The Olympics

[NY Yankee]

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain's military has told residents of an upscale apartment development near the Olympic Park in east London it is installing a missile battery on top of a tower within their housing complex to defend the 2012 Games this summer.

The site is one of a number around the capital the army is considering as bases for surface-to-air missiles to protect the London games from an aerial attack, the Ministry of Defence said.

It is the first time such missiles have been deployed in London since the end of World War Two, shocking some residents at the Bow Quarter housing development, sited in a converted red-brick Victorian match factory.

"There was no consultation, no one knocked on the door," Brian Whelan, a 28-year-old journalist, told Reuters. "You just wake up one morning, there's a leaflet telling you they are going to put missiles on the roof."

The measure was excessive and had upset his girlfriend, he said. "I can't imagine the circumstances that would require you to fire missiles over a highly populated area."

Defence Secretary Philip Hammond first announced the plans in November, saying Britain would follow the precedent set by previous Olympics such as the Beijing games in 2008 where surface to air missiles were stationed a kilometer south of its showpiece stadiums.

The defense ministry said in a leaflet sent to occupants on Saturday it had chosen the former water tower in the Bow Quarter complex because it offered "an excellent view of the surrounding area and the entire sky above the Olympic Park."

The tower was in fact "the only suitable site in this area for the HVM (High Velocity Missile) system," it added.

The rooftop missile battery is one of a number of extraordinary measures Londoners can expect during the high-profile sporting festival, including restrictions on road lanes for Olympic use and a security bill of more than a billion pounds ($1.6 billion).

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/uk-puts-missiles-london-rooftop-012520197--oly.html

The unfortunate reality is that London is a city that is prone to terrorism. Having all of those people there during the Olympics makes it an even bigger target. Still, I think this is an invasion of the rights of the residents.

 

[Butts]

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain's military has told residents of an upscale apartment development near the Olympic Park in east London it is installing a missile battery on top of a tower within their housing complex to defend the 2012 Games this summer.

The site is one of a number around the capital the army is considering as bases for surface-to-air missiles to protect the London games from an aerial attack, the Ministry of Defence said.

It is the first time such missiles have been deployed in London since the end of World War Two, shocking some residents at the Bow Quarter housing development, sited in a converted red-brick Victorian match factory.

"There was no consultation, no one knocked on the door," Brian Whelan, a 28-year-old journalist, told Reuters. "You just wake up one morning, there's a leaflet telling you they are going to put missiles on the roof."

The measure was excessive and had upset his girlfriend, he said. "I can't imagine the circumstances that would require you to fire missiles over a highly populated area."

Defence Secretary Philip Hammond first announced the plans in November, saying Britain would follow the precedent set by previous Olympics such as the Beijing games in 2008 where surface to air missiles were stationed a kilometer south of its showpiece stadiums.

The defense ministry said in a leaflet sent to occupants on Saturday it had chosen the former water tower in the Bow Quarter complex because it offered "an excellent view of the surrounding area and the entire sky above the Olympic Park."

The tower was in fact "the only suitable site in this area for the HVM (High Velocity Missile) system," it added.

The rooftop missile battery is one of a number of extraordinary measures Londoners can expect during the high-profile sporting festival, including restrictions on road lanes for Olympic use and a security bill of more than a billion pounds ($1.6 billion).

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/uk-puts-missiles-london-rooftop-012520197--oly.html

The unfortunate reality is that London is a city that is prone to terrorism. Having all of those people there during the Olympics makes it an even bigger target. Still, I think this is an invasion of the rights of the residents.

I think you'll find surface to air missiles are a failry recent development and did not exist during WW2 - think German V1 and V2 they were the height of technology at that time.

The block of Flats is probably leasehold so the residents won't own the roof The Landlord will.

The real invasion of the rights of the residents is by those persons who necessitate this course of action as they are prepared to indiscriminately murder innocent people in pursuing their cause.

 

[Deerfold]

The real invasion of the rights of the residents is by those persons who necessitate this course of action as they are prepared to indiscriminately murder innocent people in pursuing their cause.

And putting missiles on a roof helps avoid that how?

Governments like frightened citizens.

