The GTR Cascade

[Rick1984]

Shame the 319s couldn't replace the god awful 313s on Coastway services

 

[RobShipway]

Shame the 319s couldn't replace the god awful 313s on Coastway services

Indeed I think there would be better ride quality with the class 319 on the Coastway services.

 

[TheKnightWho]

Shame the 319s couldn't replace the god awful 313s on Coastway services

Agreed - retaining a small number of 319s which could be used elsewhere feels silly.

 

[ScotGG]

It seems odd that there's still no home for so many 319s. How many will be sitting in sidings by the end of this year? And how many by mid-2017?

 

[Drsatan]

It seems odd that there's still no home for so many 319s. How many will be sitting in sidings by the end of this year? And how many by mid-2017?

Weren't there mutterings about sending some more to LM?

 

[physics34]

Indeed I think there would be better ride quality with the class 319 on the Coastway services.

...and a toliet!

 

[Mordac]

Thameslink
28 x 700s delivered
51 x 319s remain

Southern
199 x 377s

Changes
Thameslink
87 x 700s to come
4 x 319s for Northern (8 have recently gone)

GN
44 x 313s to be surplus - not certain for scrap
40 x 365s could be retained

Brian

Thanks for that (and to everyone else who provided info). Just unclear on the 377s. Both Platform 5 books and Wikipedia state the following breakdown:
64x377/1
6 x377/2
28x377/3
75x377/4
26x377/6
8 x377/7

Total: 207

Which are wrong? Is it the 377/7s, as subtracting those would give your 199? Where are they?

 

[Brian Aylott]

Thanks for that (and to everyone else who provided info). Just unclear on the 377s. Both Platform 5 books and Wikipedia state the following breakdown:
64x377/1
6 x377/2
28x377/3
75x377/4
26x377/6
8 x377/7

Total: 207

Which are wrong? Is it the 377/7s, as subtracting those would give your 199? Where are they?

Southern 377 Total
Sorry - I'm wrong - total is 207 - yes, the 377/7s
Brian

 

[Class455]

It seems odd that there's still no home for so many 319s. How many will be sitting in sidings by the end of this year? And how many by mid-2017?

They could be used on Southern Metro services alongside the 455's? Alternatively, they could be used on Horsham/Tonbridge/Reigate services, freeing the 377's to move to Coastway services to replace the 313's.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

They could be used on Southern Metro services alongside the 455's? Alternatively, they could be used on Horsham/Tonbridge/Reigate services, freeing the 377's to move to Coastway services to replace the 313's.

319s used to work to Horsham in Connex days. Could they realistically work Coastway services...only issue is would Lover's be equipped to maintain them?

 

[Class377/5]

Shame the 319s couldn't replace the god awful 313s on Coastway services

But then you end reducing capacity with the inability to double up on 6 car platforms.

 

[sd0733]

Could a 455 theoretically be reduced to 3-car formations? If so could potentially a batch of 455s be reformed, refurbed and sent to Brighton for coastal services and then the 4-car 319s replace those on the metro workings. At least the oldest members of the fleet and standardises a bit with more mk3 based units there.
Maybe all the 455s could go 3 car and have the whole of the spare 319s and run 10-car formations (1x319 and 2x455) on some metro routes.

 

[Failed Unit]

Could a 455 theoretically be reduced to 3-car formations? If so could potentially a batch of 455s be reformed, refurbed and sent to Brighton for coastal services and then the 4-car 319s replace those on the metro workings. At least the oldest members of the fleet and standardises a bit with more mk3 based units there.
Maybe all the 455s could go 3 car and have the whole of the spare 319s and run 10-car formations (1x319 and 2x455) on some metro routes.

I don't see why not when you consider some of the SWT were 3 cars as built and had a PEP car inserted in them to make them 4 car.

 

[Class377/5]

Could a 455 theoretically be reduced to 3-car formations? If so could potentially a batch of 455s be reformed, refurbed and sent to Brighton for coastal services and then the 4-car 319s replace those on the metro workings. At least the oldest members of the fleet and standardises a bit with more mk3 based units there.
Maybe all the 455s could go 3 car and have the whole of the spare 319s and run 10-car formations (1x319 and 2x455) on some metro routes.

