Thameslink Programme, South Central & South Eastern area fleet cascades etc

[mackenzie_blu]

Ive put up a video of the final passanger train leaving Moorgate on Flickr now for anyone to watch. I was also there for the final train of the bays at Blackfriars. Now its been done its all about destorying and rebuilding stations now.

As for 377207 in passanger service on friday, it didn't go well. There was at somepoint during the jounery a major issue. So major they planned to do a 377 through the core around 2000. Now with being in the Core at this time I have to say I didn't see it so it might not have run.

For Moorgate pictures, Ive got a folder on Flickr so just click on the link to see them. Im going to upload some more from the final night including what hapened when the public left!

 

[Edvid]

Shame I couldn't be there last night, but I'm glad the send-off was a success.

As for the 377 doors, rumour has it that on Wednesday the system used to communicate with track balises (as a substitute for GPS in underground stations) was already isolated, hence the drivers having to open the doors themselves.

One of the units was seen passing south through Farringdon last night by the way.

 

[Julian G]

Good news, 7504 is being dragged to Selhurst today behind 66024 and 7203+7209 are making their way up to Cauldwell, Ta Tim & IH

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Shame I couldn't be there last night, but I'm glad the send-off was a success.

As for the 377 doors, rumour has it that on Wednesday the system used to communicate with track balises (as a substitute for GPS in underground stations) was already isolated, hence the drivers having to open the doors themselves.

One of the units was seen passing south through Farringdon last night by the way.

Yes that was the issue on wednesday. The drivers tried to open the doors then have to do a manual override of the locks before opening at every station. This is why they were doing tests in the Core on friday to try and see if their fix was working. Hopefully it worked as if it doesn't then come monday there's going to be issues.

 

[73110]

Spotted two 377-5's last night at Selhurst, one was behind the new shed testing it's pans and the other was stopped in the wash road between two barrier wagons behind a class 67.

Also noted 203 and 209 sitting in the platform loop at London Bridge around 1220am. Interestingly they had Bedford on the front and rear and the side window displays had the stopping pattern scrolling along.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Spotted two 377-5's last night at Selhurst, one was behind the new shed testing it's pans and the other was stopped in the wash road between two barrier wagons behind a class 67.

Also noted 203 and 209 sitting in the platform loop at London Bridge around 1220am. Interestingly they had Bedford on the front and rear and the side window displays had the stopping pattern scrolling along.

They need to test the CIS system as there's been been issues with that along with the doors. I know Ive brought it up with fleet and others. Hopefully this means the end of the the next station being displayed, ie at St Pancras showing St Albans causing confusion among everyone!

 

[73110]

Ahh, I wondered what they were doing there. Do you know if they went north?

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Ahh, I wondered what they were doing there. Do you know if they went north?

I don't, sorry. Will enquire on monday.

 

[Tom C]

The track has already been removed from the bays. All the shops behind the gateline were pulled down last night and the Pauls Walk entrance should have now been commissioned. I got a guided tour by Balfour Beatty and concidering the seemingly short amount of time they had to built it they have done a very good job.

 

[Edvid]

This morning was certainly interesting, but I'll say more when I have the time. 206+207 were on the 0600 from Bedford and the 'simulated' GPS worked a treat, including at StP where I got off before making further stops at the next three TL core stations.

208+201 were on the 0609 from Bearsted and 203+209 on the 0623 from Ashford International. I didn't stay around to see the rest of the 377s - I presume 204+213 were on the 0729 from Rochester but what did the 0420 from Bedford and the 0724 from Brighton operate with (if at all)?

501? 504? Both?

 

[westcoaster]

501 is beleived to be at cauldwell, 317's did not come out to playand are still at bedford, the 317 diagram is an EITHER/ OR diagram in the morning peak so in reality you may only see them in the evening peak.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Neither 501 or 504 was out in passanger service today. However 377501 was on test today. I managed to get an image of the unit southbound at Blackfriars and a video of it running fast through St Pancras International.

Ive also been told that the first 377/5 in passanger service will be 377504 and its coming into service tomorrow, 24th March 2009 running like this

0210 Bedford - St Pancras International
0358 St Pancras International - Bedford
0540 Bedford - Brighton
0816 Brighton - Bedford
1410 Bedford - Brighton
1709 Brighton - London Bridge
1842 London Bridge - Brighton
2007 Brighton - Bedford

**edit**

Forgot to mention that the 377/2 were in the following pairs

206 + 207
208 + 201
203 + 209
204 + 213

377501 had 2+2 seating throughout the entire unit

 

[daccer]

That is a very long diagram. Any idea of the kind of mileage that those units will running daily?