 

[LE Greys]

If a large aircraft was involved, they would also be practically useless. A Starstreak HVM is not all that big, even though it does have three submunitions. Anything larger than fighter-size would probably be able to absorb several hits and still stay under control (it's general course would be downwards anyway - even if it did go out of control, it would still hit something important). The best method is to prevent the aircraft getting anywhere near the target in the first place. However, the government has to be seen to be doing something, and a high-profile missile deployment looks good.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Even if they did blow a large hijacked aircraft apart, it wouldn't make any difference - all the bits would carry on downwards and if anything would come down over a larger area than otherwise.

Could they really react in time anyway?

As i understand it from press reports, the high altitude routes are being shifted 50 miles away from London for the duration. So let's do the maths: Assuming a round figure of 500mph for an aircraft, that is 6 minutes flying time. If it goes off course and heads for London, it'll be at least one minute before it becomes obvious on the radar screens, and probably at least another minute of attempted communications with the craft before it becomes obvious that something is wrong.

That's two minutes so far. Four minutes out.

Then you've got to decide what to do. Probably another minute minimum to make contact, explain the situation and get authority to shoot it down.

Three minutes so far. Three minutes out. 25 miles.

You then have to locate and aim before launching. Oh, and the travel time for the missiles to the aircraft...??? At best, it'll be another minute before it gets hit. More likely a bit longer.

By the time it does get hit, it'll only be a few miles out. Momentum will do the rest.

 

[ainsworth74]

I wondering what exactly we're going to be deploying. Rapier and Starstreak aren't exactly long ranged missiles as they're probably only good to about 4 or 5 miles (though they'll get there pretty quick at between Mach 2.5 - 3.5 or about half a mile a second). The only long range SAMs we have around are Sea Dart and Sea Viper but unless they're proposing to put a Type 42/45 destroyer on top of someone's apartment it isn't going to be them. The only the other way to get a long range SAM would be borrow some Patriot's from either the US or perhaps Germany but I would have thought we'd have heard about that by now (and again they aren't the sort of systems you put on roofs).

At this point I think this is more deterrence/make people feel better move rather than a serious attempt at defence because as others have quite rightly pointed out anything much larger than a Cessna 172 is going to have enough momentum to continue on and do some signification damage to whatever is being protected (unless they're planning on putting the SAM sites some significant distance from the Olympic park).

 

[Clip]

I dont mind what they do about deterrents nor where they put them as long as the people who may be inclined to hijack a plane are aware that the deterrent is there it may stop them from doing so. Theres also going to be planes patrolling the sky at times so its not all bad. Bet the people who live in the flats would be aghast if someone did hijack a plane and then crashed it somewhere without any deterrent being in place that could stop it. Yeah I can here them moaning in the standard now abou thow the government shouldve had plans in place.. you get the drift.


The main worry for me is Stratford station. I dont care what plans they have in place that station is far too small to move crowds around. The passageways are already jam packed now especially during peak times and this will just get worse. Even last night they had to block off the western subway due to flooding,leaving the eastern one packed to the rafters..

 

[Deerfold]

I dont mind what they do about deterrents nor where they put them as long as the people who may be inclined to hijack a plane are aware that the deterrent is there it may stop them from doing so. Theres also going to be planes patrolling the sky at times so its not all bad. Bet the people who live in the flats would be aghast if someone did hijack a plane and then crashed it somewhere without any deterrent being in place that could stop it. Yeah I can here them moaning in the standard now abou thow the government shouldve had plans in place.. you get the drift.

I don't mind what they do, so long as it actually *is* a deterrent rather than a headline generator. Or a major curb on civil liberties.

 

[Clip]

I don't mind what they do, so long as it actually *is* a deterrent rather than a headline generator. Or a major curb on civil liberties.

Im not sure what major curb on civil liberties you are on about? They are not going into peoples flats. They are not going to be worried too much if little johnny is smoking some weed in number 45. They are going to be there for a short period and are only interested in shooting things out the sky.

Would not having anything in place and letting something to drop from the sky not be a bigger problem then any percieved civil liberty infringements?

 

[Deerfold]

Im not sure what major curb on civil liberties you are on about? They are not going into peoples flats. They are not going to be worried too much if little johnny is smoking some weed in number 45. They are going to be there for a short period and are only interested in shooting things out the sky.

