Storm Eowyn Disruption - 24/1/25

[Bletchleyite]

Network Rail have announced that the West Coast Main Line is closed from 03:00 until 22:00 on Friday 24 January and other North West routes are closed until 12:00.

Storm Éowyn: Do not travel advice across most of the North West

People planning rail journeys in the North West of England are being urged not to travel on Friday due to the impacts of Storm Éowyn.

www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk

For clarity, that's the WCML north of Preston and selected other North West routes (also north of Preston), not the whole Northern West network.

 

[Flying Snail]

I note that the UK Met Office have carefully avoided including County Donegal in the red warning, even though it might be the worst affected. There's clearly a political sensitivity involved!

Met UK do not issue warnings for ROI (or Isle of Man) but yes, they could include those areas covered by warnings from the respective agencies.

BBC network weather never provides any data for ROI, only NI. BBC NI weather covers the whole of Ireland.

 

[Howardh]

As I'm on holiday I've basically missed all the warnings about the weather so just catching up.

Tomorrow I have advances Brighton to Manchester - read that Northern have cancelled trains in the north of the NW but that won't affect me. So hoping Avanti will be OK save for stuff blowing on to the lines.

Glad if the clarification that it's Avanti north of Preston cancelled.

Thought of staying an extra day but gonna risk it, if it's really bad see if I can get to MK and stay there if I have to!

 

[Western Gaffer]

I’m not a football fan, but I know Rangers fans will be in Manchester on Thursday. They might have longer than planned in Manchester.

If their behaviour is anything like 2008, quite a few might have longer than planned anyway, until they're released....

2008 UEFA Cup final riots - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[styles]

I was going to cycle the old Dunfermline to Alloa railway line on Friday, but think I'll hunker down with hot chocolate instead!

 

[driver9000]

To clarify this is a WCML closure NORTH OF PRESTON over that period, not the entire line.

Yes, my mistake for not clarifying which section is closed.

 

[marks87]

Just one observation, todays 1200 KGX INV is running as far as PER only.
That means that tomorrow's 0755 from INV will also start at PER - any reason why LNER aren't mentioning this yet?
I'm not booked on that train or anything, just curious as to when updates are, er, updated.

Why is a service from Kings Cross to Inverness going anywhere near Penrhiwceiber?

 

[Howardh]

I'm on the 1233 Avanti from Euston, if I get there and find it's delayed with no specific departure, can I catch any available service to Manchester - this saving them delay repay?

 

[arb]

Using your analogy there’s also “food available” to you at home or where you are staying and you can also probably sleep there. The intention is not to start your journey in the first place so you don’t end up in an uncomfortable, inconvenient situation where you may only be able to get part way there. Being stuck on the station is analogous with being stuck at the airport but apparently one of those is suitable to you but one isn’t?

The context of my specific posts in this thread (which I admit is now probably lost in a couple of pages of history) is the case where you've been away from home from several days, your accommodation booking has ended, and you now need to get home. I fully agree with not starting your journey in the first place if you're already at home.

The impression I get from the railway's messaging is "stay away", i.e. don't come to the station at all. If the station is actually open, staff will genuinely help me with trying to find alternative travel options, I can buy food there, and can stay there until the disruption is resolved, then the railway's messaging needs to be looked at. Because at the moment it isn't giving me the impression that I can do any of that.

 

[Cross City]

People should be planning to travel a day earlier or later in an event like this, and they’ve been given enough notice to do so

Kinda hard to change plans when it's gone from a yellow warning to a red one in less than 24 hours and less than 24 hours before the storm is due to hit.

 

[Horizon22]

No, today's 1200 KGX-INV and tomorrow's 0755 INV-KGX are always formed of the same train. Only one LNER train overnights at Inverness. It's also the same crew, I believe, a Newcastle crew that lodges in Inverness. In general, yes, planning the units and crews on a very different timetable to normal is very difficult, but you can be absolutely certain that if LNER's one train doesn't get to Inverness tonight, it won't leave Inverness tomorrow!