The 319s and 455s aren't compatible for service I believe so need to waste money altering that. It's going down a pointless road especially when the 455s are expected to be replaced within six to seven years (five years by the time the changes haven been one) that won't justify the cost.

 

[D365]

It's going down a pointless road especially when the 455s are expected to be replaced within six to seven years (five years by the time the changes haven been one) that won't justify the cost.

Exactly. I expect that the new 2020 Southern franchise will plan a combined order to replace both the Class 313/2 and Class 455 fleets.

 

[sd0733]

The 319s and 455s aren't compatible for service I believe so need to waste money altering that. It's going down a pointless road especially when the 455s are expected to be replaced within six to seven years (five years by the time the changes haven been one) that won't justify the cost.

Ah right, didn't consider that! I agree it would be a waste of money, it was more a hypothetical thought of if it could be done rather than a should.

 

[jon0844]

https://twitter.com/katebradbrook/status/779263169160212480

At the press launch of the 387s on GN this morning.

 

[philjo]

https://twitter.com/GNRailUK/status/779266612646055937

I see they are highlighting the tables /power points on the 387s !
As they will initially replace the 317/321 diagrams, those users will get used to these features which will disappear when the 700s later run on those services !

 

[jon0844]

https://twitter.com/GNRailUK/status/779266612646055937

I see they are highlighting the tables /power points on the 387s !
As they will initially replace the 317/321 diagrams, those users will get used to these features which will disappear when the 700s later run on those services !

Laughed at the 'will these come with drivers?' comment to that one.

 

[cjmillsnun]

I don't see why not when you consider some of the SWT were 3 cars as built and had a PEP car inserted in them to make them 4 car.

The 455/7s had the class 508 car added from new.

 

[Domh245]

The 455/7s had the class 508 car added from new.

My understanding was that they were delivered as 3 car units, had the 508 car inserted once they'd arrived, and then the 508 was sent off.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I don't see why not when you consider some of the SWT were 3 cars as built and had a PEP car inserted in them to make them 4 car.

The 455/7 on SWT had a former 508 trailer inserted to make them 4-car prior to entering service. I don't remember any running as 3-car.

However, one or two 455/8's on the former Central Division ran as 3-car units for a short time whilst accident damaged vehicles were being repaired, but these were very rare. And no point IMO replacing one class of train without a toilet with another class of train without a toilet even if they are only a few years junior

 

[physics34]

The 455/7 on SWT had a former 508 trailer inserted to make them 4-car prior to entering service. I don't remember any running as 3-car.

However, one or two 455/8's on the former Central Division ran as 3-car units for a short time whilst accident damaged vehicles were being repaired, but these were very rare. And no point IMO replacing one class of train without a toilet with another class of train without a toilet even if they are only a few years junior

Unit 5800 was one of them.i think

 

[boby32]

Does anyone know where would the class 321 be cascaded to?

 

[43074]

Does anyone know where would the class 321 be cascaded to?

I believe 6 are moving to Greater Anglia, not sure about the other 7.

 

[RobShipway]

I believe 6 are moving to Greater Anglia, not sure about the other 7.

Abeillo Scotland I believe will be having the other 7 units.

 

[D365]

Abeillo Scotland I believe will be having the other 7 units.

Why? ScotRail have received the seven 321s from London Midland (now Class 320/4), and won't need any more cascaded stock since the 385s are on their way.

 

[davidacton]

Just a random thought. With the london mayor wanting to grab all the metro work. Will the likes of southern etc not palm off the likes of the 455s onto lorol

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[Class455]

Just a random thought. With the london mayor wanting to grab all the metro work. Will the likes of southern etc not palm off the likes of the 455s onto lorol

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

I would assume so. Not surprised if a few 377's go as well. But I do hope this does not happen and the 455's have at least 7/8 years in them (GTR franchise ends in 5 years and it'll take 1 or 2 years for replacement stock to be built and delivered)