SWR class 444 displaying two digit headcode - new?

[akm]

Yesterday I saw SWR working 2P50 https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:L51843/2025-06-04 (forming the 1510 Haslemere to London Waterloo) on arrival at Waterloo. I was surprised to see a two digit former-Southern-Region-style headcode displaying on the matrix panels on the sides:



Apologies I wasn't able to do a better job with the reflection.

According to https://sremg.org.uk/headcodes/eheadcodes/eheadcodes01.html, 73 was (at least at one time) the headcode for "Waterloo - Portsmouth & Southsea (slow) via Worplesdon", which sort of fits. Unfortunately I was unable to see if the outbound working changed to a suitable headcode for a Portsmouth fast...

Is this new (with nationalisation?) or just something that SWR have always done and I've never noticed?

 

[lxfe_mxtterz]

It has always been done and is a manual input done by the guard using the custom text option on the PIS panel. There are quite a few guards who tend to do this.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

Is there any benefit of headcodes being more publicly visible again? On the Central division the 455s never displayed them, unlike their counterparts on the south western, so I always wondered what the numbers meant in the destination blinds.

 

[swt_passenger]

Is there any benefit of headcodes being more publicly visible again? On the Central division the 455s never displayed them, unlike their counterparts on the south western, so I always wondered what the numbers meant in the destination blinds.

Not really IMHO, the codes date from a period when much of the rolling stock of the time was unable to show the actual destination station. So overtaken by better technology.

However every now and again we have another thread starts because someone thinks they’re essential…

 

[wickham]

The real purpose of 2 digit headcodes (or more correctly route indications) was to tell the signalmen which route the train was taking and they were shown in the front of the working timetable for each SR Division. Over time regular passengers became aware of the significance and of course they were very useful but that was not their intended audience. Don't forget in those early days there were no panel signalboxes or visual aids and the only way that signalmen could identify the route of a train was by the number displayed on the front !

 

[norbitonflyer]

Headcode are extremely useful.
A display on an up SWR service showing just "Waterloo" is both unnecessary and unhelpful.
It is obviously going to Waterloo.
What intending passengers need to know is where else it will call (if at all) en route - which is what a headcode can tell you.

 

[43096]

What intending passengers need to know is where else it will call (if at all) en route - which is what a headcode can tell you.

In this day and age, the PIS display on the platform and/or any number of apps on your phone will give you the same information in a far more user friendly way than deciphering a two digit route code.

 

[Peter Wilde]

I tend to disagree. Regular commuters get to know stuff like headcode numbers, and the information is far more at-a-glance accessible - just look at the train as it comes in, no need to walk to the platform display; or try to read small text on a moving on-train display; or dig a phone out of a pocket.

Most buses still have route numbers, for good reasons.

 

[brooklynbound]

Back in the 70's the wonderful green and cream next train boards moved by platform staff at my local stations all showed the code as well as the stopping pattern. I was always excited when a rare 47 was shown rather than 21/32 or 87/89.

 

[norbitonflyer]

In this day and age, the PIS display on the platform and/or any number of apps on your phone will give you the same information in a far more user friendly way than deciphering a two digit route code.

Maybe so, but we are discussing what is displayed on the train itself, and simply saying "Waterloo" is, as İ said, neither necessary nor helpful.

 

[NSEWonderer]

I used to remember some desiros would on the side matrix panels mention London Waterloo Fast Service or Stopping Service, I cant remember if they do that now.

 

[Concorde9289]

On the Saturday before the nationalisation at Putney or Wandsworth Town, there was a class 450 showing "SWR 2017-2025". On the Lymington branch, "Lymington Flyer" is often displayed.

 

[boiledbeans2]

I used to remember some desiros would on the side matrix panels mention London Waterloo Fast Service or Stopping Service, I cant remember if they do that now.

Yeah, right before COVID, I remember it would show Poole Stopping Service (or similar - can't remember exact wording). After COVID, that service got pulled.