Ah I see. Yes that makes much more sense!

They’re probably working out what to do with tonight’s crew and where to dump the stock!

The context of my specific posts in this thread (which I admit is now probably lost in a couple of pages of history) is the case where you've been away from home from several days, your accommodation booking has ended, and you now need to get home. I fully agree with not starting your journey in the first place if you're already at home.

The impression I get from the railway's messaging is "stay away", i.e. don't come to the station at all. If the station is actually open, staff will genuinely help me with trying to find alternative travel options, I can buy food there, and can stay there until the disruption is resolved, then the railway's messaging needs to be looked at. Because at the moment it isn't giving me the impression that I can do any of that.

There are always cases whereby people really must get back & travel. In this sense DO NOT TRAVEL attempts to reduce or even remove discretionary leisure travel & even regular commuting travel where there are alternatives. So therefore if things do go horribly wrong, at least there are a few people who will need to be supported onwards. So if you present at a station, staff will definitely try to do what they can, but just be prepared that it might not be very much, if anything, especially as it gets later in the day.

Kinda hard to change plans when it's gone from a yellow warning to a red one in less than 24 hours and less than 24 hours before the storm is due to hit.

Which is hardly the railway’s - or anyone’s - fault. Evolving situation and all that.

 

[Winthorpe]

If their behaviour is anything like 2008, quite a few might have longer than planned anyway, until they're released....

2008 UEFA Cup final riots - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yes, I recall the events. I was working in central Manchester at the time

 

[Bald Rick]

Kinda hard to change plans when it's gone from a yellow warning to a red one in less than 24 hours and less than 24 hours before the storm is due to hit.

That depends how hard you want to try.

If there was a red warning of a forest fire coming through, and you needed to travel today rather tomorrow, Id everyone would chamge their plans.

 

[Cross City]

Which is hardly the railway’s - or anyone’s - fault. Evolving situation and all that.

Oh yeah I know, you're absolutely right.

But it's unrealistic to expect people to drop what they're doing and rush to where they need to be a full day early.

Avanti have issued do not travel warnings, but they still haven't explicitly said that no trains will run. What are people supposed to do, come home and may be out of pocket for hotel bookings etc, or risk taking a train tomorrow because the TOC hasn't said they're not running?

That depends how hard you want to try.

See above, why should people be encouraged to try when the TOCs can't even get the correct info out.

 

[londonmidland]

Even after this storm has passed, there will only be a brief respite before more potential disruption. From the Met Office long range forecast:

Monday 27th Jan - Wednesday 5th Feb
This looks like being and unsettled period across much of the country, but especially for northern and western parts. During Monday, another deep area of low pressure looks likely to move across the UK from the Atlantic, bringing wet and windy conditions to most if not all parts. Further spells of wet and windy weather look like moving east from the Atlantic to affect the UK during the rest of the period too, with drier, brighter spells in between. There is the potential for further weather warnings or even a named storm at some point

 

[anothertyke]

Oh yeah I know, you're absolutely right.

But it's unrealistic to expect people to drop what they're doing and rush to where they need to be a full day early.

Avanti have issued do not travel warnings, but they still haven't explicitly said that no trains will run. What are people supposed to do, come home and may be out of pocket for hotel bookings etc, or risk taking a train tomorrow because the TOC hasn't said they're not running?



See above, why should people be encouraged to try when the TOCs can't even get the correct info out.

They should be encouraged to try for their own welfare. This is going to be a very unusual event. Thousands of people are being asked to modify their travel choices if they possibly can. Only three days ago there was quite a possibility the storm would track to the north west and be restricted to the Hebrides. That's not happening. And by the way, keep a close eye on Sun/Mon for potential flooding. Hopefully there will be a time window on Sat.

