Ticket office rail travel voucher issue

[redreni]

Bit of a weird one this evening. I was on my way home and stopped at the ticket office at Farringdon to buy some tickets for tomorrow (value £14.60). I had two National Rail Travel Vouchers each for £6.83 that I got from Avanti by way of delay repay compensation, so I presented these as part payment for the tickets.

The chap stared at the vouchers for quite a long time, then rather brusquely asked me to write my name and the date on the back, which I did. He then started typing the number from the first voucher into his computer. In fact I was fairly sure he had processed both vouchers because he then said there was another 94p to pay and pointed at the card reader. Ignoring this, I reached into my pocket and took out some coins. Seeing the coins, he said "card only". I explained I didn't have a card on me. He said he wasn't taking cash because he was "finishing". I again explained I only had cash and he again refused to accept it. I asked if it was Thameslink's policy not to accept cash, or his policy. He said "it's my policy. I'm finishing soon".

At this point a queue had begun to form (he really had stared at the vouchers for a long time before doing anything with them) and people were beginning to get impatient. I offered him the option of just returning my vouchers so that I could spend them later.

Only after I had walked away did I remember he had made me date the vouchers, presumably meaning I might have trouble spending them after today. No matter, I thought, as I intended to spend them at Abbey Wood when I passed through there as I still needed my tickets for tomorrow.

When I reached the Elizabeth Line ticket office at Abbey Wood the chap was very helpful and happy to accept my vouchers (and cash for the balance), however, only one of the vouchers was accepted by his computer. The other one was rejected as invalid, so I couldn't use that one and I still have it. The only explanation for this that springs to mind is that the lazy chap at Farringdon who makes up his own rules about what forms of payment are accepted, had already processed that voucher. I've never had a rail travel voucher rejected before.

When I got home I rang Thameslink and explained the above. They said, in essence, not our voucher, not our problem - speak to Avanti.

What do people think? Is it worth continuing to try to spend the remaining voucher, or in your experience if it's rejected once, does that mean it will always be rejected? Is it even worth wasting my breath trying to get Avanti to do anything about this? If I find a helpful person at Farringdon ticket office some time next week, say, might they be able to sort this out?

 

[yorksrob]

Disgusting. The idea of a ticket office not accepting cash is ridiculous - even moreso for a small amount.

I would complain to the company in charge of the ticket office.

 

[redreni]

Disgusting. The idea of a ticket office not accepting cash is ridiculous - even moreso for a small amount.

I would complain to the company in charge of the ticket office.

That'd be Thameslink. I will probably end up complaining, since they weren't the least bit helpful on the phone and they do appear to have invalidated my voucher. In addition to which their ticket office clerk behaved entirely unreasonably and was quite rude.

I did follow their advice to contact Avanti. They logged the incident and said they would get back to me. I suppose it's possible they may re-issue the voucher? I'd have thought the mere fact I still have the voucher ought to give them some reassurance I'm not trying to spend it for a second time?

 

[Hadders]

This is appalling customer service, please do complain to GTR who operate the ticket office at Farringdon station. It has nothing to do with Avanti - Rail Travel Vouchers are a valid payment method and it does not matter which train company issues the voucher.

If the ticket office was open then all acceptable forms of payment should be accepted. The fact that the member of staff was finishing soon is no concern of the customer. I'm pretty sure that staff get time at the end of their shift to cash up anyway.

I would have thought that if the voucher has been shown as being used at Farringdon then the till have an excess to the value of the voucher.

 

[yorksrob]

That'd be Thameslink. I will probably end up complaining, since they weren't the least bit helpful on the phone and they do appear to have invalidated my voucher. In addition to which their ticket office clerk behaved entirely unreasonably and was quite rude.

I did follow their advice to contact Avanti. They logged the incident and said they would get back to me. I suppose it's possible they may re-issue the voucher? I'd have thought the mere fact I still have the voucher ought to give them some reassurance I'm not trying to spend it for a second time?

Indeed, no doubt not taking cash is this cretin governments idea of being "trendy".

Rejoice the day when they are gone.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Indeed, no doubt not taking cash is this cretin governments idea of being "trendy".

Rejoice the day when they are gone.

I suspect the truth of the matter is that the member of staff had already balanced their till and put their float back in the safe to enable a rapid departure (probably before the official end of their shift) when closing time rolled around.

 

[Hadders]

I suspect the truth of the matter is that the member of staff had already balanced their till and put their float back in the safe to enable a rapid departure (probably before the official end of their shift) when closing time rolled around.