Would not having anything in place and letting something to drop from the sky not be a bigger problem then any percieved civil liberty infringements?

I just added that so that if I put "I don't mind what they do" with no caveats no-one would pull me up on it later. I may have placed that a little late in my comment for that to be obvious.

If we have huge infringements in civil liberty I see that as doing the terrorists' job for them - they're succeeding in disrupting our everyday lives.

I still don't see what practical use against terrorists these missles will be.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

More details in the Telegraph today.

Yes, the missiles only have a 4 mile range. Even worse, they can't be used in bad weather as they apparently rely on line of sight aiming...:roll:

 

[Schnellzug]

Something interesting in the latest RAIL Magazine; apparently, they'd been expecting a million people to book advance Rail tockets for the Olympic 2012 Event. So far, apparently, they've sold about 85,000.

 

[Clip]

More details in the Telegraph today.

Yes, the missiles only have a 4 mile range. Even worse, they can't be used in bad weather as they apparently rely on line of sight aiming...:roll:

I think people are misunderstanding their use.

There will be jet planes patrolling the sky from RAF Northolt(from this friday the test is) and these missile sites are as a last defence should the jets not manage to doo their job quick enough.

They are not the 'only' line of defence as some people seem to think.

 

[ainsworth74]

Thought this video on BBC News might be of some interest to those who've following the use of SAMs at the Olympics.

 

[GodAtum]

Anyone worried about travel to/from London with the increased passenger numbers?

 

[Schnellzug]

Anyone worried about travel to/from London with the increased passenger numbers?

I bet it'll be a self-defeating prophecy; i.e. people will expect it all to be impossibly crowded, so they "make other Arrangements", as they're encouraged to do; therefore, it isn't in fact impossibly crowded at all.

 

[GodAtum]

I bet it'll be a self-defeating prophecy; i.e. people will expect it all to be impossibly crowded, so they "make other Arrangements", as they're encouraged to do; therefore, it isn't in fact impossibly crowded at all.

I hope so! Im working at the Olympic site so cant make any other arrangements :roll: Fingers crossed the jubilee line has no problems too!

 

[Deerfold]

Looks like the numbers may not be as high as some thought.

I've been keeping an eye on the place I usually stay.%
Prices were around 1100% of normal. They've now dropped to 250%.

Still pricey, but not as bad as it was - hoping they carry on moving in that direction.

 

[ChristopherJ]

I for one welcome the additional security measures that are being provided by the military and with any hope they can be permanent.

For a start, those with the laser guided missiles - please aim and fire at will at the low life scum boyracers who race around revving their exhausts at 3am in the morning.

Secondly, lets see how allegedly tough all the gangsta hoodies that plauge the capital are when confronted by a squadie with a roof mounted machine gun pointing down at them...

Enough said!

 

[Schnellzug]

So The Olympic Torch has been lit by the High Priestess of, er, ..... , then, as you can see thus:- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEY4elIWRSY&feature=g-sptl&cid=inp-hs-UKG



Hands up anyone who can look at this whole pantomime and do anything but laugh?

 

[Greenback]

Looks like the numbers may not be as high as some thought.

I've been keeping an eye on the place I usually stay.%
Prices were around 1100% of normal. They've now dropped to 250%.

Still pricey, but not as bad as it was - hoping they carry on moving in that direction.

I'm sure many places were just trying to cash in. But there is a limit to the prices that even the comfortably off will pay, as has now been found out!

2x5 the normal rate should still result in a nice little earner though.

 

[Oswyntail]

....Hands up anyone who can look at this whole pantomime and do anything but laugh?

Me - in a country where everything is going to Helena Handcart, and tourism is the chief earner, an innocuous "ceremony" that reminds the tourists of the country's past is quite justified.
"Trooping the Colour", "Changing the Guard" - ring any bells?

 

[Schnellzug]

Me - in a country where everything is going to Helena Handcart, and tourism is the chief earner, an innocuous "ceremony" that reminds the tourists of the country's past is quite justified.
"Trooping the Colour", "Changing the Guard" - ring any bells?