 

[Edvid]

A sizeable number of the pre-KO0 319/4 diagrams were in excess of 700 miles, I'll let you know about the current ones if they're published in full.

Headed back to Blackfriars this afternoon. I saw 501 shortly after 1324 when 203+209 left for Bedford as planned and figured that today's 377 diagrams were not all operating as scheduled, then I waited for the next unit to get back home which was 204 by itself (213 covering 377/5 diagram?), departing 1354.

Although 501 wasn't going to stop at Blackfriars it was held by a red signal on Platform 5 anyway so I got a few pics, and the intermediate coaches were definitely a mix of 2+2 and 2+3 - in the MOS the 2+2 layout was in the portion adjacent to the leading DMS and in the PMS it was under the pantograph.

As 204 approached approach to LTN I was expecting either 201 or 208 on Platform 1 for the 1436 (1410 from Bedford) but saw 319214 instead. I wonder where said 377s are now.

If 504 carries pax before 501 tomorrow :???:, presumably it's wheeling along elsewhere today? (Sorry.)

I'm not aware of any 317 diagrams in the mornings, they're only needed at that time if the 319s are overstretched.

Think I took 70 pics today so I'll find another place to publish them.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

A sizeable number of the pre-KO0 319/4 diagrams were in excess of 700 miles, I'll let you know about the current ones if they're published in full.

Headed back to Blackfriars this afternoon. I saw 501 shortly after 1324 when 203+209 left for Bedford as planned and figured that today's 377 diagrams were not all operating as scheduled, then I waited for the next unit to get back home which was 204 by itself (213 covering 377/5 diagram?), departing 1354.

Although 501 wasn't going to stop at Blackfriars it was held by a red signal on Platform 5 anyway so I got a few pics, and the intermediate coaches were definitely a mix of 2+2 and 2+3 - in the MOS the 2+2 layout was in the portion adjacent to the leading DMS and in the PMS it was under the pantograph.

As 204 approached approach to LTN I was expecting either 201 or 208 on Platform 1 for the 1436 (1410 from Bedford) but saw 319214 instead. I wonder where said 377s are now.

If 504 carries pax before 501 tomorrow :???:, presumably it's wheeling along elsewhere today? (Sorry.)

I'm not aware of any 317 diagrams in the mornings, they're only needed at that time if the 319s are overstretched.

Think I took 70 pics today so I'll find another place to publish them.

Im looking forward to seeing the pictures. I happened to be on the train infront of it at City so hopped put and went to St Pancras on the way home.

I don't honestly know if 504 was out and about today although this information comes from fleet and is what they had planned this morning.

Also Roger Ford's email suggests that the latest issue with the 377/5 is "weld quality problems with the fabricated beams from which the underfloor kit below the Class 377 is hung. Bombardier told me at Railtex that they were evaluating the welding issue and would probably develop a test and repair specification to minimise the impact on immediate deliveries."

As for the seating the DMOS (A & B) are 2+2, MOSL 2+2 and I was sure that the PTOSL was 2+2 tho at you can tell by the pictures the unit was moving at speed.

As for the current diagramed miles, well they are between 440.83 and 620.8 miles daily monday to friday. Weekend the Electrostars are allowed to rest.

Headcodes of tomorrows jounerys

2A04 0210 Bedford - St Pancras International
2G39 0358 St Pancras International - Bedford
1T05 0540 Bedford - Brighton
2W16 0816 Brighton - Bedford
1T39 1410 Bedford - Brighton
2B60 1709 Brighton - London Bridge
2B49 1842 London Bridge - Brighton
2T66 2007 Brighton - Bedford

 

[Edvid]

I may get on 504 at StP and if possible get a few pics of the seats. If 501 turns up in service instead that'll be even better because then I'll prove once and for all I'm right. I could have done that today but I was more interested in 'general' shots than the interior.

Think about it - if it was all 2+2 what would be the point of having two non-tip-up/non-folding types of seat in Standard Class? Also, all 377s from 140 onwards (or since 120?) except those originally classified as 375s have Govia-spec interiors, in less than 5 years the /5s will mix in wholly with older 377s so it's unlikely Govia want to change their own spec.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

I may get on 504 at StP and if possible get a few pics of the seats. If 501 turns up in service instead that'll be even better because then I'll prove once and for all I'm right. I could have done that today but I was more interested in 'general' shots than the interior.

