Titanic on ITV

[GearJammer]

I just watched it on catch up, its quite good, the bit that stuck out for me was Len and a chap he was talking to revealed (if i listened to it right) that by April 15th White Star line had sacked all its surviving staff and left them to fend for themselves in America.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I haven't watched it yet ( will iPlayer it later ) but yes, they did - the way the contracts were worded then meant that crew employment automatically ceased the moment a ship sank!

 

[LE Greys]

I haven't watched it yet ( will iPlayer it later ) but yes, they did - the way the contracts were worded then meant that crew employment automatically ceased the moment a ship sank!

Some of them managed to sign back up, and I believe a few were on the Britannic when she hit a mine. That might have put them off a bit if they survived two sinkings.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Yes, I think one of those on both was a nurse and if I recall correctly she was sunk a third time with another company somewhere...

 

[LE Greys]

Yes, I think one of those on both was a nurse and if I recall correctly she was sunk a third time with another company somewhere...

This is she, Violet Jessop. She was actually aboard the Olympic when that ship collided with a cruiser. Astonishingly, she continued to work for White Star right up until it merged with Cunard (if the article is to be believed).

 

[RPM]

Drownton Abbey:

I've been looking forward to this series and I was quite prepared to like it. Sadly though, it disappointed on many levels. It turns out to be both inaccurate and cliché-ridden. I'm not picking holes (in this instance) on the depiction of the ship itself - you don't expect perfection in a TV series and you have to allow some room for artistic license, so I wont complain that the Maids & Valets Dining Saloon was depicted with portholes when it was actually located inboard, against the reciprocating engine casing. Let's stick to more justified complaints like those ubiquitous locked mesh gates that seem to appear in every corridor of the third class accommodation (I believe there were only a couple of such gates in the entire ship), the discussions about sacrificing lifeboats for open deck space, and the unbalanced demonisation of Ismay. Worse, the trailer for episode 2 suggests that much will be made of the irrelevant and bogus idea that a decision was made to use inferior rivets for the ship's construction This seems to be a series written by someone who has watched a lot of popular Titanic TV documentaries rather than someone who is a Titanic scholar.
Now, here's the elephant in the room; the whole thing was actually rather dull. How on earth can you write a Titanic drama, with all its multitudinous inbuilt dramatic glories, and then manage to make it so unpardonably tedious that even a lifelong Titanic enthusiast finds it boring?
All of which is rather sad when you consider that Fellowes is usually a good writer. Stick to Downton Abbey old boy.

I won't be watching tomorrow's episode because I'll, be at work and frankly I really don't care.

 

[Butts]

Drownton Abbey:

I've been looking forward to this series and I was quite prepared to like it. Sadly though, it disappointed on many levels. It turns out to be both inaccurate and cliché-ridden. I'm not picking holes (in this instance) on the depiction of the ship itself - you don't expect perfection in a TV series and you have to allow some room for artistic license, so I wont complain that the Maids & Valets Dining Saloon was depicted with portholes when it was actually located inboard, against the reciprocating engine casing. Let's stick to more justified complaints like those ubiquitous locked mesh gates that seem to appear in every corridor of the third class accommodation (I believe there were only a couple of such gates in the entire ship), the discussions about sacrificing lifeboats for open deck space, and the unbalanced demonisation of Ismay. Worse, the trailer for episode 2 suggests that much will be made of the irrelevant and bogus idea that a decision was made to use inferior rivets for the ship's construction This seems to be a series written by someone who has watched a lot of popular Titanic TV documentaries rather than someone who is a Titanic scholar.
Now, here's the elephant in the room; the whole thing was actually rather dull. How on earth can you write a Titanic drama, with all its multitudinous inbuilt dramatic glories, and then manage to make it so unpardonably tedious that even a lifelong Titanic enthusiast finds it boring?
All of which is rather sad when you consider that Fellowes is usually a good writer. Stick to Downton Abbey old boy.

I won't be watching tomorrow's episode because I'll, be at work and frankly I really don't care.