Dressing up as the High Priestess of the Oracle of Delphi and prannying about with a tinfoil Torch and a Wok? Well, i suppose if you enjoy a good spot of kitsch, then it is all good fun, but what I'm surprised about is how cheap it all looks.

.. but then, this is Greece, i suppose, so I don't suppose they would be able to go overboard on the budget.

 

[ReverendFozz]

Now the Olympics is upon us, who else is looking forward to the Games, personally, I am not, the only bit of the whole process I am looking forward to is the Torch Relay, because of how it gives special people in communities the chance to have there moment in the limelight...

Seb Coe goes on about it being Britains Games, then would it not have made sense to include Northern Ireland in the hosting, should they not have arranged Team GB football or other sports held outside London to be in Northern Ireland and Scotland...

Maybes I am just being a miserable old scrote when I think the Olympics is going to be an anti-climax

Sent from my GT-S5830 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Ascot]

I'm generally trying to avoid it personally. We've had a memo go round work the other week advising us of a number of changes during the Olympic weeks. Basically we've been advised on:

- Due regard over increased journey times with respect to overcrowded services.

- No field work of more than 1 days duration around the M25 belt unless absolute project critical.

- No field work of more than 7.3 hour(s) duration around the Docklands Business District unless absolute project critical.

The first one seems common sense but the last 2 seem a bit OTT. No.2 seems to block overnight stays in price hiked hotels which is natural (and will result in some lengthy daily commutes instead). No.3 is very smart as 7.3 is the "office day" limit.

Has anyone else had similar memos from work?

 

[Johnuk123]

I'll watch a bit of athletics and that will be it for me.

 

[NY Yankee]

By Danica Kirka The Associated Press

ROYAL NAVAL AIR STATION CULDROSE, England – Even the wind co-operated Friday at this normally blustery naval station, remaining calm as David Beckham lit a celebratory cauldron and signalled the start of the 2012 London Olympics torch relay.

There was a hushed “oooooh” as the former England national team captain and current star for the Los Angeles Galaxy took centre stage as the flame arrived in the United Kingdom from Greece on the eve of a 70-day relay. Then, as the fire roared to life in the gold and white cauldron, there was an “ahhhh” of relief. Even the vagaries of British weather wouldn’t interfere this time.

“This is a big acceleration of the heartbeat,” London Mayor Boris Johnson said as he summed up the moment. “This is the final furlong for us.”

The flame is a symbol of peace and unity that harkens back to the origins of the games in ancient Greece. But in 2012, it was Beckham that gave it star power. The 37-year-old star was excited about the chance to welcome the world to his “hood.” He’s from east London, where the main stadium is located.

Beckham been involved in the London Games since the organizing committee launched its successful bid in 2005. His star power — the kind that sends children into shrieks of hysteria and turns diplomats’ wives in Athens into paparazzi — is part of the reason that the International Olympic Committee took notice of the London bid over Paris, the favourite.

While Beckham the celebrity isn’t shirking the attention the Olympic torch brings, Beckham the soccer star really, really wants to take part on the field.

“I’ve never played in an Olympic Games,” he said. “Obviously, I’d love to.”

“I’ve always made it clear that I love representing my country,” he added. “I’ve done that quite a few times.”

He’s done that 115 times, to be precise, with the England team. But the Olympics have eluded him. He said that being at the flame handover ceremony Thursday night in Athens reminded him of the ancient ties to the games and that he “got goose bumps just being part of it.”

Beckham has been included in coach Stuart Pearce’s 80-man shortlist that will be whittled down to 18 players in the coming weeks to form Britain’s first Olympic soccer squad since 1960. If chosen, he would be one of the three players over age 23 allowed in each Olympic squad.

Many cameras turned to the photogenic Beckham when the flame arrived at a Royal Navy air station in Cornwall on Friday night. The flame, travelling on the gold-painted British Airways Flight 2012, was carried off by Princess Anne, the head of the British Olympic Committee and herself a former Olympian.

On the plane itself, the flame got seats 1A and 1B. There were actually four little lanterns — just in case — and all were guarded by the Metropolitan Police’s special torch security team.

This was a flight like no other. Every detail was considered. Airline passengers arriving in Britain often have to wait in long lines to clear border checks — but here some border guards flew with the passengers so they could check passports while still on board the plane before entering Britain.