 

[Horizon22]

Oh yeah I know, you're absolutely right.

But it's unrealistic to expect people to drop what they're doing and rush to where they need to be a full day early.

Avanti have issued do not travel warnings, but they still haven't explicitly said that no trains will run. What are people supposed to do, come home and may be out of pocket for hotel bookings etc, or risk taking a train tomorrow because the TOC hasn't said they're not running?



See above, why should people be encouraged to try when the TOCs can't even get the correct info out.

Not to be flippant about it, but people do have their own free will and there is some element of individual responsibility whilst there's just a few people at each TOC responsible for customer information, on top of the day job. The information will trickle through even if some don't find it fast enough.

Get the critical info out (e.g. DO NOT TRAVEL where approriate) and then working on the more detailed information over time. Some TOCs will naturally be quicker/better at this than others.

LNER are saying don't travel north of York and Avanti saying not north of Preston, which seems reasonably clear. Both TOCs suggesting either full refunds or moving your journey back/forward -1/+2 days

 

[LAX54]

Kinda hard to change plans when it's gone from a yellow warning to a red one in less than 24 hours and less than 24 hours before the storm is due to hit.

Although the 'red' area, was previously amber.

 

[43066]

What are people supposed to do, come home and may be out of pocket for hotel bookings etc, or risk taking a train tomorrow because the TOC hasn't said they're not running?

Yes, that’s exactly what people should do. Or alternatively stay an extra night and travel on Saturday.

 

[Cross City]

They should be encouraged to try for their own welfare.

Agreed, they should be. Which is why the TOCs should be quicker to say "There are no trains tomorrow, get home today or wait it out safely until the weekend'.

Rather than whatever wishy washy nonsense they're coming out with now like 'we strongly advise people not to travel'.

Scotrail haven't even mentioned it, despite being the place that's going to get it full force.

Although the 'red' area, was previously amber.

It went from Yellow, to Amber, to Red in less than 20 hours

 

[Statto]

Ah I see. Yes that makes much more sense!

They’re probably working out what to do with tonight’s crew and where to dump the stock!

Well the 12.00 Kings Cross to Inverness is terminating short at Perth, then going ECS to Craigentinny Depot, so i suspect the staff be heading back to Newcastle

Realtime Trains | 1W16 1200 London Kings Cross to Perth | 23/01/2025

Real-time train running information for 1W16 1200 departure from London Kings Cross to Perth on 23/01/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains | 5W16 1803 Perth to Craigentinny T.&R.S.M.D | 23/01/2025

Real-time train running information for 5W16 1803 departure from Perth to Craigentinny T.&R.S.M.D on 23/01/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[Cross City]

Yes, that’s exactly what people should do. Or alternatively stay an extra night and travel on Saturday.

Then tell them that explicitly.

 

[styles]

They should be encouraged to try for their own welfare. This is going to be a very unusual event. Thousands of people are being asked to modify their travel choices if they possibly can. Only three days ago there was quite a possibility the storm would track to the north west and be restricted to the Hebrides. That's not happening. And by the way, keep a close eye on Sun/Mon for potential flooding. Hopefully there will be a time window on Sat.

Honestly a lot of people in the UK just don't prepare for seriously adverse weather.

I've just been into the garden to move everything under a tarp and pin it down, half-dismantled the trampoline and tied it to the fence, and put the bins into the garage for a couple of days.

I was going to cycle a disused railway line on Friday, but instead I'll be indoors, eating some previously batch cooked game pie.

Guarantee a number of people in our village will be driving out to the Co-op or to get a chippy tea on Friday instead of having something from their cupboards.

By all means some people need to go to work or hospital appointments or something, but I reckon a significant number are journeys, especially car journeys, could be sacked off.

 

[Lewisham2221]

Then tell them that explicitly.

Is that not what saying Do Not Travel on the affected date is doing? Can't get much more explicit than that, surely?

 

[Horizon22]

Then tell them that explicitly.

