

These passengers have no desire to head to Central London, if anything they prefer to avoid it - especially if making onward connections

And admittedly it would be nice for a few more services to run along the Catford Loop (where practical) to allow Denmark Hill to be used as a connecting point.
This is also a good point to additionally consider
 

Horizon22

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And admittedly it would be nice for a few more services to run along the Catford Loop (where practical) to allow Denmark Hill to be used as a connecting point.

It would be nice but since the intensification of Thameslink services along the corridor, the pathing is a bit of a nightmare.

Understood. Although some of them don’t have a choice to go anywhere but Victoria as it is their only London Terminal. What about those heading to Woking, Southampton, Watford, Gatwick, Brighton, Croydon, Reading, Staines?

What about anyone going anywhere that's having to circulate around London? Most have to go in and out to a London terminal. By all means you can argue for more orbital routes, but it's not exactly isolated to just to SE London. It is an arguable minority though. The vast majority of people in the home counties only have 1 London terminal. In fact Southeastern is the oddity in having 3 (4 if you count Blackfriars).
 

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