Stagecoach West - Fleet News & Discussion

CharlesR

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They wouldn't have been Scania buses, Stagecoach don't buy them anymore and haven't done in three years. I think they don't likr then due to parts being hard to find?

I've been told by many sources at Gloucester depot, some very senior that they were due to be Scanias. I may stand corrected although I highly doubt the information I was given was incorrect as they are "in the know" with all things at Gloucester depot
 
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TheWalrus

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A few observations having lived in Gloucester for four weeks:

The 1 (City Centre to Matson): Monday to Saturday seems to be a PVR of 3: 2 Gold Scania E400s usually found on the 10 and a E200. This is the right thing for it, the 1 in particular can still get busy.

2/2A is a mixture of E200s and E300s. Ideally I think they should all be E300s and the 9 (City Centre to Tuffley) should be E200s.

The 10 (Lower Tuffley to Cheltenham) seems to be a mixture of 15841-15859 and anything from 15521-15522. Would it not be better to have the Gold Scania E400s all de-branded (i.e. some are for the 10, others for the 97/98) and have them all in regular Gold so that they can work freely on whatever routes need them?

The 97/98 appears to be more Enviro 300s or MAN E300s (22744-22754), and not the branded Scanias (15521-15522).

Would be handy if the 94X ran all day, even if only half hourly to replace the 94U withdrawal at the Gloucester end of the route.

22/23/24 seems to be operated again by Gold 10s, when there are plain standard-spec Scanias (15731-15734, 15871-15880) which usually appear.

I know we're in the middle of a pandemic but I feel everything is all over the place at the moment. The only route that appears to be at 100% correct vehicles is the 63 and the 94 (although 10753 did make an appearance on the 94U yesterday).

I think the network should look like this:

1: Two Scania E400s and an Enviro 300, preferably with bog standard-spec Scanias (a la 15638 etc) and an E300. Continue to run every 20 minutes in the evening and not half hourly (and definitely not half hourly all day on a Saturday as it is currently!). Retain Sunday frequency. Make deckers run all evening. Some of the evening services (1940/2010 departures from town) can get cosy as usually just E200s.

2/2A: Space these out a little bit, as on the common section of the route shared with the 1 between Chequers Bridge and the city centre, the 1/2 are due three minutes apart and then there's nothing for almost 15 minutes. Have Enviro 300s on the 2 and Enviro 200s on the 2A.

6/13: Wondered why on earth this is predominantly Scania E400s but realise it's interworked with the 71.

8: Continue to be operated with the MAN E300s (22744-22754), as this works well. Personally think this should be bought back to every 20 minutes.

9: Reduce to every half an hour and make it fully E200 operated. No need for a 20 minute frequency and E300s. Plenty of other buses serve the Quays and the Tredworth section of the route is close to the 1/2 from Barton Street/Painswick Road. Think routes such as the 8 deserve more of a frequency increase.

10: Remove branding from 15841-15859 and have all Gold Scanias unbranded so that they can be used freely on other routes. Retain current frequency of every 15 minutes.

12: Keep as current.

22/23/24: Do not know enough about regional/wider bus routes, but a lot of these workings are by Gold deckers. Keep 15731-15734/15871-15880 for these routes, as they have coach-style seating which is more approriate).

93: Is the 93 really needed at the moment? Surely it would be better to have a Sunday style service and have all 94s turn into Arle Court?

94: Retain current frequency of every 15 minutes. Maybe serve Arle Court to release the two E200MMCs for the 93 onto other services?

94X: Have this run all day and not just morning/evening peaks. Even if only half-hourly?

97/98: Seems to be single decker worked at the moment. What is the point of having 15521-15523 branded for the route?

A (Cheltenham): This is regularly operated by 94-branded E400MMCs. Surely it would be better to have the two E200MMCs from the 93 operate this instead, and displace the E400MMCs elsewhere? May be worth transferring half of the 94 operation to Gloucester, to allow E400MMCs to support single deckers on key Gloucester city routes such as the 1 and 8?

I also think St Oswald's Retail Park needs a regular bus service, and not just the very sporadic 351/353. Last week SC withdrew the 351 because of flooding near Tewkesbury, but didn't do what they usually do and have a shuttle service between St Oswald's and the transport hub. I waited for the 15:15 departure towards the city centre last week, only because I noticed it was due, and it didn't turn up. Was waiting with an elderly lady doing her shopping and tweeted SC; thankfully they saw it and replied so I could pass on the message. Think a new service, say a 72, could be introduced between Gloucester and Tewkesbury, and have it run via St Oswald's and keep the 71 via Kingsholm. It is a massively busy retail park and admittedly isn't too far from the city centre but does need something!

