TfW 15x/17x withdrawals (17x now finished)

[craigybagel]

So, do we know what will be next to start going ? 150’s or 153’s I would assume ?

Neither will be completely gone anytime soon. 150s are needed for the Valleys until the tram trains come in as they're the only units in the fleet able to work North of Radyr. 153s are being kept for the HOWL so they won't be leaving completely either.

What I do suspect might happen is the operating areas of those fleets will start to shrink - 150s will stop coming North (as I've mentioned a few times already, training for new drivers in the North on 150s is no longer happening) and we'll hopefully see a reduction in 153 use in general as well.

 

[liamf656]

So, do we know what will be next to start going ? 150’s or 153’s I would assume ?

It's been discussed many times that the 153s are staying for Heart of Wales. It'll be a toss up between the 150s and 158s as they are both still needed at the moment, as the 150s are the only ones that can work the Valley Lines and the 158s can't go until some ERTMS 196s enter servicd

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Neither will be completely gone anytime soon. 150s are needed for the Valleys until the tram trains come in as they're the only units in the fleet able to work North of Radyr. 153s are being kept for the HOWL so they won't be leaving completely either.

Apart from, hopefully, 756s soon.

 

[craigybagel]

Apart from, hopefully, 756s soon.

Hopefully, if it turns out they have the range for it without the completed electrification. And if they can be cleared up to the top of the valleys - have they been tested beyond Taffs Well yet? I'm not fully up to date on everything that happens on the Valleys.

 

[Rhydgaled]

Apart from, hopefully, 756s soon.

Hopefully, if it turns out they have the range for it without the completed electrification. And if they can be cleared up to the top of the valleys - have they been tested beyond Taffs Well yet? I'm not fully up to date on everything that happens on the Valleys.

I think it has been reported over on the 231/756 topic that both classes of TfW FLIRT have done test runs at least as far as Pontypridd, and perhaps further.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I’m sure at least one of them have been to Aberdare? Probably a discussion for the 231/756 or Metro updates threads if we’re going to take it into this level of detail, though. I was simply saying 150s won’t be the only stock allowed up there for too long.

150s should be gone before 158s, because I believe the 398s are due in service (from mid 2024) before the ETMRS 197s (Dec 24-May 25)

 

[anthony263]

I think it has been reported over on the 231/756 topic that both classes of TfW FLIRT have done test runs at least as far as Pontypridd, and perhaps further.

A class 231 has been to Aberdare and to Merthyr Tydfil. Ones been to Maesteg too.

I've got a photo of one at Mountain Ash

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

A class 231 has been to Aberdare and to Merthyr Tydfil. Ones been to Maesteg too.

I've got a photo of one at Mountain Ash

Maesteg is a different kettle of fish as that's actually a route the 231 was ordered for, of course.

Meanwhile, to get back onto the subject of the 15x/175 withdrawals as per the thread, I'm just wondering if the now widespread roll out of 197s will allow for more 150s to be doubled on the very overcrowded Pontypridds, rather than them starting to be withdrawn slowly.

Also, has any publication or TfW themselves (X excluded) stated that the 175s are finished yet? We know they are, but the Wikipedia mob will insist that the 175 and TfW Rail Services Wikipedia pages remain erroneous and outdated until there is this sort of printed confirmation.

 

[craigybagel]

I’m sure at least one of them have been to Aberdare? Probably a discussion for the 231/756 or Metro updates threads if we’re going to take it into this level of detail, though. I was simply saying 150s won’t be the only stock allowed up there for too long.

150s should be gone before 158s, because I believe the 398s are due in service (from mid 2024) before the ETMRS 197s (Dec 24-May 25)

Fair enough. I guess like I said it'll come down to whether or not 756s have the range. But yes it would appear that the 150s do have a replacement lined up sooner than the 158s at time.

Maesteg is a different kettle of fish as that's actually a route the 231 was ordered for, of course.

Meanwhile, to get back onto the subject of the 15x/175 withdrawals as per the thread, I'm just wondering if the now widespread roll out of 197s will allow for more 150s to be doubled on the very overcrowded Pontypridds, rather than them starting to be withdrawn slowly.

Good question. Hopefully it does, but there's only so much stabling space available in and around Cardiff, and sooner or later 150s will need moving out to make space for the new fleet. Taffs Well should help a lot with that too though, since most of the 150s replacements will be based there rather than Canton.

Also, has any publication or TfW themselves (X excluded) stated that the 175s are finished yet? We know they are, but the Wikipedia mob will insist that the 175 and TfW Rail Services Wikipedia pages remain erroneous and outdated until there is this sort of printed confirmation.

Nothing that's made it to traincrew level yet anyway. As far as we're concerned, they're still on our traction cards so we can still work one if they turn up.

 

[33017]

Also, has any publication or TfW themselves (X excluded) stated that the 175s are finished yet? We know they are, but the Wikipedia mob will insist that the 175 and TfW Rail Services Wikipedia pages remain erroneous and outdated until there is this sort of printed confirmation.

The fleet stop list has an availability target of 0 for 0 diagrams with 0 actually available, plus a note stating “withdrawn”.

There’s no chance one will work a TfW passenger train again but there will almost certainly still be movements undertaken by TfW to transfer elsewhere the remaining units stored on TfW territory.

 

[Anonymous10]

Fair enough. I guess like I said it'll come down to whether or not 756s have the range. But yes it would appear that the 150s do have a replacement lined up sooner than the 158s at time.

