Track Safety on Heritage lines

[Navviboy]

Hi all,

I'm a member of five different heritage railways. All seem to take a different approach to track safety.

What, if any, formal arrangements does your railway have for this? Do they have their own version of PTS, do they accept other railways PTS qualifications, do you have any form of PICOW or COSS qualification?

I'd be really interested to hear what others do.

 

[generalvegitable]

on the nene valley to walk on the track all you need is a high vis jacket (a £10 deposit refunded on return) and a lineside pass, they say that you should alert the signaller to what you are doing and make sure to wave at the drivers, I am not sure about any others because the NVR is the only one I have gone lineside at

 

[Menace Dennis]

ALL heritage lines should be treated the same as Main Line and with the same regulations, like the Bramley Line do, even though they ain't got their trains running yet, but WILL do as soon as they can according the committee. My Mucker Mate told me he has too follow rules and regulations as the main line, so as to help clear their track of brambles.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Most have their own PTS system. As far as I know, most heritage railways will also not accept others PTS/PICOW/LKT tickets, and will not accept mainline PTS certs.

 

[tgm999]

at the wensleydale railway we do a 3 1/2 hour long PTS course every 2 years, hi-vis vests MUST be worn we have sit wardens, coss, look outs. during the course we look through the network rail PTS handbook. so it's just like the main line

 

[Old Timer]

at the wensleydale railway we do a 3 1/2 hour long PTS course every 2 years, hi-vis vests MUST be worn we have sit wardens, coss, look outs. during the course we look through the network rail PTS handbook. so it's just like the main line

Oh God how dreary, and so over the top !

 

[Navviboy]

Oh God how dreary, and so over the top !

I agree OT. Perhaps I could ask where you would pitch things? I'd value your opinion.

 

[Old Timer]

Section P of the 1972 Rule Book would be as good as anywhere I guess.

 

[bunnahabhain]

GCR has a requirement for everybody to wear a high vis vest, photographers to wear a special one with a unique ID on it, and there are relaxations of the rules for Guards, Drivers, Secondmen and Signalmen going about their normal duties lineside in station areas.

 

[Hydro]

at the wensleydale railway we do a 3 1/2 hour long PTS course every 2 years, hi-vis vests MUST be worn we have sit wardens, coss, look outs. during the course we look through the network rail PTS handbook. so it's just like the main line

*ahem* Yes.

 

[4SRKT]

I'm no fan of OTT H&S, but I remember the RPSI main line trips in the 1980s, which left a lot to be desired in this respect! One year No 171 came off the rails in the little-used run-round loop at Portrush, while being filmed by an excited Japanese film crew, presumably delighted that something out of the ordinary had happened (little did they know that this sort of thing wasn't out of the ordinary on NIR!). Hopefully the film was suitably edited before it went out otherwise some prize Ulster swearing from the sweating NIR and RPSI lads trying to lever 'Slieve Gullion' back onto the rails, including phrases such as 'F**king nips', would have gone out!

Another year we were being double headed by nos 171 and 4 down Ballyboyland Bank near Ballymoney, 171 leading, tender first, at 70 mph. The first coach was a lovely 12 wheel clerestory roofed wooden-bodied tri-composite (in which I was sitting in the brake compartment, right by the locos), and the track was old enough still to have the words 'Midland Railway' cast into the chairs. We hit an irregularity and the whole train lurched incredibly violently. 171 heeled over one way, and no 4 the other. I shudder to think what would have happened in a packed wooden coach had it all come off.

Another year the NIR guard got so spectacularly drunk at Portrush that he literally had to be carried back into his van. The train went back to Belfast regardless, effectively unguarded.

Another time no 85's tender jumped the rails between Ballymena and Antrim and tore up a couple of hundred yards of track. Fortunately in the only double track section of the Derry line (now singled: any connection I wonder?), so disruption was minimal. I understand that NIR were quite annoyed nonetheless.

My father was co-opted into working in the dining car on the Bangor Belle one year, where the call of 'Pints, lads?' went up every few minutes, and someone bought another round of cost-price Guinness. Most of the stewards were roaring drunk after two round trips from Belfast to Bangor.

It never ceases to amaze me that Northern Ireland has gone from the above, to the most regulated and H&S-obsessed society I've ever visited.

 

[Navviboy]

Great Stories 4SRKT. Some wouldn't believe them but some of the people I've known from 'across' and some of my friends who've been there have convinced me it was really like that. Thanks for sharing them.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Section P of the 1972 Rule Book would be as good as anywhere I guess.

Thanks OT. We are 'singing from the same hymn book'!