Bold statements admittedly, but worth sharing!
I agree with the 93 idea, it would make sense to serve Arle Court P&R with the 94 and cascade the vehicles to other routes, retiring old Darts and Optares.

They won’t split the 94 between two depots, even though there is some dead running between Gloucester and Cheltenham, it’s too complicated to do that.
 

ValleyLines142

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This service is normally allocated Enviro 300s (a mixture of PO11s and GX58 MANs) and runs every 10 minutes Mon-Sat daytime. Unfortunately, there are not enough deckers to bring sufficient capacity to the routes that need it. Gloucester depot run 8 School/College services (6x Newent, 2x Cirencester) as well as 5 COVID dupes (2x Crypt School (10C), 1x Chosen Hill (997), 1x Homleigh Park (10H), 1x St Peters High School (963)). These all run as double deckers and some do interwork with Forest services and 6/13/71 rota.
Sorry, should have specified that my observations are at present, and not pre-COVID!

Pre-COVID, the 1 was every 10 minutes and usually sees the PO11s and GX58s. Now, it has been reduced to every 15 minutes but only tends to have Enviro 200s on it. Obviously every ten minutes the E300s are more than sufficient in capacity. The use of a Gold Scania is more than welcomed!

There is no difference between the 2/2A, other than the fact the 2A serves Bittern Avenue and Upton Lane. The timings for these routes are snails pace and generally only require Enviro 200s during normal times.
Must admit I'm not familiar with the route through Upton St Leonards, having never gone further than Chequers Bridge (I live near the Friendship Cafe on Painswick Road).

The 9 never seems to be particularly well loaded, from when I've seen it, but appreciate that having never travelled on the route that I am inexperienced!

Service 5 (withdrawn in 2013, served Abbeymead/Upton St Leonards) served St Oswald's Retail Park for many years. They also trialed a shuttle years back if I recall correctly. Unfortunately neither proved successful.


I understand most of your comments are based off of the current circumstances but I just thought it would be useful to give you some insight behind what some of the routes are normally like. Hope it helps. You'll be used to dodgy allocation in no time, there hasn't been any consistency for years....
It's a shame about the 5, as I feel like it could do well again!
 

Aston

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12: Keep as current.
From what I have seen, the 12 has great allocation some days, a Scania E400 and some E300s. But then randomly you get 3 E200s and one E300, it makes no sense. In these circumstances I think it should be all Enviro 300, MAN or ADL it doesn't matter.

The 9 gets quite busy from what I have seen, if Stagecoach would bring back the 7, it would release pressure on the 9, then I would agree that it should be all E200 ran, with the 7 maybe running hourly with an E200.
 

mbonwick

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They wouldn't have been Scania buses, Stagecoach don't buy them anymore and haven't done in three years. I think they don't likr then due to parts being hard to find?
More along the lines that Scania have been reluctant to progress from the traditional way of doing things and embrace efficiency.
Things such as not being willing to start using electric radiator fans and insisting on hydrostatic/belt drive instead.
 
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I also think St Oswald's Retail Park needs a regular bus service
i agree
served St Oswald's Retail Park for many years. They also trialed a shuttle years back if I recall correctly. Unfortunately neither proved successful.
There actually was one at one point, the CentreBus 101. I miss the old days of Gloucester with all the SPDs and the ALX200
 

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DaveHarries

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I also think St Oswald's Retail Park needs a regular bus service
IIRC didn't an independent operator (Bennetts?) run a Service 507 between the St. Oswald's P&R and Waterwells P&R at one time? Citaros were the bus of choice I seem to remember.

Dave
 
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IIRC didn't an independent operator (Bennetts?) run a Service 507 between the St. Oswald's P&R and Waterwells P&R at one time? Citaros were the bus of choice I seem to remember.

Dave
I believe there was a Waterwells P&R service from Bennett’s but it stopped after Stagecoach got the contract
 
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The St Oswald Park and ride was never well used. There were proposals to build a new park and ride closer to the forest of dean by the river but this never got off the ground. The waterwells Park and ride was council funded. Both services suffered from County Council funding cuts following the recession. Stagecoach stepped in by extending their new kingsway service out to waterwells.
 

swifty

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I’ve heard that Stagecoach West and Stagecoach Oxfordshire are merging soon to form an enlarged Stagecoach West. Has anyone heard anything official?
 