As an enthusiast and someone who has considerable knowledge on the subject,can you confirm that smoking would have been the norm on the ship in the time period concerned. Fellows script has excised it completely.(at least in the first episode)

I am going to the exhibition at the new £100 million centre in Belfast next week.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

irrelevant and bogus idea that a decision was made to use inferior rivets for the ship's construction

So Timothy Foecke a National Institute of Standards and Technology metal expert is wrong? Recent research by scientists shows that the material the rivets were made out of were inferior to other rivets available at the time. All the evidence from the construction archives and scientific analysis of the ship point towards a unskilled labour, low quality materials and a rushed job.

 

[Mike C]

Titanic (TV) had big foot steps to fill imo given how good Titanic (Film) was, however the TV version was really really poorly done.

I don't rate Cameron's Titanic that highly. The best "Titanic" production in my opinion was "A night to remember" starring Kenneth More and based on the Walter Lord novel.

 

[RPM]

So Timothy Foecke a National Institute of Standards and Technology metal expert is wrong? Recent research by scientists shows that the material the rivets were made out of were inferior to other rivets available at the time. All the evidence from the construction archives and scientific analysis of the ship point towards a unskilled labour, low quality materials and a rushed job.

The rivet metallurgy research is quite correct. The assertion that H&W deliberately and knowingly chose to use inferior materials to save money is not correct.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

As an enthusiast and someone who has considerable knowledge on the subject,can you confirm that smoking would have been the norm on the ship in the time period concerned. Fellows script has excised it completely.(at least in the first episode)

Smoking would indeed have been the norm, for men anyway. I had not noticed it was missing from the Fellowes production. Well spotted!

 

[Crimson_Quiff]

Second installment tonight, strap me in! I shall watch the full programme before passing judgement on the entire thing.

 

[table38]

Second installment tonight, strap me in! I shall watch the full programme before passing judgement on the entire thing.

Well it is April 1st... maybe it won't sink this time, or perhaps they all get abducted by aliens instead

 

[Butts]

The rivet metallurgy research is quite correct. The assertion that H&W deliberately and knowingly chose to use inferior materials to save money is not correct.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Smoking would indeed have been the norm, for men anyway. I had not noticed it was missing from the Fellowes production. Well spotted!

As regular forum members will testify , I rarely comment on smoking related issues , however I couldn't fail to notice this huge historical clanger - wonder what Fellows response would be.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

As regular forum members will testify , I rarely comment on smoking related issues , however I couldn't fail to notice this huge historical clanger - wonder what Fellows response would be.

Yes, it's a real departure from your usual repertoire to start talking about smoking

The rivet metallurgy research is quite correct. The assertion that H&W deliberately and knowingly chose to use inferior materials to save money is not correct.

Surely the question why they used inferior materials needs to be asked? Saving money is a possible theory.

 

[table38]

Apparently those obsessed with pointing out the historical errors are called Titanicologists or "Titanoraks".

(The second word is not pronounced in such a way to infer it is an item of clothing used to keep a lady's chest warm )

 

[jon0844]

(The second word is not pronounced in such a way to infer it is an item of clothing used to keep a lady's chest warm )

Shame.

 

[LE Greys]

I don't rate Cameron's Titanic that highly. The best "Titanic" production in my opinion was "A night to remember" starring Kenneth More and based on the Walter Lord novel.

Agreed there. Also interesting from a history of film perspective in that both were big-budget blockbusters with cutting-edge special effects, just done nearly 50 years apart. As usual, the worse the effects, the better the acting to make up for it.

 

[Butts]

Apparently those obsessed with pointing out the historical errors are called Titanicologists or "Titanoraks".

(The second word is not pronounced in such a way to infer it is an item of clothing used to keep a lady's chest warm )

Titanorak reporting in the second episode was no better than the first - and not a Cigar in sight in the First Class Smoking Lounge as she was sinking

Mind you I did spot a rogue ashtray (empty) in one scene

 

[Heinz57]

I actualy thought this weeks was even worse than last. I could hardly follow it tonight

 

[Tomonthetrain]

I watched some of it tonight and switched over. Simply because it was a sinking ship for ITV1. Give me the film any day!

 

[RPM]

Surely the question why they used inferior materials needs to be asked? Saving money is a possible theory.

