Tamper Fire Dunton Green 23/4

[jnjkerbin]

Appears to be a fairly significant fire on some sort of OTM, just south of Dunton Green station. At least 5 or 6 fire trucks in attendance + police.

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[TU9120]

Not my photo, but it appears to be a Balfour Beatty Matisa.

 

[2HAP]

Looks like an MPV to me. It'll be a write-off for sure.

 

[DarloRich]

Looks like an MPV to me. It'll be a write-off for sure.

It isnt an mpv. The above picture clearly shows that

 

[2HAP]

Cab looks a bit like one to me, but I stand corrected. Thanks, @DarloRich .

 

[galwhv69]

Would it have been this?

Realtime Trains - 651N 0445 Lower Sydenham to Three Bridges Voyager M.D.

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[jfowkes]

Video on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/HammertimeLH44/status/1385459583674617856?s=19

 

[TU9120]

Cab looks a bit like one to me, but I stand corrected. Thanks, @DarloRich

It’s definitely a Balfour Beatty Matisa one of the B-66uc’s I think

 

[FrodshamJnct]

DR75410 is the tamper involved.

 

[DoubleO]

It's a Matisa B41 tamper, which coincidentally is the same type of machine as the VolkerRail one that burned out at Knaresborough a few years ago....

 

[jnjkerbin]

GBRf's 66752 now towing the tamper towards Sevenoaks at walking pace.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

It’s definitely a Balfour Beatty Matisa one of the B-66uc’s I think

now its a O-ffuc’d

XD

 

[Horizon22]

Apparently this was started initially by leaking hydraulic fluid. This has leaked onto platforms as well at the station.

 

[DoubleO]

Apparently this was started initially by leaking hydraulic fluid. This has leaked onto platforms as well at the station.

Highly unlikely to be started by a hydraulic leak.

 

[millemille]

Highly unlikely to be started by a hydraulic leak.

Why's that?

 

[Geeves]

hydraulic fluid has a very high ignition temperature, that's not to say it wont help once the fire is hot enough.

 

[Broken70]

Apparently this was started initially by leaking hydraulic fluid. This has leaked onto platforms as well at the station.

As far as can be seen by evidence above the vehicle was out of the platforms at the time of the incident.

 

[Oxfordblues]

I'm sure our friends at West Ealing can supply a replacement if required.

 

[Bigfoot]

A hydraulic leak could cause a pump to run dry and then become very very hot very quickly if unnoticed (although I would think that a machine as complex as this would have systems to detect this kind of issue)as the hydraulic oil is quite often used to also cool components. Potentially causing enough heat to start a fire of accumulated grease/grime etc. Then once hot enough the hydraulic oil has the potential to add fuel to the fire.

 

[westcoaster]

hydraulic fluid has a very high ignition temperature, that's not to say it wont help once the fire is hot enough.

But if it is spraying over very hot components ( engine/ running gear/brake pads, or all sorts of gubbings on a tamper it can lead to a fire.) Reports of fluid all over the platform could show some kind of high pressure leak.

 

[Dunfanaghy Rd]

Would the hydraulics be pressurised while in Travel mode?
Pat

 

[Horizon22]

As far as can be seen by evidence above the vehicle was out of the platforms at the time of the incident.

But it may have been leaking prior to the fire.

 

[DarloRich]

I'm sure our friends at West Ealing can supply a replacement if required.

If it is a Mattisa you might have to ask them to ring Switzerland and send new one over.

West Ealing is Plasser isnt it?

 

[DoubleO]

The components on that machine that would get hot enough to potentially create a fire risk are all enclosed in a fireproof 'room', separate to the majority of the hydraulics, hydraulic tank, fuel tank etc etc. The brakes would generate very little heat especially when the machine was working (although we don't know if it was working or not). The traction is hydrostatic so a lot of the hydraulic system is working under high pressure whenever the machine is moving. For a component to run dry for long enough to overheat to the point of catching fire would be pretty much impossible without the crew noticing and/or being notified by an onboard alarm. Any leak seen could be a coincidence, it could have been a fuel leak, it could have been leaking from a component already damaged by the fire in the moments before the crew realised etc etc. It's not impossible that a hydraulic leak has caused the fire but it is highly unlikely.

If it is a Mattisa you might have to ask them to ring Switzerland and send new one over.

West Ealing is Plasser isnt it?

All correct

 

[jnjkerbin]

The components on that machine that would get hot enough to potentially create a fire risk are all enclosed in a fireproof 'room', separate to the majority of the hydraulics, hydraulic tank, fuel tank etc etc. The brakes would generate very little heat especially when the machine was working (although we don't know if it was working or not). The traction is hydrostatic so a lot of the hydraulic system is working under high pressure whenever the machine is moving. For a component to run dry for long enough to overheat to the point of catching fire would be pretty much impossible without the crew noticing and/or being notified by an onboard alarm. Any leak seen could be a coincidence, it could have been a fuel leak, it could have been leaking from a component already damaged by the fire in the moments before the crew realised etc etc. It's not impossible that a hydraulic leak has caused the fire but it is highly unlikely.



All correct

There were no engineering works on this section of line last night, and the time of the first call (as reported by Kent Fire & Rescue here) would suggest that this was the train involved, which seems to have been returning from a worksite near Lower Sydenham.

 

[Dan17H]

I attended this on behalf of NWRs route control to check the condition of any surrounding structures that may have been affected.

Obviously I can't say too much as it's under investigation but it's been towed to a yard for a joint investigation by Kent Fire/RAIB/BTP.

By the look of things it's a write off, but lucky in the respect that it didn't happen in Sevenoaks Tunnel.

The response by all involved was exemplary, and I managed to bump into my old fire crew which was a bonus.

 

[millemille]

hydraulic fluid has a very high ignition temperature, that's not to say it wont help once the fire is hot enough.

Not when it's in aerosol form from a pin hole in a high pressure system.

 

[spark001uk]

I attended this on behalf of NWRs route control to check the condition of any surrounding structures that may have been affected.

Obviously I can't say too much as it's under investigation but it's been towed to a yard for a joint investigation by Kent Fire/RAIB/BTP.

By the look of things it's a write off, but lucky in the respect that it didn't happen in Sevenoaks Tunnel.

The response by all involved was exemplary, and I managed to bump into my old fire crew which was a bonus.

Was the damage to the track minimal then? I see service resumed around lunchtime.

 

[John Webb]

Not when it's in aerosol form from a pin hole in a high pressure system.

The same effect can happen from a leak on the fuel injection system of a diesel. In both cases the very fine droplets absorb heat very quickly and ready vaporise to ignite easily compared to the small amount of vapour from even an ordinary spill of these liquids.

 

[DelW]

Is this likely to have any significant impact on track maintenance programmes?

I have no idea how many tampers there are in the country, or hence what fraction of that fleet one machine represents. I assume that manufacturers don't have a "showroom" of new machines awaiting buyers, so it will presumably be a while before this one is either replaced or repaired.