Volvodart

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Stagecoach in Oxfordshire to merge with Stagecoach West

https://cbwmagazine.com/stagecoach-...tagecoach-west/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Stagecoach in Oxfordshire to merge with Stagecoach West​

Stagecoach in Oxfordshire to merge with Stagecoach West

Stagecoach recently invested £13m in new Plaxton Panorama coaches for the Oxford Tube service. RICHARD SHARMAN

Stagecoach recently invested £13m in new Plaxton Panorama coaches for the Oxford Tube service. RICHARD SHARMAN
Staff at Stagecoach in Oxfordshire and Stagecoach West were informed on 23 February that both operating companies (OpCos) are to merge to form a single OpCo.
Rupert Cox, Interim Regional Director for Stagecoach in the South, said: “As with all companies, we continually review our ways of working to ensure that we are meeting the needs of our customers and communities and at the same time maximising the opportunities ahead.
“We will be making some changes to the head office functions in our businesses in the west of England and Oxfordshire. A new structure will be introduced, providing a management team that is responsible for bus and coach services across all of these areas that will be based in a head office at Gloucester. A small number of roles will change as a result of the new planned structure and we are working with our people to support them through this period.
“This will have no impact on our bus services and customers can continue to use our services with confidence.”
Further changes are set to take place on 28 February, when Stagecoach in Oxfordshire’s Banbury depot will sever its final ties to Midland Red (South) Ltd, its registered bus services and operators licence changing to Thames Transit Ltd.
Services 200, 488/9, 500, 505, B3, B5, B9, H4 and S4 are currently registered to Midland Red (South) Ltd due to the depot previously being owned by Western Travel prior to moving to Stagecoach ownership in 1993.
Banbury depot remained part of Stagecoach Midland Red until Stagecoach South Midlands, the integration of Midland Red (South) Ltd and Thames Transit Ltd, was formed.
When the Stagecoach South Midlands division was split up in 2004 the Banbury depot came under Stagecoach in Oxfordshire management but retained Midland Red (South) Ltd legals and operators licence. The merger will, ironically, reunite Banbury depot with former Western Travel OpCos in the West.
Stagecoach in Oxfordshire has depots in Banbury, Oxford and Witney with outstations at Bicester, Chipping Norton and Grove. Its operating area borders that of Stagecoach West, particularly in West Oxfordshire. Stagecoach West has depots located in Bristol, Cheltenham, Gloucester, Ross-on-Wye, Stroud and Swindon with a single outstation located in Coleford. The combined fleet size will number over 520 vehicles with over 1,370 staff.
Swindon depot already operates into Oxfordshire in the form of service S6, whilst Cheltenham depot also serves Witney and Oxford with service 853. The operating area of the yet-to-be-named new OpCo will see it operating services in the following areas: Bristol, Gloucestershire, Herefordshire, Northamptonshire, Oxfordshire, South Gloucestershire and Wiltshire, with some West journeys also extending into Wales. Additionally, the Oxford Tube serves London and Bristol-based Megabus coaches serve a number of destinations on the network.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Guess there's the usual "back office savings" and loss of management, and Oxfordshire was always a bit small for a standalone OpCo. However, that's a bit of a territory and it's not as if it is adjacent aside from two routes running from one to another. Could've added it onto Midlands but then again, the links between Midlands and Oxford patches aren't exactly massive either!
 

carlberry

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Guess there's the usual "back office savings" and loss of management, and Oxfordshire was always a bit small for a standalone OpCo. However, that's a bit of a territory and it's not as if it is adjacent aside from two routes running from one to another. Could've added it onto Midlands but then again, the links between Midlands and Oxford patches aren't exactly massive either!
The article is a bit vague about if the end result is just some chairs being moved around or the actual merger of Cheltenham and Gloucester and Thames Transit. It does mention that Thames Transit is only just finishing dealing with the legacy of Banbury depot being inherited with Western Travel!
The Midland operations might have made sense given the joint ownership with C&G during the Western Travel days.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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The article is a bit vague about if the end result is just some chairs being moved around or the actual merger of Cheltenham and Gloucester and Thames Transit. It does mention that Thames Transit is only just finishing dealing with the legacy of Banbury depot being inherited with Western Travel!
The Midland operations might have made sense given the joint ownership with C&G during the Western Travel days.