 

[Old Timer]

Back in the 80s in Co Limerick in Ireland there used to be a Silvermines to Foynes harbour stone train.

The job was book on and work the previous day's empties to Silvermines, load and work back and get relief by the afternoon men.

The afternoon men would then work the train to Foynes harbour and whilst it was unloaded, take a pnb, then back to Limerick, stable the empties, loco to depot and book off. A very nice job which meant an early finish most days.

I went down the Foynes branch from Limerick on a stone train this one day. Having run round and whilst waiting for the empties, the Driver said, "...now lad its time for a little refreshment.." so together with the Guard we headed off along the sidings to a little break in the fence, which lo and behold led to a small little pub.

"Afternoon, lads" said the publican "Three pints of the usual Dermot ? (the Driver).

"That will do nicely" said the Driver.

Of course each was required by tradition to buy a round, and after a good hour we all walked back slightly happier to the train, which by now was ready.

Off we went, back along the freight only line to Limerick, into the sidings, released the loco onto the depot and away home for tea !

Such "little things" went off on the small branch lines, but in fairness the same men on the mainline and on Passenger work would never touch a drop until they had arrived back and booked off, and I can give testament to having been to some serious sessions after working jobs back out from Dublin !

Experience over the years reveals that these little goings on were known about but tolerated because no one was ever unfit through drink, and never imbibed whilst on the mainline.

Another example of the Traction Inspector and Train Crew manager knowing "their men" and knowing when and where to turn a weather Nelson !

Of course all this has changed these days and with the inception of computerisation, the locomotive "knows" how a particular Driver drives by medium of being in permanent contact with the central database and should a Driver start to drive "outside" his profile, a message is printed in Control and to the Inspector.

Gone now are the days when you could sit in the seat and do some "real" driving, because any slight infraction will be reported by the on-board computer, and one can expect to meet a very nice Inspector at destination for tea and biscuits and a "little chat" !

 

[4SRKT]

Bloody big brother society. Is there any fun still to be had anywhere?

Once a friend and I had a cab pass from NIR for the day from Belfast to Dublin and back. Went in GM no 112, and spent the day on the DART and various small GM-hauled local services around Dublin, before heading back on 112 again.

There had been serious rioting in Portadown the day before we went. As the NIR Mk II set arrived at Dublin for our return journey there were several broken windows, which looked ominous. Everything was well as we arrived at Portadown. The inspector who was required to be on the footplate with us (we were only 15 at the time) lived in Portadown, and couldn't be arsed to ride into Belfast and back out, so got out there. Strictly speaking we should have gone to ride in the coaches, but he told us not to worry and stay where we were.

As the train was approaching Lurgan in the dark, we could see an enormous blaze ahead, and it was clear that a huge riot was in progress. The driver switched off the loco's headlights and began to accelerate further, getting up to 80+ mph (line speed on NIR was 70 mph max in those days). He then proceeded to crouch down behind the control panel, keeping his hand on the power handle, and advised us to crouch down as well. A thunder of bricks and bottles hit the train, one breaking the cabside window.

This was a fairly frightening experience! One has to ask though what the hell the inspector and driver thought they were doing allowing two juveniles to remain on the footplate as it passed through such a dangerous place. Goodness knows what trouble would have been caused had we been harmed. I'm also impressed that my parents, on holiday with us kids from England, allowed me to go on this jaunt, despite the fact that the train would be having to pass through somewhere where they must have known serious rioting had been going on the previous day.

 

[Fgw+xc+swtconn]

Thinking about heritage railways can be just as dangerous I suppose, you never know when they might test run trains. However heritage railways never really reach great speeds. But still. Safety First :P

 

[Tomnick]

There's not much that I can add to this thread (other than my thanks for the interesting snippets from the other side of the Irish Sea!) - I wouldn't have thought that Navviboy would be too surprised by any of my 'track safety' thoughts . I will add that there is (or was, at least) a requirement to sit a PTS exam (nothing too over the top) on the North Norfolk Rly - I can't remember how frequently that had to be 'refreshed' though. It seemed a fairly sensible idea to me though - it also keeps a record of competency, of sorts, to cover the company if anything should go wrong.

The last post is what prompted me to reply though. There's nothing more dangerous than a perception that you're safe as long as everything's below 25mph - indeed, there's usually a lot more to be aware of within station limits, where speeds might be lower - and we also need to remember that a lot of folk in preservation might not be quite so "railway aware". In any case, we can now run at up to 75mph under certain controlled conditions, which makes it even more important to have the right (but not too dreary!) systems in place...