I agree but that doesn't make it right.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Your voucher isn't invalid I would still have accepted it for payment when I worked in a TC

 

[redreni]

Your voucher isn't invalid I would still have accepted it for payment when I worked in a TC

My vouchers weren't rejected at Farringdon as such - cash was rejected meaning I couldn't pay the balance so the tickets weren't issued and my two vouchers were returned.

At Abbey Wood one of my vouches was accepted and the other rejected. The staff there have two screens, one that they work from and an iPad screen that is positioned so that the customer can see it. The usually ask you to check the screen to make sure you're happy you're buying the right tickets before they issue them. Consequently I could see exactly what he was doing when he applied my first voucher to the balance (essentially entering the voucher value and two numbers taken from the voucher). He did the exact same thing with the second voucher. I was even able to check the numbers he had entered against the voucher to make sure it was right and I was able to see the "voucher invalid" error message that came up. I didn't get the impression he had discretion to accept the voucher anyway in these circumstances - he couldn't apply the voucher against the balance unless he had a voucher number that the system would accept. He was very apologetic.

I will need a day travelcard next Saturday so I will try and spend the voucher on that and see what happens.

 

[Red Rover]

I’m guessing it’s invalid as it’s already been processed, the only way to know is if it’s on the persons shift sheet.
And no there’s no discretionary measure to accept a voucher that won’t process, customer services would have to override (issue ticket with a part or the whole voucher value and claim credit for that amount) or reissue.
Paper vouchers are also outdated and should be updated to an online code that when presented can be used to buy a ticket.

 

[redreni]

Accepted at Victoria .

 

[Haywain]

Paper vouchers are also outdated and should be updated to an online code that when presented can be used to buy a ticket.

eVouchers are issued by many train companies but they can only be used on the issuing company's website.

 

[Red Rover]

Well that closes down the theory it could have been on the original star machines shift sheet as a credit, why it wasn’t accepted at the other terminal at another station I don’t know, good news is you got to use it.

eVouchers are issued by many train companies but they can only be used on the issuing company's website.

If train line can get a universal code used through star theres no reason why toc’s couldn’t do the same for all machines, after all forces warrant and traders are essentially the same thing.

 

[Haywain]

If train line can get a universal code used through star

I have no idea what that means.

 

[Red Rover]

Ticket on collection. TOC
Or Ticket on departure TOD

 

[Haywain]

Ticket on collection. TOC

ToD, actually, and all online rail ticket retailers offer that. It's rather different to using a rail travel voucher.

after all forces warrant and traders are essentially the same thing.

Yes, and like Rail Travel Vouchers they involve pieces of paper to be handed over for use at ticket offices.

 

[Red Rover]

But the accounting is done via the barcode and the numbers at the bottom, once accepted at the terminal as far as I’m aware there not processed again.

TOC is also used (not on star), anyway my point was if an 8 letter/number code can be accepted universally at retail points, there’s no real reason why the same can’t be said for different toc’s and their vouchers electronic or otherwise. It’d just be a longer code to input that’s all, or even barcode.

 

[redreni]

eVouchers are issued by many train companies but they can only be used on the issuing company's website.

Yeah I wouldn't accept delay repay compensation in the form of such a voucher, personally.

 

[CyrusWuff]

But the accounting is done via the barcode and the numbers at the bottom, once accepted at the terminal as far as I’m aware there not processed again.

TOC is also used (not on star), anyway my point was if an 8 letter/number code can be accepted universally at retail points, there’s no real reason why the same can’t be said for different toc’s and their vouchers electronic or otherwise. It’d just be a longer code to input that’s all, or even barcode.

Each web Ticket Issuing System has its own format for eVoucher codes, which aren't interchangeable, and can't be used on a desktop/mobile TIS.

Worldline WebTIS, for example, uses codes containing 25 hexadecimal digits, but ACE (used by Chiltern and Grand Central) uses an arbitrary length prefix followed by six alphanumeric characters.

Not insurmountable, but it would presumably need agreement between TOCs, TIS suppliers and Rail Delivery Group to be able to generate and account for what would effectively be virtual RTVs, particularly if someone wanted to use them at a Ticket Office.

 

[Red Rover]

Surely accounting wouldn’t be too hard?
I’m guessing at that mind, each TOC could have their own starting 5 digit code?
Like forces, traders etc etc had?
From there their own 8 digit (was it 8 digits?) code that identifies the online vouchers, otherwise will it be paper for national use and online solely for specific toc’s? That’s seems awfully archaic going forward.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yeah I wouldn't accept delay repay compensation in the form of such a voucher, personally.