Think about it - if it was all 2+2 what would be the point of having two non-tip-up/non-folding types of seat in Standard Class? Also, all 377s from 140 onwards (or since 120?) except those originally classified as 375s have Govia-spec interiors, in less than 5 years the /5s will mix in wholly with older 377s so it's unlikely Govia want to change their own spec.

Ive got to wait to get on the ex 1410 from Bedford. may ride the unit down to Brighton and back. Get a nice full test.

Im gonna try and get some pictures of the seating so we'll know for sure. Hopefully if I do end up at brighton with a 377/5 then I should get the chance to get some internal images when its empty.

 

[Edvid]

Funnily enough that's the same service I'm planning to get, though I'll only have a Travelcard for the journey.

To all who wish to check out this morning's events snapped by myself, click here.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Funnily enough that's the same service I'm planning to get, though I'll only have a Travelcard for the journey.

To all who wish to check out this morning's events snapped by myself, click here.

Have to let me know if you get on it. Not sure I fancy waiting around in work for it for a few hours!

 

[Edvid]

Today's 377 and 317 diagrams were published on UKmodernEMU, courtesy of mark302201 (minor layout alterations by myself included).

-----QUOTE-----

377201+377208 (BO603+BO604)
5E61 05+24 Ashford Yard - Bearsted
1E61 06:09 Bearsted - Bedford
2T25 08:54 Bedford - Brighton
1T20 11:34 Brighton - Bedford
2T47 14:24 Bedford - Brighton
1T96 17:04 Brighton - Bedford

377203+377209 (BO602+BO601)
5E63 06+04 Ashford Yard - Ashford
1E63 06:23 Ashford - Bedford
1T21 09:40 Bedford - Brighton
2T34 12:07 Brighton - Bedford
1S93 16:22 Bedford - Gillingham
5K94 18+52 Gilligham - Victoria

377204+377213 (BO611+BO610)
5K57 06+09 Victoria - Rochester
1E65 07:29 Rochester - Bedford
SPLIT
377204 (BO611)
1T23 10:10 Bedford - Brighton
2T36 12:37 Brighton - Bedford
377213 (NO DIAGRAM NUMBER) (Note - BO610 surely? Or am I missing something?)
5Z50 10+10 Bedford - Three Bridges
5Z77 12+14 Three Bridges - Bedford
ATTACH IN CS
1E74 16:46 Bedford - Ashford
5F27 19+40 Ashford - Ashford Yard

377206+377207 (BO608+BO609)
2T13 06:00 Bedford - Brighton
2T18 08:36 Brighton - Bedford
SPLIT
377206 (BO608 )
2T35 11:24 Bedford - Brighton
1T30 14:04 Brighton - Bedford
377207 (BO609)
1T29 11:40 Bedford - Brighton
2T42 14:07 Brighton - Bedford
ATTACH IN CS
1S76 17:00 Bedford - Gillingham
5K22 19:33 Gillingham - Victoria
2N22 20:48 Victoria - Ashford
5N22 22+00 Ashford - Ashford Yard


319s covering 377s:
319214 (BO605)
1T05 05:40 Bedford - Brighton
2W16 08:16 Brighton - Bedford
1T39 14:10 Bedford - Brighton
2B60 17:09 Brighton - London Bridge
2B49 18:42 London Bridge - Brighton
2T66 20:07 Brighton - Bedford

319424+319439 (BO606+BO607)
2T07 04:20 Bedford - Brighton
2W12 07:24 Brighton - Bedford
2T49 14:54 Bedford - Brighton
2T56 17:37 Brighton - Bedford


317 working:
317318+317337 (BO901+BO902)
5A73 15+56 Bedford CS - Moorgate
5A73 18+12 Moorgate - Farringdon
1G73 18:16 Farringdon - Bedford
5G73 19+26 Bedford - Bedford CS

-----END QUOTE-----

The extra diagram (BO605) took me by surprise, as did the slight differences in the other diagrams compared to what I expected. When FCC said they were expecting 3 377/5s in service from today, they did indeed plan 3 diagrams for them and not 2 as thought earlier.

One of those diagrams on any given day will likely be 319-operated for a few weeks, another I hope will be 377-operated very shortly and another (specifically BO605 tomorrow) should be operated by 504 as remarked earlier.

 

[westcoaster]

317 working:
317318+317337 (BO901+BO902)
5A73 15+56 Bedford CS - Moorgate
5A73 18+12 Moorgate - Farringdon
1G73 18:16 Farringdon - Bedford
5G73 19+26 Bedford - Bedford CS

as i said this morning the train can also come out in the morning peak due to non availabilltiy off 377's +319's, i believe if it were to run it would be the 0747ex bedofrd as far as st pancras.