Because those were the materials they had always used and thay had always found them to be perfectly adequate. There was no motive for Harland & Wolff to cost cut. They were paid on a "cost plus" basis, meaning they had a free hand to build White Star ships with no expense spared, then add a fixed, pre-arranged profit on top. If anything this arrangement incentivised H&W to be lavish rather than to cut corners.

 

[LE Greys]

Because those were the materials they had always used and thay had always found them to be perfectly adequate. There was no motive for Harland & Wolff to cost cut. They were paid on a "cost plus" basis, meaning they had a free hand to build White Star ships with no expense spared, then add a fixed, pre-arranged profit on top. If anything this arrangement incentivised H&W to be lavish rather than to cut corners.

Besides, losing a ship because of inferior materials is hardly a good advert for the shipyard.

 

[Crimson_Quiff]

Well it is April 1st... maybe it won't sink this time, or perhaps they all get abducted by aliens instead

Can't say I noticed that!

Second episode was better, I thought.

 

[Butts]

Well its going from bad to worse.....

We even had Winston Churchill in tonights program (without a cigar)

I know it appears a little pedantic but to show life in 1912 without a single person smoking is a complete insult to social history - especiallly as the ship is going down

Cigarette for the condemned people...

Aside from the smoking issue the show is drivel - £10 million wasted

It makes Prisoner Cell Block H look like quality drama

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Isn't there a theory floating around somewhere that Peter the Painter was Lenin himself? Certainly the name is known to at least be someone who worked closely with Lenin.

Can't remember where I heard the theory that he might have been Lenin though.




If every (in)famous mystery person who has been portrayed over the years as having been on Titanic really had been, then the ship would have been as grossly overloaded as the Cunard Queens* in troopship guise in WW2...




*They were carrying up to 15,000 troops at a time...

 

[LE Greys]

Isn't there a theory floating around somewhere that Peter the Painter was Lenin himself? Certainly the name is known to at least be someone who worked closely with Lenin.

Can't remember where I heard the theory that he might have been Lenin though.




If every (in)famous mystery person who has been portrayed over the years as having been on Titanic really had been, then the ship would have been as grossly overloaded as the Cunard Queens* in troopship guise in WW2...




*They were carrying up to 15,000 troops at a time...

They also had a bounty of 1,000,000 Reichsmarks on their noses, plus a Knight's Cross. It was "claimed" several times apparently.

Still, you actually bring up a good point. Imagine if Titanic had missed the iceberg in 1912, but struck one when going the other way five years later. She might have had 10,000 American troops on-board, and still only enough lifeboats for about 1,000. Doesn't bear thinking about really.

 

[Butts]

Well guess what not a cigar in sight ......:roll:

This was sheer dross there are people in shirtsleeves not even shivering in the sub zero temperatures

Fellows spent five years researching this crap , more like five minutes

 

[CC 72100]

I have to say tonights was the best one, but I've been dissapointed with the series overall in afraid. Not even getting the fact that she was an RMS and not an SS was a pretty basic error to begin with. Best Titanic drama I've seen was the French one I caught Tuesday evening on France2 during a visit to Paris. Drama, interviews with the 'passangers', plus seconds from disaster style diagrams of the accident with explanation. Shame it was in French, despite me studying French and Spanish it uni it's still pretty hard to follow!

 

[Butts]

I have to say tonights was the best one, but I've been dissapointed with the series overall in afraid. Not even getting the fact that she was an RMS and not an SS was a pretty basic error to begin with. Best Titanic drama I've seen was the French one I caught Tuesday evening on France2 during a visit to Paris. Drama, interviews with the 'passangers', plus seconds from disaster style diagrams of the accident with explanation. Shame it was in French, despite me studying French and Spanish it uni it's still pretty hard to follow!

Did you notice the lack of smoking and find this strange in a drama set in 1912?

 

[SS4]

Radio 2 were doing a real time re-enactment last night (filling the gap with commentary) but I only listened to some of it but it seemed like a good idea.

All of ITV's dramas lose a lot of tension from having to go to ads IMO, not that I watched it. I got the impression it would be one of the myriad period dramas that are a la mode at the moment merely set on the Titanic.

Was there the obligatory main character love story marred by tragedy?