Good question. Hopefully it does, but there's only so much stabling space available in and around Cardiff, and sooner or later 150s will need moving out to make space for the new fleet. Taffs Well should help a lot with that too though, since most of the 150s replacements will be based there rather than Canton.

Nothing that's made it to traincrew level yet anyway. As far as we're concerned, they're still on our traction cards so we can still work one if they turn up.

Surely it'd help if they kept some flirts at Rhymney and double 150s at Treherbert. Maybe Barry could also be used with Taff's well stabling them if need be while the roll out is ongoing ie have them in as many places as possible. But maintenance being done at canton?

 

[Liverpool 507]

I'm hoping to go to Chester during the week. Are any 175s still there?

 

[MP393]

I'm hoping to go to Chester during the week. Are any 175s still there?

175110 was in the sidings behind platform 7 earlier when I worked through there, with 175113 & 175115 in the shunt neck out towards Crewe/Manc.

 

[sd0733]

Nothing that's made it to traincrew level yet anyway. As far as we're concerned, they're still on our traction cards so we can still work one if they turn up.

There was a brief mention on Yammer with a few pictures and some of the people in the know had a last trip on them.
Shame really, it couldn't really have been lower key.

 

[33017]

There was a brief mention on Yammer with a few pictures and some of the people in the know had a last trip on them.
Shame really, it couldn't really have been lower key.

A real missed opportunity. I’m no unit crank but I’m sure something like a Chester-Holyhead-Cardiff-Manchester-Chester farewell for a 3 or 6 car would’ve gone down well.

 

[sd0733]

A real missed opportunity. I’m no unit crank but I’m sure something like a Chester-Holyhead-Cardiff-Manchester-Chester farewell for a 3 or 6 car would’ve gone down well.

It was asked about by a few people who would have been willing to work or volunteer on it but there was no replies!
It is a bit of a shame when there were farewell tours for the Pacers but the much wider travelled mainline fleets just disappear

 

[Anonymous10]

It was asked about by a few people who would have been willing to work or volunteer on it but there was no replies!
It is a bit of a shame when there were farewell tours for the Pacers but the much wider travelled mainline fleets just disappear

Possibly it's as the pacers if they broke down could be rescued with a 15x but if a 175 failed they'd need another 175.

 

[Bevan Price]

It was asked about by a few people who would have been willing to work or volunteer on it but there was no replies!
It is a bit of a shame when there were farewell tours for the Pacers but the much wider travelled mainline fleets just disappear

Perhaps they fear adverse publicity from the "media" about withdrawal of relatively new trains whilst there are national overcrowding problems , "short formations" and alleged shortage of trains???

 

[Cambrian359]

Perhaps they fear adverse publicity from the "media" about withdrawal of relatively new trains whilst there are national overcrowding problems , "short formations" and alleged shortage of trains???

This!
We must remember only a couple of months ago James prices said these trains were back in service and all was fine! when they were actually going off lease! Wouldn’t go down well to announce their departure now would it!

 

[sd0733]

Perhaps they fear adverse publicity from the "media" about withdrawal of relatively new trains whilst there are national overcrowding problems , "short formations" and alleged shortage of trains???

Id certainly think this is the likely answer. The pacers going was some good publicity, at the moment celebrating the withdrawal of 175s would go down like a lead balloon.

 

[Mordac]

So, do we know what will be next to start going ? 150’s or 153’s I would assume ?

The few remaining 170s I expect

 

[sd0733]

The last I knew of the plan was that any residual mainline 150/158 work away from the Valleys for 150s and Cambrian/Holyhead-Bham for 158s will be next diagrams to go to 197s.

Not totally sure what's going on with 170s, lots of rumours with those at the moment.

AFAIK, the first units to be taken off lease is planned to be the Porterbrook 153 fleet, which aren't being retained, that's a while off yet though as from December the Mainline/West Wales branches fleet Will essentially be 153s and 197s supplemented by the Mk4s

 

[Rhydgaled]

The few remaining 170s I expect

How many of those are still left with TfW? They've not been mentioned on the threads I follow for a while so I kinda assumed they'd all gone.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

How many of those are still left with TfW? They've not been mentioned on the threads I follow for a while so I kinda assumed they'd all gone.

Three.

 

[anthony263]

Heres 170208 at Cardiff Central last night on the 1943 service to Maesteg. These units will definitely be missed

 

[LowLevel]

The suggestion is that the 170s will move to EMR by next May, things have been pushed back somewhat. That is what EMR are planning for anyway.

As ever these things have a habit of changing of course.

 

[Rhydgaled]

Three.

The suggestion is that the 170s will move to EMR by next May, things have been pushed back somewhat. That is what EMR are planning for anyway.

As ever these things have a habit of changing of course.

Thanks to you both for the updates; with only three left it surprises me that they could still be with TfW for another six months; the last few 175s seem to have disappeared much quicker than that.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Thanks to you both for the updates; with only three left it surprises me that they could still be with TfW for another six months; the last few 175s seem to have disappeared much quicker than that.

Porterbrook and Angel, different ROSCOs, different destinations, etc.

 

[Anonymous10]

Thanks to you both for the updates; with only three left it surprises me that they could still be with TfW for another six months; the last few 175s seem to have disappeared much quicker than that.

May also be that 170s can be rescued by 15x stock which is common on the mainline at the moment.

 

[158841]

Anyone wanting a good shot of a 175, 175110 is pride of place in the sidings off platform 7 at Chester, the last 175 at Chester it seems as the rest have now gone.