Anyway, on 15th May 2025, I saw a Class 450 with "Waterloo via Epsom 16" on the side displays - see attached photo.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Jun 2025 ==

Also, I believe there's more than one way of displaying the destination on the side?
On the Desiro's side display, sometimes I see "Portsmouth & Southsea" displayed in full over 2 lines.
Other times, I see "P'mth & S'Sea" (or similar - can't remember exact wording) displayed in large font in 1 line.

 

[sad1e]

Is this a feature of all desiros?

I know I've definitely seen 345's with headcodes on the side , same with 450's and 444's (albeit 345s display their full headcode not a 2 digit one)

I've never seen it done on 185's, 350's, 360's or 380's though, do they have the functionality albeit unused or is the PIS on them not capable of displaying a headcode .

 

[MCR247]

Is this a feature of all desiros?

I know I've definitely seen 345's with headcodes on the side , same with 450's and 444's (albeit 345s display their full headcode not a 2 digit one)

I've never seen it done on 185's, 350's, 360's or 380's though, do they have the functionality albeit unused or is the PIS on them not capable of displaying a headcode .

As I understand it, the feature is that the TMS allows train crew to ‘freetype’ the displays, rather than displaying route codes (which are different to headcodes)

 

[Russel]

Headcode are extremely useful.
A display on an up SWR service showing just "Waterloo" is both unnecessary and unhelpful.
It is obviously going to Waterloo.
What intending passengers need to know is where else it will call (if at all) en route - which is what a headcode can tell you.

Maybe 20+ years ago this would have all been relevant...

However, in 2025, all that is needed is a "via" added into the display.

 

[adc82140]

I remember that the Ditra system at Surbiton used to announce the Alton trains as "The Alton Service Route Code 52". It was only the Alton trains that got this treatment, and I have no idea why.

 

[supervc-10]

I feel like using the two lines to say:

London Waterloo
Stopping Service

or

London Waterloo
Semi-Fast Service

or whatever would be a good option. Simple and gives that indication of calling pattern.

I quite like the way some trains (Pendos, 345s for example) give a 'next stop' indication too. As @norbitonflyer points out - everything heading east on the SWML is going to Waterloo! But if you know the next stop is Woking and you're on the platform at Basingstoke, then you know this train isn't going to be calling at Farnborough.

 

[Snow1964]

It is more relevant at places when there is mix of stopping, semi-fast, fast services, and where trains can take multiple routes towards Waterloo.

Was definitely useful in the past (and at outer ends of platforms at some stations even now) as there are parts of 10-12 car platforms where the station destination screens cannot be seen from.

Unfortunately when SWT installed most of the platform displays, they skimped and often didn't add duplicates further along platforms, so displaying it on train is only way a boarding passenger might know what the train is, unless they huddle in certain parts of platforms (which delays boarding).

 

[QSK19]

Is this a feature of all desiros?

I know I've definitely seen 345's with headcodes on the side , same with 450's and 444's (albeit 345s display their full headcode not a 2 digit one)

I've never seen it done on 185's, 350's, 360's or 380's though, do they have the functionality albeit unused or is the PIS on them not capable of displaying a headcode .

Can’t recall ever seeing them on the 360s

 

[NSEWonderer]

Yeah manual messages you can input a custom message on the displays. The 16 and 73s aren't headcodes but route codes.

 

[robert west]

As I understand it, the feature is that the TMS allows train crew to ‘freetype’ the displays, rather than displaying route codes (which are different to headcodes)

Have seen a 360 when first on test runs on the great eastern at Romford have the head code on the side
It was either a 5g or 5q headcode

 

[43096]

Yeah manual messages you can input a custom message on the displays. The 16 and 73s aren't headcodes but route codes.

But it is utterly pointless some crank driver or guard using them as 99.9% of the public won't know what they mean as they fell out of use 20+ years ago when the slam door fleet was retired. If it is going to be of use, it needs to be done consistently and the meaning needs to be communicated publicly.

