Strange TFL journey planner route

[Leisurefirst]

Hi,
Anybody know why on earth TFL's Journey Planner instructs you when checking a journey from say Ladbroke Grove to North Greenwich to change at Paddington, spend "five" (ahem) minutes changing to the Bakerloo then change again at Baker Street for the Jubilee rather than just changing at Baker Street only???
I doubt this would be any quicker never mind way less convenient, (I know the change at Baker Street is a bit of a trek too).

 

[IanD]

I've given up trying to work out why TfL's journey planner suggests some of the routes it comes up with.

 

[LLivery]

Just yesterday I was complaining about it.

A friend wanted to go from Sydenham to Feltham and before asking me they looked at the TfL planner. Instead of suggesting Sydenham -> Clapham Jun -> Feltham which seemed obvious to me, it claimed Sydenham -> Canada Water -> Waterloo -> Feltham was quicker. So I had a look and unticked LO and LU from the mode of services and the way I would take came up, with the planner admitting it had a faster journey time. The planner seems to be programmed to encourage you to use TfL services and pay more by going through zone 1 while being dishonest claiming it's a quicker route. The other option wasn't even given without me changing the settings.

 

[PeterC]

I often find that traveline gives a better result.

 

[Leisurefirst]

I only discovered their favoured route because I had a near 15 minute wait for a H&C or Circle one evening this week and with regard to a possible refund claim checked to see how long the journey should take.
Was amused/annoyed at their suggestion.
Thankfully I am not a visitor!
Also does bonkers things with buses too like not recommending a direct, frequent bus that takes about 15 minutes but instead telling you to get a bus in the opposite direction and cross the road to change to another bus which runs about half as often. London buses always run on time, don't forget! Could potentially take about three times as long!

 

[theageofthetra]

It's useless and will also try and maximise TFL revenue when better NR options exist. As another poster said it will try and send you via Z1 to maximise revenue too.

Use Citymapper ,UK Bus info or just Google maps route planning- any are preferable to this bloated, Ad laden and painfully slow planner.

 

[duncanp]

The TfL journey planner is pants.

I once asked it for a route from South Kensington to Liverpool Street with the option "fastest journey time" selected, and it said take the Piccadilly Line to Green Park, the Victoria Line to Oxford Circus and then the Central Line, with a total journey time of 26 minutes. When I selected "route with the least changes" it came up with the direct route via the Circle Line, and a journey time of 24 minutes.

Even more ridiculous than that, I asked it for a journey from Euston to Holborn using bus only. It suggested getting a bus from Euston to Waterloo, and then another bus from Waterloo to Holborn. But the bus from Euston to Waterloo goes through Holborn anyway.

I think the journey planner is programmed to manage passenger flows by keeping them away from busy sections of the network. In the example above, sending someone on an indirect route to Liverpool Street may free up space on the Circle Line during rush hour, although the Victoria and Central lines are not exactly quiet either.

 

[PeterC]

It now seems horribly slow compared with Traveline, probably because it is putting a lot of resource into finding walking and cycling routes. The only saving grace of the current version is that it seems to have stopped insisting that National Express is suitable for local bus journeys north from Finchley Road Station.

 

[duncanp]

And it always seems to favour the Heathrow Express if you ask it to get to and from Heathrow.

I just asked it for Kings Cross to Heathrow Terminal 5 this coming Monday, and it said get the Met/Circle/H&C to Baker Street, then the Bakerloo line to Paddington, and then the Heathrow Express.

What a load of rubbish. If it is going to send you from Kings Cross to Heathrow via Paddington, why doesn't it suggest you go directly from Kings Cross to Paddington without changing?

 

[Leisurefirst]

Thanks everybody.
Good to know it's not just me!
Coupled with (not all, I know) many of the bus drivers embarrassing lack of knowledge glad I'm not a visitor!

 

[Busaholic]

Thanks everybody.
Good to know it's not just me!
Coupled with (not all, I know) many of the bus drivers embarrassing lack of knowledge glad I'm not a visitor!

In my job interview with London Transport I was asked to state (roughly) where the following places were situated: Hacton, Heston, Hoxton, Whetstone, Whyteleafe. Luckily, I knew all five, though I think one omission would have been allowed.

 

[urbophile]

I found the planner threw up several complicated solutions for a journey from Gipsy Hill to Greenwich. Unticking LU and LO then came up with the simple route (and if I'd looked at a map first I'd have worked it out myself) Southern to New Cross Gate then bus 177. That was much the quickest.

 

[telstarbox]

Any journey planner is only as good as the data fed into it. For example, Google Maps for a long time didn't offer the walk between Waterloo East and Waterloo main station and would send you on the Jubilee line at London Bridge instead. It looks like this has now been fixed.

They're also designed to an extent for the average or unfamiliar user - you might be able to make a tight connection if you know a station layout well and which carriage to alight from etc.

 

[Chris M]

A couple of weeks back I asked the journey planner how to get to Ray Street, EC1R. It told me it found more than one location matching ChIJ4awH9ZMCdkgRHLGelqnGemI and asked me to pick which I meant - Grangemill Way or Grangemill Road, both in Lewisham.
TfL never replied to my tweet about it
https://twitter.com/Thryduulf/status/1044181386670870528

 

[monxton]

Here's a counter-example: Waterloo to Bow Road, a journey I make regularly using the W&C to Bank, Central to Mile End, then the "across the platform" change for one stop on the District/H&C, a route recommended by the TfL journey planner. I just checked today's history, and it was 18 minutes from checkin at Waterloo to checkout at Bow Road.

Traveline does not offer this route, perhaps because it counts as two changes, even through one is inconsequential. It suggests either Northern to Embankment and District to Bow Road, or Jubilee to West Ham, then District/H&C back to Bow Road, either of which it says will take 26 or 27 mins.

 

[PeterC]

Here's a counter-example: Waterloo to Bow Road, a journey I make regularly using the W&C to Bank, Central to Mile End, then the "across the platform" change for one stop on the District/H&C, a route recommended by the TfL journey planner. I just checked today's history, and it was 18 minutes from checkin at Waterloo to checkout at Bow Road.

Traveline does not offer this route, perhaps because it counts as two changes, even through one is inconsequential. It suggests either Northern to Embankment and District to Bow Road, or Jubilee to West Ham, then District/H&C back to Bow Road, either of which it says will take 26 or 27 mins.

Traveline just offered me multiple routes with a default starting point in York Road near bus stop W for tomorrow (W&C being closed on Sundays). Your route was the fastest recommended at 19 minutes excluding walking time from York Road.

 

[monxton]

Traveline just offered me multiple routes with a default starting point in York Road near bus stop W for tomorrow (W&C being closed on Sundays). Your route was the fastest recommended at 19 minutes excluding walking time from York Road.

That's odd. I don't have any special options set in Traveline, though my start point is Waterloo national rail, not the stop in York Road.

I got those results from the trendy web interface at https://www.traveline.info/. I just tried the old-fashioned interface at http://www.travelinesoutheast.org.uk/, and that did offer me the route via W&C to Bank, as well as the routes from the other Traveline router. It likes to suggest walking too, so it includes walking to Embankment from Waterloo and taking the District, or walking to my destination from Mile End, either of which I'd be willing to do except that they don't save any time.

So it seems that it is not just a different interface to the same routing algorithm, but actually a different system.