London’s Olympic organizers are hoping that the flame’s arrival can generate excitement about the Games.

The torch will be carried all over the British Isles by 8,000 chosen volunteers, mostly local heroes. Its 8,000-mile (12,875-kilometre) journey will linger on the iconic sites — Big Ben, Stonehenge, the white cliffs of Dover — and speed past less appealing areas. It ends up July 27 at the Olympic Stadium in London.

“There is an emotional connection with this that I’m not sure other torch relays got,” organizing committee chairman Sebastian Coe said. “When the torch goes through a town, people are going to recognize a lot of those torchbearers. I know a lot of the local authorities in towns who are making extra precautions for the numbers that are going to be out there.”

Beckham is one of the bookies’ favourites to open the Olympics by lighting the cauldron in London — and he told reporters while visiting an Athens school that he’d love the job. Other favourites include miler Roger Bannister, rower Steve Redgrave, Coe, Queen Elizabeth II or other members of Britain’s royal family.

But no word on that — Coe says the decision hasn’t even been discussed yet. For the moment, Beckham’s just thrilled to be a part of the torch relay.

“Being here today just makes it all that real,” he said in Athens. “Being handed the torch is the start of the games.”

http://metronews.ca/sports/229917/olympic-flame-arrives-in-britain/

I realise that people feel cynical about the Olympics because of the crowding and the money spent on constructing the stadiums, but they should consider it a honour to host the Olympics. Seeing Beckham run with the torch should inspire national pride.

 

[newbie babs]

I can`t be bothered to watch the olympics life is too short and work comes before it anyway.

Too much press with the torch and considering some "unsung Heroes" that were chosen to carry it on the journey are selling them. I as a tax payer I feel cheeted. I would ask them for it back. How dare they sell it, there should have been a contract forbidding them to profit from what should have been a proud moment for them.

Its all about money from start to finish......what a load of rubbish, imagine what could have been done with that money in this recession.

 

[Deerfold]

While Beckham the celebrity isn’t shirking the attention the Olympic torch brings, Beckham the soccer star really, really wants to take part on the field.

“I’ve never played in an Olympic Games,” he said. “Obviously, I’d love to.”

“I’ve always made it clear that I love representing my country,” he added. “I’ve done that quite a few times.”

He’s done that 115 times, to be precise, with the England team. But the Olympics have eluded him.

Could that be something to do with Britain having never submitted a team to the Olympics before? <correction - we have, but before my time>

I realise that people feel cynical about the Olympics because of the crowding and the money spent on constructing the stadiums, but they should consider it a honour to host the Olympics. Seeing Beckham run with the torch should inspire national pride.

He's a skilled footballer - who moved to the US for better money. He's coming back? Whoopee-do.

Still couldn't care less who's hosting the Olympics. No matter how many times I'm told we're honoured.

We're spending £90 million on the opening and closing ceremonies.

My (next door, but it affects my buses) local council has just withdrawn all subsidy for evening and Sunday bus services due to "austerity cuts" as central government won't let them increase their total budget from the level it was at 2 years go. It's saved them a few thousand.

I know which I'd rather spend money on.

The torch will be carried all over the British Isles by 8,000 chosen volunteers, mostly local heroes. Its 8,000-mile (12,875-kilometre) journey will linger on the iconic sites — Big Ben, Stonehenge, the white cliffs of Dover — and speed past less appealing areas. It ends up July 27 at the Olympic Stadium in London.

Ah that's why it's going to be in a van when it goes past my house is it?

 

[starrymarkb]

Plus Beckham endeered himself to Culdrose by calling it an RAF base...:roll: (you could see the Navy top brass cringe)

The torch arrived in Exeter yesterday, much of the city centre was ticket holder only. I didn't go out to see it because of the crowds - though I'd have been tempted this morning as it was much quieter but I had to be in work before it's scheduled departure time (7am).

Plus the chaos when word got out that Muse were going to take the flame through Teignmouth (Muse fans are crazy!)

For NY Yankee - if you are interested there are a couple of remote cameras in the convoy - http://www.bbc.co.uk/torchrelay has a live feed (apart from the rural parts of Devon where there is no 3G signal to relay the pictures back)