 

[JonnyG]

Keep a lookout for the 0733 Brighton - London Bridge, now being worked by a Southeastern 12 car 375/9 set (375924/921/905 this morning). The regulars have been informed it will be for 4-6 weeks according to my source, who grabbed an atmospheric shot before its departure from Brighton...

 

[mackenzie_blu]

377201 in pair with 377501 running 2T13 went through City Thameslink at 0714. Running 5mins late. 501 is on the London end. Will upload video tonite.

 

[jon0844]

Can anyone confirm if 504 is running as listed yesterday so far? I'm thinking of checking it out at London Bridge this evening.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Can anyone confirm if 504 is running as listed yesterday so far? I'm thinking of checking it out at London Bridge this evening.

No sorry, they changed the unit and the diagrams last night hence the 501 posting. 501 will end up with 208 tonight at Ashford.

Im currently uploading images to my Flickr account of 501's first day, videos and some images of the interior while the unit was at Brighton.

 

[sammyg901]

Yep I just took the 1709 ex Brighton which was 201, no LED displays and no stickers in the windows, cue some confused passengers along the way! However did spot the 375s leaving East Croydon and on a 350 en route to Shepards Bush, definately an interesting time for the Southern Railways!

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Ive uploaded all my images now including a couple from the cab of 377501. Hope you guys like. The set can be found here.

 

[The Box Photter]

Hi,

New member here. Took part in the "Last Train From Moorgate" shenanigans last Friday and enjoyed a friendly chat with Ms Holt.

I regularly commute into St Pancras Intl from Flitwick in the morning between 07.00 and 07.30, then home again from Blackfriars any time from 17.00 to 18.30.

So far this week I've only seen 377s heading north to Bedford in the morning peak and south towards London/Brighton/Kent etc in the evening.

Can anyone tell me if I'm going to have the pleasure of sampling the new stock or whether I'm destined to put up with 319/3 hell forever?

Thanks

 

[jon0844]

Not knowing what changed today, I did go to London Bridge anyway and saw 377201 waiting for Brighton. As a 4-car service, I must say that it was carnage.

I was in the 2+3 seating second car from the front and got a seat as I was quite early. However, by the time it left (1 minute late) it was heaving.

I also kept track and it was swapping between 2 and 3 minutes late until it arrived at East Croydon. Was glad to get off (no way I was going to go to Brighton and pay £9.90 for the privilege!), even though I had a seat and table for the laptop.

Anyway, when it left - the first 2 cars were showing Gatwick Airport and the scrolling list of destinations, while the rear 2 cars were showing Brighton and the same list.

I know each screen can show independent information (i.e. coach 1 etc) but I think they need to work this out. I'd have presumed it was a train to Gatwick only if I was boarding the car I just got off - assuming you didn't hear the announcements or see the platform sign.

Came back into London on a refreshed 319 and I must say that, despite the 377/2 being quite new, and air conditioned, the 319 is so much brighter and airier. I hope the 377/5s aren't exactly the same!

Edit: Having looked at the photos, it's identical so I guess I didn't miss out that much!

Don't get me wrong, they're fine trains and in the summer the aircon will be a godsend - but I really don't think the Southern colours do them any justice. I can just imagine how much nicer they would be in First colours (and I never thought I'd say that considering the use of blue and pink!).

Also, saw on your video, that as soon as the train moves about 10 metres it announces the next station! It did that when we left London Bridge, as if the next station was a few minutes away (actually about 12 minutes away). Surely it's better to say the next station before the doors shut, or only do it shortly before arrival at that station.

 

[Daimler]

I went on 501 for St Albans to Farringdon (1700, I think, off Bedford). It was nice to see the although the first class is still the same as the rest of the seats in that carriage, it is at least closed off note. Looked very smart in blue too, I must say!

However, the doors do seem to be a bit of a nightmare underground - must have taken 30 seconds to open at each of them. Things went quite pear-shaped at Farrindon though - we arrived a couple of minutes late, and then the train had trouble setting off - it took ages for 'ELECTROSTAR' to appear on the displays outside, and then when he tried to set off (or I assume he did), it rolled backwards. This happened 3 times! Eventually, after about 5-6 mins in the platform, he did get it going. Teething troubles, it would seem!

They are much nicer than 319s though - especially in the end coaches. It did feel odd to be travelling on the MML in a 377!