The quote "A new structure will be introduced, providing a management team that is responsible for bus and coach services across all of these areas that will be based in a head office at Gloucester. A small number of roles will change as a result of the new planned structure and we are working with our people to support them through this period." reads to me that Oxford will no longer have a number of back-office roles that will be absorbed into the existing Gloucester HQ; the vagueness is that it may be that some of those people in Oxford are under consultation and the support is about finding roles for them if poss.
 
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I know it may be considered spam or whatnot but anyone want a paperbus of either 35212 or 27517? Anyone know what the next repaint is? Also is 22744 in the new livery or not? i'm confused about that
 

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GusB

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I know it may be considered spam or whatnot but anyone want a paperbus of either 35212 or 27517? Anyone know what the next repaint is? Also is 22744 in the new livery or not? i'm confused about that
It might be worthwhile starting a separate thread for this. Ordinarily we would request that Admin permission is sought before "advertising" anything, but if you're doing it purely as a hobby and happy to share, I can't see any problem. It also means if you do any that aren't in Stagecoach livery there's a single place to keep them.
 

cnjb8

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I've found it weird that Stagecoach Oxfordshire is (or was) a standalone division and not merged with Midlands or East.
Another off topic thing is Bedford, seems strange it's in East and not Midlands in my opinion
 
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It might be worthwhile starting a separate thread for this. Ordinarily we would request that Admin permission is sought before "advertising" anything, but if you're doing it purely as a hobby and happy to share, I can't see any problem. It also means if you do any that aren't in Stagecoach livery there's a single place to keep them.
most i do are stagecoach livery anyways, i have now made a dedicated thread for stagecoach paperbuses
 
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TheGrandWazoo

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I've found it weird that Stagecoach Oxfordshire is (or was) a standalone division and not merged with Midlands or East.
Another off topic thing is Bedford, seems strange it's in East and not Midlands in my opinion
There's a few things that seem a bit odd but I guess that it was a product of the splitting of United Counties and absorbing into Midland Red South and Cambus so 3 into 2. To be fair, there's not exactly a huge number of links between the two historic halves of United Counties, save for a couple of routes from Bedford to Northampton and Kettering/Rushden or when they touch in places like MK.

I guess if Oxfordshire has to be amalgamated, West is as good as any.
 

cnjb8

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There's a few things that seem a bit odd but I guess that it was a product of the splitting of United Counties and absorbing into Midland Red South and Cambus so 3 into 2. To be fair, there's not exactly a huge number of links between the two historic halves of United Counties, save for a couple of routes from Bedford to Northampton and Kettering/Rushden or when they touch in places like MK.

I guess if Oxfordshire has to be amalgamated, West is as good as any.
Yeah that makes sense. I'd wondered whether Stagecoach would create an East/Midlands/Oxfordshire 'super' division but that would probably present more problems than solutions.
 

M803UYA

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There's a few things that seem a bit odd but I guess that it was a product of the splitting of United Counties and absorbing into Midland Red South and Cambus so 3 into 2. To be fair, there's not exactly a huge number of links between the two historic halves of United Counties, save for a couple of routes from Bedford to Northampton and Kettering/Rushden or when they touch in places like MK.

I guess if Oxfordshire has to be amalgamated, West is as good as any.
It's a moot point, but Oxfordshire falls under the Western Traffic Area, so running it from Gloucester means it can be run on an increased single o licence.
 

ValleyLines142

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18315 on the 1 this morning in Matson, are the Tridents making a return?

Also 15855 on the 2 last night, not often a decker makes it out on the 2.
 

CharlesR

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18315 on the 1 this morning in Matson, are the Tridents making a return?

Also 15855 on the 2 last night, not often a decker makes it out on the 2.

Tridents are back out ahead of the return to school services and school dupes from March 8th. Currently 2 are out but more to come.

Evening services interwork between all different city routes so I would presume the scania would have been on the 1 or 12 before going on the 2.
 

ValleyLines142

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Tridents are back out ahead of the return to school services and school dupes from March 8th. Currently 2 are out but more to come.

Evening services interwork between all different city routes so I would presume the scania would have been on the 1 or 12 before going on the 2.
Yes, it was on the 12.
 

CharlesR

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Timetables are back to normal today meaning that all vehicles are out of COVID reserve. Rumours are circulating over possible buses to arrive at Gloucester depot but details are not very clear at the moment.

SF10 CCU is currently at Ross-on-Wye from Gloucester. It's supposed to be a temporary loan.

With the transfer of all mini E200s to Banbury/Swindon, Gloucester now has PX05 EKM. Ross now has YY15 OWP in exchange. It's possible that another Dart/E200 exchange will happen.
 
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