Why wouldn't anyone just have it as money?

 

[Haywain]

Surely accounting wouldn’t be too hard?
I’m guessing at that mind, each TOC could have their own starting 5 digit code?
Like forces, traders etc etc had?
From there their own 8 digit (was it 8 digits?) code that identifies the online vouchers, otherwise will it be paper for national use and online solely for specific toc’s? That’s seems awfully archaic going forward.

So, if we went down this route of just issuing a code, rather than a voucher, how do you propose getting it to the customer? The choices would appear to be either in a letter, so no different to sending an actual voucher, or in an email, in which case it might as well be an eVoucher. And you keep on about Trader and Forces warrants, but they are still issued as pieces of paper.

Why wouldn't anyone just have it as money?

Some people like to ringfence the money for rail travel, in the same way that people delayed on Northern get the complimentary tickets.

 

[Red Rover]

So, if we went down this route of just issuing a code, rather than a voucher, how do you propose getting it to the customer? The choices would appear to be either in a letter, so no different to sending an actual voucher, or in an email, in which case it might as well be an eVoucher. And you keep on about Trader and Forces warrants, but they are still issued as pieces of paper.


Some people like to ringfence the money for rail travel, in the same way that people delayed on Northern get the complimentary tickets.

To their phone, or email.
I keep on about traders and forces as they use numbers to debit the respective accounts.

 

[Haywain]

I keep on about traders and forces as they use numbers to debit the respective accounts.

So do Rail Travel Vouchers, when they are issued on paper, but you want to reinvent them.

 

[Trainbike46]

Why wouldn't anyone just have it as money?

Eurostar gives you more compensation if you take it as a voucher (30% instead of 25% / 60% instead of 50%), which is why I have taken a voucher from them rather than money, but I don't think any TOCs do that, so I don't get why you wouldn't take the money in that situation either.

Travel with confidence schemes are the only reason I've ever ended up with Rail Travel Vouchers, and I suspect that may be true for many people

 

[lnerazuma]

This is disgusting. If a decently paid staff wasn't taking cash because he was "finishing", he could just cover the small 94p bill with his own card.

 

[Red Rover]

So do Rail Travel Vouchers, when they are issued on paper, but you want to reinvent them.

Indeed, and my point isn’t about reinvention but a more practical advancement. If paper tickets as we’re allegedly told are becoming obsolete why not a far smaller part or paper transactions.
In fact thinking of it, paperless will fully happen whether you like it or not.
And of course it’ll be fully accountable.

This is disgusting. If a decently paid staff wasn't taking cash because he was "finishing", he could just cover the small 94p bill with his own card.

Or taken the loss.

So do Rail Travel Vouchers, when they are issued on paper, but you want to reinvent them.

And I suspect nominal rolls are a thing of the past pretty much due to paperless codes being sent to squaddies.

 

[Wallsendmag]

My vouchers weren't rejected at Farringdon as such - cash was rejected meaning I couldn't pay the balance so the tickets weren't issued and my two vouchers were returned.

At Abbey Wood one of my vouches was accepted and the other rejected. The staff there have two screens, one that they work from and an iPad screen that is positioned so that the customer can see it. The usually ask you to check the screen to make sure you're happy you're buying the right tickets before they issue them. Consequently I could see exactly what he was doing when he applied my first voucher to the balance (essentially entering the voucher value and two numbers taken from the voucher). He did the exact same thing with the second voucher. I was even able to check the numbers he had entered against the voucher to make sure it was right and I was able to see the "voucher invalid" error message that came up. I didn't get the impression he had discretion to accept the voucher anyway in these circumstances - he couldn't apply the voucher against the balance unless he had a voucher number that the system would accept. He was very apologetic.

I will need a day travelcard next Saturday so I will try and spend the voucher on that and see what happens.

That’s Worldline mTIS Galaxy Tab S4 it doesn’t invalidate vouchers , I really do know what I’m taking about honest.

But the accounting is done via the barcode and the numbers at the bottom, once accepted at the terminal as far as I’m aware there not processed

Yes and no

 

[Coolzac]

This kind of thing is really depressing. All too often rail staff are rude and unhelpful, and it's a shame because they ruin the reputation of the whole industry. Why do some rail staff feel like they can make up their own rules?

 

[Red Rover]

That’s Worldline mTIS Galaxy Tab S4 it doesn’t invalidate vouchers , I really do know what I’m taking about honest.


Yes and no

What happens to the warrants after then? I can’t imagine anyone individually goes through them? If there’s a discrepancy then yes, they could look warrant and the counter foil but I’ve never heard of it.