Have you read the travel alerts? It does explicitly say this. Agreed LNER has more detail in it but I imagine it will flesh out this afternoon.

LNER:

What are your options?

Bring your travel forward or travel later. You don’t need to buy a new ticket or change your existing ticket to travel on a different date if it is listed below.

• If you are booked to travel on any LNER service on Friday 24 January, you will be able to use your existing ticket on another LNER train on Thursday 23 January. Our route is expected to be open as normal on this date. If you can bring your journey foward, we strongly recommend doing so.
• You can also use your tickets to travel later up to and including Tuesday 28 January. Please note that due to planned engineering between Peterborough and London King's Cross on Saturday 25 and Saturday 26 January, we will not be operating any direct services to or from London King's Cross and this should be considered if you are altering your travel plans. For further information about this engineering and the impact on our usual timetable, please see here.

Tickets will be valid between the two stations listed on your original ticket and in the same class of travel. Where possible, we recommend making a new seat reservation.

Avanti:

If you are due to travel north of Preston or on our North Wales route on Friday 24 January, then your existing ticket can be used on any Avanti West Coast service via the same route from Thursday 23 January until the end of service on Sunday 26 January.

Alternatively, if you abandoned your journey as a result of the disruption, then you can claim a fee free refund from where you bought your ticket. If you continued with your journey but were delayed by 15 minutes or more, you can claim Delay Repay compensation from the train company you travelled with.

 

[Cross City]

Not to be flippant about it, but people do have their own free will and there is some element of individual responsibility whilst there's just a few people at each TOC responsible for customer information, on top of the day job. The information will trickle through even if some don't find it fast enough.

Maybe they should do better when something like a red weather warning happens. That trumps absolutely everything else.

LNER are saying don't travel north of York and Avanti saying not north of Preston, which seems reasonably clear. Both TOCs suggesting either full refunds or moving your journey back/forward -1/+2 days

LNEr have said that NO trains will run after 11am north of Newcastle. Avanti are yet to mention that the line will be closed and are still 'advising' people not to travel, not that they CAN'T travel.

Big difference.

Is that not what saying Do Not Travel on the affected date is doing? Can't get much more explicit than that, surely?

It's advice, and could suggest that trains might still run. DO NOT TRAVEL does not mean YOU CANNOT TRAVEL.

 

[Horizon22]

Maybe they should do better when something like a red weather warning happens. That trumps absolutely everything else.

Such as? Where are you going to get additional trained staff in at 24h notice?

You are asking for perfection in a rapidly evolving situation. This all takes time. See LNER:

Trains are currently still showing in Journey Planners as we work to amend our timetable

.

 

[Statto]

Maybe they should do better when something like a red weather warning happens. That trumps absolutely everything else.



LNEr have said that NO trains will run after 11am north of Preston. Avanti are yet to mention that the line will be closed and are still 'advising' people not to travel, not that they CAN'T travel.

Big difference.

LNER don't serve Preston, don't you mean Newcastle or AWC who do serve Preston.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Agreed, they should be. Which is why the TOCs should be quicker to say "There are no trains tomorrow, get home today or wait it out safely until the weekend'.

Rather than whatever wishy washy nonsense they're coming out with now like 'we strongly advise people not to travel'.

They are saying "DO NOT TRAVEL". That's about as strong an instruction as possible, and it is a specific wording that triggers specific things e.g. ticket acceptance on other days.

It went from Yellow, to Amber, to Red in less than 20 hours

Amber is still a high level of warning suggesting you should probably at least think about changing plans. Red just means "you might die if you're out in it".

 

[Cross City]

Such as? Where are you going to get additional trained staff in at 24h notice?

Redistribute duties. Every other job in the country will be able to prioritise things. Nothing is more important that helping people out of a red warning.

LNER don't serve Preston, don't you mean Newcastle or AWC who do serve Preston.

Correct amended