 

[NSEWonderer]

But it is utterly pointless some crank driver or guard using them as 99.9% of the public won't know what they mean as they fell out of use 20+ years ago when the slam door fleet was retired. If it is going to be of use, it needs to be done consistently and the meaning needs to be communicated publicly.

Yeah, certainly didn't know about the numbers till this thread. If i was insistent on using manual messages id be inputing on the side dest at the very least if its a Fast Service Or Stopping Service below the Intended Destination.

 

[driverd]

Is this new (with nationalisation?) or just something that SWR have always done and I've never noticed?

To answer the question (and avoid a debate about the merit or otherwise of route codes), no, it's not new or official. Its an overzealous member of staff who has a thing for nostalgia, getting a bit carried away and displaying some additional unnecessary/confusing/meaningless info on the screen. In my view, completely unprofessional - sure you can do this stuff on a preserved railway, but as this topic demonstrates, on the big railway it just causes confusion.

 

[nw1]

Yesterday I saw SWR working 2P50 https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:L51843/2025-06-04 (forming the 1510 Haslemere to London Waterloo) on arrival at Waterloo. I was surprised to see a two digit former-Southern-Region-style headcode displaying on the matrix panels on the sides:

View attachment 181422

Apologies I wasn't able to do a better job with the reflection.

According to https://sremg.org.uk/headcodes/eheadcodes/eheadcodes01.html, 73 was (at least at one time) the headcode for "Waterloo - Portsmouth & Southsea (slow) via Worplesdon", which sort of fits. Unfortunately I was unable to see if the outbound working changed to a suitable headcode for a Portsmouth fast...

Is this new (with nationalisation?) or just something that SWR have always done and I've never noticed?

Interesting. They seem to be using the "final days of slam-door" codes which only lasted maybe a couple of years.
73s used to call at the intermediate stations between Woking and Surbiton, which are skipped by most current Portsmouth services - but was later, for a short time, used for services which went fast Woking-Clapham, which were formerly 72.

If they want to be truly authentic they should have used 72.

Never seen it myself but interesting to see nonetheless.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jun 2025 ==

In this day and age, the PIS display on the platform and/or any number of apps on your phone will give you the same information in a far more user friendly way than deciphering a two digit route code.

As a pre-teen back in the day I was quite able to quickly understand the concept of route codes when first introduced to them.

If you think about it, they're much the same concept as bus route numbers.

 

[wickham]

Maybe so, but we are discussing what is displayed on the train itself, and simply saying "Waterloo" is, as İ said, neither necessary nor helpful.

Not so sure about this statement, if you are standing on the up platform at Fratton for instance the trains could be heading for any number of destinations in addition to Waterloo - in fact Waterloo is the minority destination, try Southampton, Brighton, London Victoria, Littlehampton or even Cardiff for instance !

 

[Mikey C]

To answer the question (and avoid a debate about the merit or otherwise of route codes), no, it's not new or official. Its an overzealous member of staff who has a thing for nostalgia, getting a bit carried away and displaying some additional unnecessary/confusing/meaningless info on the screen. In my view, completely unprofessional - sure you can do this stuff on a preserved railway, but as this topic demonstrates, on the big railway it just causes confusion.

Harsh to say it causes confusion, as the number is in addition to the destination AND the various screens and announcements inside the train.

Most people would ignore them.

 

[driverd]

Harsh to say it causes confusion, as the number is in addition to the destination AND the various screens and announcements inside the train.

Most people would ignore them.

This whole topic is proof its raised enough of a question mark for atleast one person to post a topic, wondering what on earth it was

 

[NSEWonderer]

This whole topic is proof its raised enough of a question mark for atleast one person to post a topic, wondering what on earth it was

To be fair, op posted the topic knowing where it came from, but was intrested to know if it may be a returning thing. But agreed its not something company instructs to do.